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Show HN: Inflation-adjusted stock charts – Total Real Returns

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Re: Show HN: Inflation-adjusted stock charts – Total Real Returns

#231

Post by ARandomerDude »

mechanical_bear wrote: post #163
jl2718 wrote: post #127

This period has been very special because of the 401k, which is itself part of the growth story of the corporate legal structure. I think this is coming to an end. Corporate boards and officers no longer represent the best long-term interests of the companies and shareholders they represent. It’s also a very precarious legal status as an arbitrary judicial ruling can make or break a company. Finally, and perhaps most…

I liked your explanation but you undermine your write up by discussing something you clearly have no business discussing: >> People tithe and sacrifice to their church for a promise of rewards in the afterlife. This is a fundamental misunderstanding of tithing and I’m not going to get into that at the moment, but it makes me consider if you are discussing other things in your write up that you don’t have experience w…

>> People tithe and sacrifice to their church for a promise of rewards in the afterlife.

> This is a fundamental misunderstanding of tithing and I’m not going to get into that at the moment...

I'll explain some from a fairly classic Protestant perspective. This was literally what started the Protestant Reformation. Martin Luther was horrified that the Church was essentially attempting to sell salvation via indulgences. He pointed out that the Bible teaches that salvation is completely free because Christ already paid for all our sins with his blood.

I agree with Luther and I tithe out of pure gratitude. I think the Church belongs to Jesus and so do I because he's kind and gracious.

All the money in the world can't buy my salvation, or even the smallest part of it. It's worthless to God, who made heaven and earth and all that is in them.

Re: Show HN: Inflation-adjusted stock charts – Total Real Returns

#232

Post by FooBarWidget »

sicp-enjoyer wrote: post #209
FooBarWidget wrote: post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can rent, but that's money wasted. The longer you rent, the longer you didn't invest. Also rents are higher than mortgage payments, making it worse.

> that's money wasted Just wait until you see how much is wasted in a 30 year loan. These decisions often comes down to life style.

Yes you pay interest. But how is that any worse than the mortgage?

Re: Show HN: Inflation-adjusted stock charts – Total Real Returns

#233

Post by FooBarWidget »

GoldenStake wrote: post #174
FooBarWidget wrote: post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can rent, but that's money wasted. The longer you rent, the longer you didn't invest. Also rents are higher than mortgage payments, making it worse.

But are rents higher than the mortgage + insurance + maintenance + lack of liquidity + the potential home value changes. If the expectations is that the home value are dropping, the math seems pretty simple. But in a different financial environment, maybe a few years from now, your expectations might be different and the math works out differently

Yes, in Netherlands, rents are higher than mortgage + insurance + maintenance + taxes - tax breaks. That's why everyone wants a house.

A bit odd that you talk about liquidity. The house itself isn't liquid, but you finance it so you don't need a huge liquidity up front. Also, rents paid are no longer liquid to you either.

A mortgage ends one day. Rents do not.

House prices increase 20% year on year in Amsterdam. Even during the 2008 financial crisis did they barely drop in value.

Re: Show HN: Inflation-adjusted stock charts – Total Real Returns

#234

Post by FooBarWidget »

arghnoname wrote: post #190
FooBarWidget wrote: post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can rent, but that's money wasted. The longer you rent, the longer you didn't invest. Also rents are higher than mortgage payments, making it worse.

If rent really is lower than the mortgage payment (assuming the alternative return on the downpayment is taken into account, etc) for an equivalent property, then buying is pretty reasonable in most circumstances. I'm observing rents way, way below mortgages, but it's very location dependent. When making decisions about where to put my money, I stopped worrying about what other people are going to do and are doing, w…

In the Netherlands, there are no places where rents are below mortgages. Unless you apply for social housing, but that requires you to be below a certain income threshold, which means that you couldn't have bought a house anyway. Social housing also have 20 years waiting list.

Re: Show HN: Inflation-adjusted stock charts – Total Real Returns

#235

Post by yellowapple »

sytelus wrote: post #216
jl2718 wrote: post #168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Actually I'm heartened to see people defending religion on HN. Tithing to a church you truly belong to is probably a better use of your money, even purely by personal benefit, than tithing Wall Street. I hope that I've introduced some of those ideas in the text by making a negative comparison to the church. But yes; it was sloppy and possibly interpreted as disparaging of religious practice itself, so for that I apol…

You might be even more heartened to know that one of the top most and highly respected computer scientist, Donald Knuth, is ardently religious. The contrast between his works that is extraordinarily precisely well reasoned after decades of thinking and his complete submission to ancient religion where logical reasoning is not all that welcome, is absolutely a thing to behold. It makes me marvel at complexity and perh…

The simpler explanation would be that spirituality is not as mutually exclusive with logic and reason as one might have been led to believe.

Re: Show HN: Inflation-adjusted stock charts – Total Real Returns

#236

Post by WalterBright »

jl2718 wrote: post #127

This period has been very special because of the 401k, which is itself part of the growth story of the corporate legal structure. I think this is coming to an end. Corporate boards and officers no longer represent the best long-term interests of the companies and shareholders they represent. It’s also a very precarious legal status as an arbitrary judicial ruling can make or break a company. Finally, and perhaps most…

> cash flows from working class into the stock market will eventually hit equilibrium with capital extraction from the owner class

What? The working class becomes owners when they buy shares.

Re: Show HN: Inflation-adjusted stock charts – Total Real Returns

#237

Post by [deleted] »

mechanical_bear wrote: post #163
jl2718 wrote: post #127

This period has been very special because of the 401k, which is itself part of the growth story of the corporate legal structure. I think this is coming to an end. Corporate boards and officers no longer represent the best long-term interests of the companies and shareholders they represent. It’s also a very precarious legal status as an arbitrary judicial ruling can make or break a company. Finally, and perhaps most…

I liked your explanation but you undermine your write up by discussing something you clearly have no business discussing: >> People tithe and sacrifice to their church for a promise of rewards in the afterlife. This is a fundamental misunderstanding of tithing and I’m not going to get into that at the moment, but it makes me consider if you are discussing other things in your write up that you don’t have experience w…

[deleted]

Re: Show HN: Inflation-adjusted stock charts – Total Real Returns

#238

Post by stewbrew »

mechanical_bear wrote: post #163
jl2718 wrote: post #127

This period has been very special because of the 401k, which is itself part of the growth story of the corporate legal structure. I think this is coming to an end. Corporate boards and officers no longer represent the best long-term interests of the companies and shareholders they represent. It’s also a very precarious legal status as an arbitrary judicial ruling can make or break a company. Finally, and perhaps most…

I liked your explanation but you undermine your write up by discussing something you clearly have no business discussing: >> People tithe and sacrifice to their church for a promise of rewards in the afterlife. This is a fundamental misunderstanding of tithing and I’m not going to get into that at the moment, but it makes me consider if you are discussing other things in your write up that you don’t have experience w…

This probably is a reference to Max Weber's "Protestant work ethic" - a classic and interesting read.

Re: Show HN: Inflation-adjusted stock charts – Total Real Returns

#239

Post by ywain »

TekMol wrote: post #7

I tried to look at QQQ to see the performance of the Nasdaq 100 with dividends reinvested: https://www.tradingview.com/chart/?symbol=NASDAQ%3AQQQ But the difference is so small. Nasdaq 100 even performing better. Does QQQ pay out dividends or does the management fee eat up so much that the dividends get cancelled out? Since the development is so similar to the index, I guess they pay dividends. How can one see the Na…

QQQ does pay quarterly dividends.

Re: Show HN: Inflation-adjusted stock charts – Total Real Returns

#240

Post by itronitron »

jl2718 wrote: post #127

This period has been very special because of the 401k, which is itself part of the growth story of the corporate legal structure. I think this is coming to an end. Corporate boards and officers no longer represent the best long-term interests of the companies and shareholders they represent. It’s also a very precarious legal status as an arbitrary judicial ruling can make or break a company. Finally, and perhaps most…

>> They may seek hyper-volatility, or government bond shelters, but will generally avoid the assets on the working class tax treadmill.

0. https://finance.yahoo.com/news/inverse-tesla-bet-among-first...

1. https://www.nasdaq.com/articles/the-sec-approves-single-stoc...

2. https://www.sec.gov/news/statement/crenshaw-single-stock-etf...

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