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Arrest made in SF killing of Bob Lee – alleged killer also worked in tech

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Re: Arrest made in SF killing of Bob Lee – alleged killer also worked in tech

#231

Post by vkou »

cemerick wrote: post #206
Vervious wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A ton of people care about property crime and I don't think you should look down on them. SF has 3-5x the property crime of most major cities in the United States. I imagine most violent crime is targeted (i.e. the victim is not a random person walking down the street), but property crime is scary because it can happen to the best of us, our friends and our family, in even the "safest" neighborhoods. We all know frie…

That's great; in general, people should be, and I'm not looking down on them for doing so. However, property crime is absolutely irrelevant when presented with the news of someone's murder, yet so many people here are quick to conflate them as somehow equivalent vis a vis personal safety, etc. (Sidenote: I personally don't understand anyone thinking that property crime is "scary". Your car is not your kid. Your walle…

A burglary is much scarier than someone stealing shit from your car, because someone invaded your living space in the latter. It's a much more serious invasion of your privacy than a broken window smash and grab.

The point I made in the sibling point stands, though. At 55th in the nation, SF does not have a high burglary rate. It has a high larceny (stealing from stores, cars, etc) rate.

Re: Arrest made in SF killing of Bob Lee – alleged killer also worked in tech

#232

Post by mhoad »

hermitdev wrote: post #201
cemerick wrote: post #172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The only thing I'm "championing" (just pointing out, really) is that certain populations seem to enjoy using anecdotal tragedy to promote their own quasi-apocalyptic worldview re: some American cities, despite all available data contradicting that worldview. I'm sure everyone here appreciates the update on your locale, and your own stories of property crime and/or non-criminal (yet perhaps unnerving?) personal intera…

It's not just this tragedy, it's any tragedy. Every time there's a mass shooting, people use it as a rallying cry for more gun control, rather than focusing on fixing the issues that actually led to the violence (usually severe mental health issues), as if people haven't used knives or vehicles to commit mass murder/violence. Never let a good tragedy go to waste, so the saying goes.

It’s actually nothing like that at all. People keep bringing it up because the US has the second highest number of gun related deaths of any country in the entire world.

Re: Arrest made in SF killing of Bob Lee – alleged killer also worked in tech

#233

Post by peter422 »

Swizec wrote: post #33
cemerick wrote: post #2

This news really highlights the confirmation bias that was in full bloom throughout the "discourse" around the initial reports of Lee's murder (e.g. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35448899 ). Everyone is so quick to jump on negative news about the rare violent crime in e.g. SF thanks to feelings about petty property crime that it's obviously impossible to have any kind of fact-based dialogue about policy. Worth…

The argument I made to all my friends in this debate (but not publicly) was along the lines of “tech exec found dead at 2:30am near his home in an upscale neighborhood with zero night-time activity … that doesn’t sound random” My guess was drug deal gone wrong. But tech deal gone wrong makes sense too, I guess. edit: my drug guess was before the person was named, not implying anything, just know drugs are a popular h…

It’s an upscale building but I wouldn’t call it an upscale neighborhood, especially at night. It’s only a couple blocks from the bay bridge overpass and the overpass attracted some non-upscale activity.

At the same time though I’ve spent many late nights in the area and never had any negative encounters.

Re: Arrest made in SF killing of Bob Lee – alleged killer also worked in tech

#234

Post by hn_throwaway_99 »

rajup wrote: post #199
hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The thing that's so weird about that confirmation bias is that some folks held these inconsistent views even within a single HN comment . There was a comment that was on that initial thread where the commenter said that they heard from "very well placed sources in the US Intelligence community this is probably a hit", and the commenter still went on to blame San Francisco for being a "crime ridden shithole". I respon…

I don’t understand, is it that hard for both to be true?

That's not what the comment I was replying to was saying. It's possible for both to be true, but it's definitely cognitive dissonance to on one hand think "it was a hit" and then at the same time blame the general crime problems of San Francisco for Bob Lee's death.

That's what a lot of the replies here seem to be missing. Sure, I think SF has a pretty bad crime problem that needs to be addressed. What deserves opprobrium is all the tech elite who immediately spouted on Twitter and elsewhere that the government of SF had "blood on their hands", again specifically blaming SF government and SF's overall crime environment for Bob Lee's death.

Re: Arrest made in SF killing of Bob Lee – alleged killer also worked in tech

#235

Post by etc-hosts »

vimax wrote: post #37
f38zf5vdt wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As soon as I saw the reported murder I figured it was a business partner who felt scorned, but then HN narrative continued for a full week about the lack of safety in SF. While things might be bad, random murders by strangers are still a rarity compared to targeted killings.

I find it strange that nobody is mentioning the Hindenburg Research report against Square that came out a week before the stabbing, and the fact that there’s likely a fraud investigation underway. https://hindenburgresearch.com/block/

Didn't Lee leave Square a long time ago?

Re: Arrest made in SF killing of Bob Lee – alleged killer also worked in tech

#236

Post by bigtex88 »

cemerick wrote: post #206
Vervious wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A ton of people care about property crime and I don't think you should look down on them. SF has 3-5x the property crime of most major cities in the United States. I imagine most violent crime is targeted (i.e. the victim is not a random person walking down the street), but property crime is scary because it can happen to the best of us, our friends and our family, in even the "safest" neighborhoods. We all know frie…

That's great; in general, people should be, and I'm not looking down on them for doing so. However, property crime is absolutely irrelevant when presented with the news of someone's murder, yet so many people here are quick to conflate them as somehow equivalent vis a vis personal safety, etc. (Sidenote: I personally don't understand anyone thinking that property crime is "scary". Your car is not your kid. Your walle…

[flagged]

Re: Arrest made in SF killing of Bob Lee – alleged killer also worked in tech

#237

Post by yardie »

IndoorPatio wrote: post #99
yardie wrote: post #25

Watch how fast this falls out of the news cycle because it doesn’t align with America’s view of San Francisco. So far I’ve heard it was: a homeless person, a junkie, mentally ill, violent criminal common to San Francisco. Part of me felt this was personal. A stabbing you have to get fairly close. Bob Lee could know his killer. And I don’t know him well enough to know who he hung out with.

Statistically, it was always more likely someone he knew.

If you saw last weeks comments you would think it was a homeless, drug crazed, criminal. One of the tops comments stated, with authority, it was someone homeless. And how the cops were not going to do anything about it.

Re: Arrest made in SF killing of Bob Lee – alleged killer also worked in tech

#238

Post by rising-sky »

> San Francisco is home to much in the way of visible public misery, unnerving street behavior and overt drug-use. Its property crime rate has long been high, and the police clearance rate for property crimes has long been minimal. But the city’s violent crime rate is at a near-historic low and is lower than that in most mid-to-large-sized cities.

Re: Arrest made in SF killing of Bob Lee – alleged killer also worked in tech

#239

Post by mixmastamyk »

cemerick wrote: post #84
nemo44x wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I wonder how likely it is that the same population will comment here to say, "I was wrong"? Sure, people were wrong in their assumption that the murder was random. At least that's how it looks now. We haven't heard the suspects side, but.... But wrong that SF has become a dangerous and mismanaged city? Murder isn't the only violent crime and a lot of crime goes unreported. People don't feel safe walking around and…

People see homelessness and open drug use and petty property crime, filter it through their ideological lens, and amplify that into feeling that they are themselves somehow less safe. You can assert that that is rational, but it's as connected to reality as someone feeling afraid when e.g. a black person is walking behind them. Saying stuff like "a lot of [violent] crime goes unreported" is straight up fanciful think…

Very privileged take there. My wife justifiably feels unsafe in our similar city:

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35531439

In that comment I didn’t even get to the new stories about a brick being thrown, creeps following her, or last night’s gun falling out of the pants of a meth head at the bus stop. I would feel unsafe as well, not like I’m immune to bullets.

Minimizing this stuff just because it was mentioned in the wrong thread is ignoring real problems. Two things can be true at once.

Re: Arrest made in SF killing of Bob Lee – alleged killer also worked in tech

#240

Post by jefftk »

Aeolun wrote: post #221
reddog wrote: post #143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> including current faves Austin and Miami Austin has 2.57 murders and nonnegligent manslaughters per 100K. Same year, SF has 6.35 per 100K. So SF is twice as bad as Austin. Your right about Miami though. But 6.35 isn't bad. The murder rate in St Louis (for comparision to the US city with the worst) is 66.07 per 100K. And Colima Mexico (worst in the world maybe) is 182 murders per 100K. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/…

For comparison, Japan has 0.3, the UK has 1.1 and France has 1.3. I know they’re in the linked table, just wanted to mention that even the best city in the US is still relatively bad.

> even the best city in the US is still relatively bad

Your parent didn't mention the "best city in the US" though? Per the linked table it seems to be Irvine CA at 0.72 per 100k, which would be below average in the UK or France.

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