Deno in 2023 • Hacker News Board

Re: Deno in 2023

#231

Post by agos » Thu, Feb 08, 2024, 10:34 AM UTC

brlewis wrote: post #181

agos wrote: post #105

I'd love to use Fresh but a framework for web development which calls itself v1.x and yet only supports Tailwind for styling purposes feels very immature. The fact that for the next iteration they are prioritizing view transitions and not CSS bundling is baffling.

Did you try cutting the tailwind stuff out of static/styles.css? Maybe it will already do what you want.

unfortunately they explicitly say they have no CSS solution other than plain files or Tailwind

Re: Deno in 2023

#232

Post by agos » Thu, Feb 08, 2024, 10:36 AM UTC

simlevesque wrote: post #144

agos wrote: post #105

I'd love to use Fresh but a framework for web development which calls itself v1.x and yet only supports Tailwind for styling purposes feels very immature. The fact that for the next iteration they are prioritizing view transitions and not CSS bundling is baffling.

Personally I'm happy with modern CSS using variables and nesting natively. The bundling step isn't necessary for the vast majority of usecase IMO.

all CSS-in-JS or styling solutions that allow for component scoping require some kind of bundling or otherwise interaction for the bundler. It's true most people don't need it, but most people don't need 90% of what Fresh offers, surely?

Re: Deno in 2023

#233

Post by agos » Thu, Feb 08, 2024, 10:38 AM UTC

skybrian wrote: post #137

agos wrote: post #105

I'd love to use Fresh but a framework for web development which calls itself v1.x and yet only supports Tailwind for styling purposes feels very immature. The fact that for the next iteration they are prioritizing view transitions and not CSS bundling is baffling.

Why does CSS bundling need to be integrated? Couldn't you generate a CSS file in whatever way you like?

if I want to use any modern styling solution (CSS modules, Vanilla Extract, Panda, any CSS-in-JS...) a bit of collaboration by the bundler is needed. I can generate CSS file(s) in any way I like but I would have zero integration with the templates

Re: Deno in 2023

#234

Post by ecmascript » Mon, Feb 12, 2024, 3:34 PM UTC

int_19h wrote: post #229

ecmascript wrote: post #209

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes but there is a reason for it being 100mb. You get a self-contained app where you can get to write in javascript. You don't have to spend 100x the time in order to get the same app working in Rust. If size is such a big deal, then don't use Deno, Node or Bun. My issue is that most people that are working in restricted environments would never touch javascript since it's not well suited for those kinds of environme…

Your argument seems to be that those 100 Mb include the necessary libraries. The problem with this assertion is that much richer runtimes don't require that much. For example, a .NET Core console app published as self-contained is ~65 Mb, and it comes with more libraries than Deno.

Well what is the size of .NET that I assume you need installed?

Re: Deno in 2023

#235

Post by int_19h » Thu, Feb 15, 2024, 8:41 PM UTC

ecmascript wrote: post #234

int_19h wrote: post #229

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your argument seems to be that those 100 Mb include the necessary libraries. The problem with this assertion is that much richer runtimes don't require that much. For example, a .NET Core console app published as self-contained is ~65 Mb, and it comes with more libraries than Deno.

Well what is the size of .NET that I assume you need installed?

You don't - that's the size of a completely self-contained binary, with .NET effectively baked in. A "hello world" .NET app that uses external runtime would be measured in kilobytes.