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SQLite the only database you will ever need in most cases (2021)

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Re: SQLite the only database you will ever need in most cases (2021)

#231

Post by jmplng »

bogwog wrote: post #86
irskep wrote: post #29

This sentiment pops up regularly on HN, and I've seen at least one article per month for the past few months, but the trouble is, none of them seem to help you actually deploy it. They assume you're comfortable spinning up public web servers. If you want to use a PaaS to deploy an app, because you don't want to spend your time learning to be a sysadmin, then all the tutorials are going to put you on the Postgres path…

> I'm an application developer and I do not want to become a release engineer. I resent even having to learn Docker. :-) Sorry, but that's a terrible attitude to have. You don't need to be a full-blown sysadmin to know how to do basic deployments, and learning these things will make you a better developer.

Can’t even make 1 joke without attracting the ire of the supersmarts.

Re: SQLite the only database you will ever need in most cases (2021)

#232

Post by nikita »

hamandcheese wrote: post #191
canadiantim wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Note with Neon now you don't need to spend $15+/mo for Postgres because they separate compute from storage. So compute can scale down to 0 and storage is cheap.

Neon only recently entered public preview and I am unable to find any pricing information.

Launching on mar 15th

Re: SQLite the only database you will ever need in most cases (2021)

#233

Post by deathclassic »

xenator wrote: post #84
deathclassic wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

SQLite has other advantages over larger db systems. - By far easiest db to install. - Really go to learn database fundamentals with. If you have no experience with databases and are just starting out programming, PG is going to steepen the learning curve substantially.

> By far easiest db to install. The difference between installation for sqlite and postgres is the difference between typing `apt install sqlite3` and `apt install postgres`. The actual learning curve for sqlite is more complex because picking random sql queries on the internet will end in misunderstanding in underlying types in sqlite and broken data. Postgres tools ecosystem is much more expressive, because more pe…

Ever try to install postgres on windows? On a school or work computer you may or may not have admin access on? That's the kind of enviroment a lot of people (including myself) started in. In that sort of enviroment, it's easier to run sqlite3.exe database.db. And that's the kind of enviroment a lot of people (myself included) got started in databases.

Re: SQLite the only database you will ever need in most cases (2021)

#234

Post by deathclassic »

giobox wrote: post #97
xenator wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> By far easiest db to install. The difference between installation for sqlite and postgres is the difference between typing `apt install sqlite3` and `apt install postgres`. The actual learning curve for sqlite is more complex because picking random sql queries on the internet will end in misunderstanding in underlying types in sqlite and broken data. Postgres tools ecosystem is much more expressive, because more pe…

I'd go further and just point out the obvious - all DBs have incredibly well supported container run options in 2023, that mean you don't have to install the DB at all. I know of no DB that cannot be easily learned or deployed this way - even Microsoft SQLServer has a Linux image these days. Since the advent of containers for running software, deploying any DB software is largely as easy as any other with a one line…

Yeah docker is great and I've done the exact same as you for a few years. But, I don't think I even knew what a docker container was until 2018, and again, as an intern or college kid with a school/work windows workstation telling them to run it in a container is a non starter.

Re: SQLite the only database you will ever need in most cases (2021)

#235

Post by maxthegeek1 »

chillfox wrote: post #141
sanderjd wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's not a good option for what you appear to want. Ok but the article you're replying in the comments to says "SQLite is all you need for nearly everything", and what the comment you're replying to is describing is, to use their very apt word choice, entirely ordinary . So how do we square this circle of somebody being told both "SQLite is all you need for everything" and "it is not a good option for your totally…

Most things don't need zero downtime deployment. Now it's nice to have and might be an interesting technical challenge to solve, but it's usually not strictly needed. edit: when I worked as a sysadmin we would have to schedule outages for updating apps that were designed for zero downtime anyways because those were the processes of the organisation.

What? I've never worked for a company that would tolerate downtime during deployments. Downtime is ok for personal projects, but not for most business applications.

Re: SQLite the only database you will ever need in most cases (2021)

#236

Post by swlkr »

irskep wrote: post #29

This sentiment pops up regularly on HN, and I've seen at least one article per month for the past few months, but the trouble is, none of them seem to help you actually deploy it. They assume you're comfortable spinning up public web servers. If you want to use a PaaS to deploy an app, because you don't want to spend your time learning to be a sysadmin, then all the tutorials are going to put you on the Postgres path…

I've used dokku to great effect.

SSHing into a new linux VPS can be intimidating but there a few good digital ocean tutorials that'll take you from new VPS to dokku and once you're there it's very much a PaaS

Re: SQLite the only database you will ever need in most cases (2021)

#237

Post by paranoidrobot »

danielmarkbruce wrote: post #56
paranoidrobot wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Just point it a file" skips all the bits you need for a production system. How do you back it up, replicate it, handle two different processes/containers/servers wanting to access the same data. Using a PAAS solution for a database, you get all that functionality.

That's why "most cases". If you are trying to replicate or make available to a bunch of machines or similar - it's likely the wrong thing (although there are tools to do this, I've never used them). If you are just trying to back it up there is a pretty simple back up command.

I think we disagree on the "most cases" aspect that

For most of the things I touch, having a single-point-of-failure data store is typically not acceptable for production environments, except perhaps caching.

Re: SQLite the only database you will ever need in most cases (2021)

#238

Post by satoru42 »

irskep wrote: post #29

This sentiment pops up regularly on HN, and I've seen at least one article per month for the past few months, but the trouble is, none of them seem to help you actually deploy it. They assume you're comfortable spinning up public web servers. If you want to use a PaaS to deploy an app, because you don't want to spend your time learning to be a sysadmin, then all the tutorials are going to put you on the Postgres path…

You didn't add all points to Strength so you could only be a "application developer", did you?

Re: SQLite the only database you will ever need in most cases (2021)

#239

Post by di456 »

acuozzo wrote: post #68
deathclassic wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Also valid. I just use ISO8601 and bite the bullet because storage is cheap.

FWIW, storage is cheap, but caches are not.

It's cheap if the cache is also on SQLite. Might not even need a separate db for some use cases.

This runs on python and works with several backends including SQLite. https://requests-cache.readthedocs.io/en/stable/

Re: SQLite the only database you will ever need in most cases (2021)

#240

Post by sanderjd »

cldellow wrote: post #174
sanderjd wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Migrations are just writes It is possible to change the schema of a SQLite db as "just a write"?

Yes. SQLite supports transactional DDL.

Thanks! The article someone posted in another comment in this thread seemed a lot more complicated than that.
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