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How did Tropicana lose $30M in a packaging redesign?

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Re: How did Tropicana lose $30M in a packaging redesign?

#231

Post by jan_Inkepa »

codys wrote: post #96
jan_Inkepa wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wonder if some of the "why" isn't the general turn against straws in the current zeitgeist.

The article indicates the re-design in question was "launched" in January 2008. This is the date where planning the redesign began. Another article [1] indicates that the new design was deployed on January 8th, 2009, and Tropicana announced a return to the old design on February 23rd, 2009. A quick search shows an article [2] indicating around 2018 was when the panic around plastic straws began (with, for example, Se…

Well that shows how well I read the original article. Thanks for the correction.

Re: How did Tropicana lose $30M in a packaging redesign?

#232

Post by bin_bash »

subpixel wrote: post #228
bin_bash wrote: post #201

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Juice in general just seems terribly unhealthy in 2022. I enjoy it as a treat now and again but think of it more like a dessert rather than a part of my daily breakfast routine.

It's just one of those weird things that people, especially Americans, have been conditioned to think is wholesome. After some time not drinking it, orange juice is almost sickeningly sweet to me.

traditionally yeah (my dad has orange juice every morning) but I don't think it's seen that way anymore for younger generations for most people

Re: How did Tropicana lose $30M in a packaging redesign?

#233

Post by Jarmsy »

johnday wrote: post #227
nkurz wrote: post #213

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I don't buy orange juice anymore because I don't know what "Made from Real Oranges*" means anymore. Don't be silly --- it means you are buying juice from oranges that has been stripped of all flavor, stored in tankers for a year or two, and then reconstituted by adding "flavor packs" built by recombining the chemicals found in different oranges. Pretending this isn't clear to consumers is just anti-progress. Along…

I'm not sure if you're being sarcastic, but I really don't think this is "clear to consumers".

They're definitely being sarcastic

Re: How did Tropicana lose $30M in a packaging redesign?

#234

Post by warent »

gwbas1c wrote: post #223

The article totally misses the point of why the rebrand failed. I used to drink Tropicana Grovestand all the time in the 2000s. One day, I showed up at the grocery store, and a bunch of people were in front of the Tropicana rack, looking confused. I tried to find "Grovestand," but I couldn't. There were tons of identical bottles to choose from. Eventually, after staring at the bottles for a few minutes, I saw tiny te…

The article reads to me that this is the point they were getting at.

> Tropicana’s orange juice became generic

They genericized something which was uniquely branded. To some people it's the orange and straw, to others it's Grovestand, etc.

Re: How did Tropicana lose $30M in a packaging redesign?

#235

Post by henvic »

woodruffw wrote: post #27
henvic wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> buying the liquid form means paying for the shipping and space cost of the water. Buying frozen solid means cleaning up your mixer. I also bet it's easier to lose some fiber. Either way, the taste isn't the same as freshly made juice. I'm from Brazil and loved tangerine/mandarin juice since when I was a kid. Now I've moved to the Netherlands and love it even more. How come, you may ask? In Brazil, we usually find t…

> Buying frozen solid means cleaning up your mixer. I also bet it's easier to lose some fiber. Maybe I'm doing it wrong, but I've always just put the concentrate brick (cylinder?) into a pitcher, filled it up with the right amount of water, and mixed it until fully melted. It's no worse to clean up than anything else in a pitcher would be. I agree completely about fresh-squeezed juices, by the way. I do my own juices…

Not wrong at all, this is a great idea (as long as it mixes well).

I've resorted to something similar when making my tangerine juice: I put some water, ice, and a sugar cane "square" in the jar or cups first, and then go to squeeze the juice. By the time I'm over making lunch or dinner, the juice is ready without having to use a spoon to mix it.

Re: How did Tropicana lose $30M in a packaging redesign?

#236

Post by [deleted] »

xattt wrote: post #206
ineedasername wrote: post #199

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would be suspicious of any orange juice where the company feels the need to stipulate "real orange juice". What the heck else would it be made of? Reminds me of "ice cream" which, in a lot of cases, is not. Mixed in the ice cream section next to identical looking cartons of different flavors Breuer's is a big culprit) are things that say "whipped dairy dessert" in the place that others say "ice cream".

I wonder if the same health equivalency applies to jam and it’s analogues. There’s double-fruit jam that doesn’t identify as jam, but as a fruit spread. It seems like a healthier choice, due to higher bulk of fruit purée versus standard jam on toast (which I assume has more sugar).

[deleted]

Re: How did Tropicana lose $30M in a packaging redesign?

#237

Post by Spooky23 »

eps wrote: post #153
numair wrote: post #133

I looked at the title, opened the link, searched for “Peter Arnell,” got zero results, and knew the article was total garbage. https://www.cbsnews.com/news/arnells-explanation-of-failed-t... I had a close friend who worked on a project where they brought this guy in. Charged $1m a month and invoiced his jet fuel to the company, if I remember correctly. Now you know where the $30M actually went. The article is an exam…

The article also praises the design of the new lid, which was - surprise - one of the most derided elements of the redesign in professional product design comminity. The idea was that you'd feel like squeezing an orange when opening the carton. In reality, you'd be squeezing that nipple to get to your OJ. Worked out as expected.

Sometimes design professionals are more aligned with fashion than the customer.

Customers love little touches like that. Kids will grab the bottle and be delighted by it, etc.

Re: How did Tropicana lose $30M in a packaging redesign?

#238

Post by ziml77 »

bin_bash wrote: post #201
treyfitty wrote: post #197

Carton design, or not, I don't buy orange juice anymore because I don't know what "Made from Real Oranges*" means anymore. Over time, I came to learn that straightforward claims like these are engineered to deceive. Tropicana could use 100% real oranges, and I still wouldn't believe them. I could inspect the ingredients, and even then, it's dubious- companies have found ways to circumvent the rules there too. Instead…

Juice in general just seems terribly unhealthy in 2022. I enjoy it as a treat now and again but think of it more like a dessert rather than a part of my daily breakfast routine.

It seemed terribly unhealthy back in 2012 too. You get all the sugar and none of the fiber. But many people have this weird idea about "natural" being healthy or that being derived from something healthy means it's still healthy. If we called them processed or refined fruit drinks, I'd bet you'd find people become averse to fruit juice.

Re: How did Tropicana lose $30M in a packaging redesign?

#239

Post by sebastien_bois »

ineedasername wrote: post #199
treyfitty wrote: post #197

Carton design, or not, I don't buy orange juice anymore because I don't know what "Made from Real Oranges*" means anymore. Over time, I came to learn that straightforward claims like these are engineered to deceive. Tropicana could use 100% real oranges, and I still wouldn't believe them. I could inspect the ingredients, and even then, it's dubious- companies have found ways to circumvent the rules there too. Instead…

I would be suspicious of any orange juice where the company feels the need to stipulate "real orange juice". What the heck else would it be made of? Reminds me of "ice cream" which, in a lot of cases, is not. Mixed in the ice cream section next to identical looking cartons of different flavors Breuer's is a big culprit) are things that say "whipped dairy dessert" in the place that others say "ice cream".

>I would be suspicious of any orange juice where the company feels the need to stipulate "real orange juice". What the heck else would it be made of?

You're right to be suspicious; most juices are not just "freshly squeezed" from a fruit - they're processed.

Part of the "process" is to actually extract the sweetest part of the juice and leave the rest behind (so way more sugary than "natural") and some will actually contain some other forms of filler (like non-orange based oils).

It's a lot like McNuggets or Subway chicken sandwiches - they're made "from real chicken" but with all of added the salt and fillers, you end up wondering exactly how much of it is actual chicken.

One of the best way to evaluate "real juice" is by how long it'll last before it expires (either shelf life or after opening) - more than a few days will indicate there's extra preservatives, etc. in it.

Re: How did Tropicana lose $30M in a packaging redesign?

#240

Post by runlevel1 »

numair wrote: post #133

I looked at the title, opened the link, searched for “Peter Arnell,” got zero results, and knew the article was total garbage. https://www.cbsnews.com/news/arnells-explanation-of-failed-t... I had a close friend who worked on a project where they brought this guy in. Charged $1m a month and invoiced his jet fuel to the company, if I remember correctly. Now you know where the $30M actually went. The article is an exam…

Here's Arnell Group's explanation of their Pepsi Logo redesign:

https://www.goldennumber.net/wp-content/uploads/pepsi-arnell...

While I disagree about the heat map in the article being pseudoscience, I agree that Arnell's "design thinking" totally is.

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