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Should toggle button show its current state or the state to which it'll change? (2010)

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231–240 of 303 posts

Re: Should toggle button show its current state or the state to which it'll change? (2010)

#231

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree that checkboxes are perfect; but that's because I never try to fill forms on a smartphone. Native browser checkboxes are often unusable on smartphones; too small to hit with a thumb.

Properly designed, the tapping/clicking the text should also trigger the checkbox.

> Properly designed

It shouldn't need designing; but I have a suspicion that an unstyled HTML checkbox input doesn't behave like that.

Re: Should toggle button show its current state or the state to which it'll change? (2010)

#232

In defense of the ambiguity of digital toggles, I’d like to add that this is unsolved on most, if not all, physical light switches in homes and offices. Despite having existed for more than 50 years and most people are using multiple toggles a day with its labels, most people are unaware of the meaning of power symbol ( https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Power_symbol )

Because language works through association and analogy, you don't actually need to know the etymology of a word or symbol to use or understand it. Any English speaker can understand perfectly well the words manual, manufacture and manicure without ever reflecting on the fact that "manus" in latin means "hand". We clearly haven't needed to rename these words "handual", "handufacture" and "handicure" for these concepts…

> "We clearly haven't needed to rename these words "handual", "handufacture" and "handicure" for these concepts to be understood by people who aren't fluent in Latin."

"manual" is "by-hand".

"hand-made" is the literal meaning of "manufacture" (make by hand), if not the industrial meaning used today. From Old English hand-wrought, apparently: https://www.etymonline.com/search?q=handmade

Re: Should toggle button show its current state or the state to which it'll change? (2010)

#233

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Really? For me this always made intuitive sense reading it as one and zero, where zero would be off.

Most people haven't even heard of binary.

Silicate chemistry is second nature to us geochemists, so it's easy to forget that the average person probably only knows the formulas for olivine and one or two feldspars.

https://www.explainxkcd.com/wiki/index.php/2501:_Average_Fam...

See also this comment ( https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39344935 ) "it's pretty obvious" that computers use the opposite symbol than the name says.

Re: Should toggle button show its current state or the state to which it'll change? (2010)

#234

Any Tesla owner can relate to this, given the wide variety (read: no consistency, no standards) of toggle buttons the car's UI utilizes. For one, the HVAC. One button, showing temperature, which upon touched the system will react differently to depending on how you touch it and for how long. Touch it briefly, you get a little popup. Touch it slightly longer, and (hopefully, not guaranteed though) you get a bigger pan…

Actually Bluetooth works well in my 2023 Model Y, and I am very pleased because it did not in my old Audi and Ford. There has to be something seriously messed up with the Bluetooth spec if implementations are always so bad.

Re: Should toggle button show its current state or the state to which it'll change? (2010)

#235
post #50
post #6

This has been really frustrating to me lately with Microsoft Teams. If I'm in their app, the mute button is a microphone with a line through it (if mute is activated, i.e. if the mic is off). And the icon changes to a microphone without the slash over it to indicate that you are no longer muted. Makes sense. But if I join using the phone app on my phone, the same microphone with a line through it (that means you are…

Man... That's one button where you really DON'T want to be confused

I have a hardware button on my headset mic.

Wish there were a hardware button for "accept cookie" or "yes send me email offers" dialogs to conquer the not clearness.

Re: Should toggle button show its current state or the state to which it'll change? (2010)

#236

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Properly designed, the tapping/clicking the text should also trigger the checkbox.

> Properly designed It shouldn't need designing; but I have a suspicion that an unstyled HTML checkbox input doesn't behave like that.

It does as long as you mark the label as being for the checkbox or put the checkbox inside the label, which you are supposed to do.

Re: Should toggle button show its current state or the state to which it'll change? (2010)

#237
post #133
post #6

This has been really frustrating to me lately with Microsoft Teams. If I'm in their app, the mute button is a microphone with a line through it (if mute is activated, i.e. if the mic is off). And the icon changes to a microphone without the slash over it to indicate that you are no longer muted. Makes sense. But if I join using the phone app on my phone, the same microphone with a line through it (that means you are…

I think part of this confusion stems from the "default mic on" mindset, where "mic active" is assumed to be the default, and mute is a deviation from that state. We can trace this pattern back to the UI of phone conference systems, back through analog phones, back to the time of a literal wire connection between parties. Many/most audio mixers (in the context of live music and recording) and their digital brethren us…

With a good UI one should not know what is the default - the current state should be clearly indicated. Different backgrounds / colour shades is not a clear indication even if it looks nice this way.

Re: Should toggle button show its current state or the state to which it'll change? (2010)

#239
post #50
post #6

This has been really frustrating to me lately with Microsoft Teams. If I'm in their app, the mute button is a microphone with a line through it (if mute is activated, i.e. if the mic is off). And the icon changes to a microphone without the slash over it to indicate that you are no longer muted. Makes sense. But if I join using the phone app on my phone, the same microphone with a line through it (that means you are…

Man... That's one button where you really DON'T want to be confused

[dead]

Re: Should toggle button show its current state or the state to which it'll change? (2010)

#240
When I designed a lock/unlock button for my app, I added an arrow to indicate what action occurs when you click the button: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9MZmwkn-2rw&t=117s

For an unmute button, you could have a microphone with a line through it, and an arrowhead indicating that clicking the button will remove the line. Then the mute button could show a microphone with an arrowhead pointing inward from the corner, indicating that a line will be drawn.

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