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What does “shitty job” mean in the low-skill, low-pay world?

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Re: What does “shitty job” mean in the low-skill, low-pay world?

#231

Post by nameisname »

Spivak wrote: post #197
pc86 wrote: post #163

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Do people think they’re entitled to private apartments in the most expensive cities in the world? Yes, they do. Read any thread on a vaguely left-leaning subreddit that even starts approaching discussions of renting, or landlords, or landlord-tenant relations, and you'll get flooded with comments so detached from reality it will stun you.

If you can’t afford to live in the city where you work then it’s pretty much the definition of “not a living wage.” Like are we really at the point where we’re totally fine with people commuting an hour one way every workday to a shitty minimum wage job instead of just building affordable modest housing reserved for people working in the city.

It's not the wage that needs to change it would be the prices of housing in the city. This can't change because it's not determined by some governing body. It's called gentrification. It's currently happening to me. I could not afford to buy my house now and I just bought it a few years ago. Of course there still needs to be staff in the area working retail etc. but I haven't seen anyone over 25 in a store near me for over a year.

Re: What does “shitty job” mean in the low-skill, low-pay world?

#232

Post by nemo44x »

permalac wrote: post #46
woodruffw wrote: post #30

This was a great read. I think the true value of money is one of HN's biggest bubbles: the average person on here (but not all of us!) jumped right from their undergraduate career to making a six-figure salary in a city with lavish public amenities (by American standards). It's very easy to forget that the average American salary is less than half of that, and even that hides the number of people living well below th…

Sometimes I forget that those 6 figure jobs require one living in US, then I remember and I'm a bit happier with my not 6 figures job.

If you’re smart it’s a much better deal to live in the USA. It’s why you see so many Europeans move here and not the other way around.

Europe is better if you’re dumb as there are better social systems. You can just exist more easily there.

Re: What does “shitty job” mean in the low-skill, low-pay world?

#234

Post by heroicdanger »

alexfromapex wrote: post #31

I think this article starts to touch on a topic area I don't hear much about but am extremely frustrated by: how modern work for a lot of jobs has become de facto indentured servitude. In the "When They Know They've Got You" section, they mention the real challenges of not being able to obtain a lawyer if things truly aren't fair. The average worker can't afford anything without taking on debt. Insurance is a scam in…

No post body was provided.

Re: What does “shitty job” mean in the low-skill, low-pay world?

#235

Post by maxerickson »

kanwisher wrote: post #140
dumpsterlid wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quoted post unavailable.

When I was mid 20s, I was making six figures in tech and had to share an apartment. I can't see why minimum wage workers wouldn't also

I mean, it happens, but there's room to discuss whether it is a fact of the universe or partly an outcome of chosen policies.

Re: What does “shitty job” mean in the low-skill, low-pay world?

#236

Post by seibelj »

hamiltonians wrote: post #95
thenerdhead wrote: post #40

I had a "shitty job" as a high schooler. I was a janitor at a public elementary school where I'd have to clean the unspeakable things that kids do in the bathrooms and classrooms. While it was a literal "shitty" job, anyone could do it for the $10/hr. I saw that it was a dead-end though. I would be looking at my twenty-something year old boss and wanting much more for myself than the fun job he had. I saw that I coul…

this is why i think teen summer jobs squander potential. young adults should be learning skills instead of doing shitty jobs, although someone has to do that work.

I could not possibly disagree harder. I started working in 8th grade and worked through high school and college. As my friends partied in college I remembered those shitty jobs and why I was in college, it was 100% a motivator for me to work very hard.

My son is treated like a prince but he’s going to scoop ice cream and sell pizza slices or he isn’t getting an iota of help from me. You don’t understand the world unless you work those jobs.

Re: What does “shitty job” mean in the low-skill, low-pay world?

#237

Post by EVa5I7bHFq9mnYK »

protomyth wrote: post #88

I will say that I would rather pick cans in the ditches (did that as a kid in summer) or dig ditches than do a fast food / customer service job like my brother in his youth. There seems to be a large concentration of entitled a-holes in a food service line or at a store. My one brush with customer service was being the score board kid at a softball tournament. Drunk middle aged softball players cannot count. I do say…

Unfortunately, if you pick cans, you quite probably will have an a-hole boss, and, unlike an a-hole customer, she will not go anywhere.

Re: What does “shitty job” mean in the low-skill, low-pay world?

#238

Post by unapproved4lyfe »

dr_kiszonka wrote: post #81
k__ wrote: post #4

I always have to think about this when people say "buy more at small businesses!" Most small businesse owners I met were just as shitty as the ones of big businesses, they just weren't as smart as them.

Very tangentially, most academics I have met think of themselves as democrat socialists, but run their labs like authoritarian libertarians (sounds a bit like an oxymoron, I know).

It is an oxymoron, you're thinking of a military style. It's solidly authoritarian, but commanders in the field have freedom to make certain decisions independently in recognition of the limits of pure top-down command. That freedom is not borne of e.g. recognition of the rights of man as it is in a libertarian state.

Re: What does “shitty job” mean in the low-skill, low-pay world?

#239

Post by Bukhmanizer »

At 22, right out of college, I probably would have done basically anything to get a $40k a year job. I applied literally everywhere I could. Still, after 8 months and thousands of applications, I was working for $13.50/hr as a cook.

This forced me to rethink my strategy, and I decided to take a program in CS, which changed everything for me.

I often think about how my life would have been if I had got one of those jobs that I applied for. Most were low level admin work for corporations with terrible reputations. Likely I wouldn’t have been able to go back to school (working in a kitchen from 5pm-1am means you can take classes in the day). I would have made just enough to live, but I couldn’t have advanced past a certain point. My friends who got these jobs either left them to go back to school, or got cost-of-living wage increases and are now “senior “ people.

It’s a trap. One that I was set and willing to fall in, had I been slightly more competent.

Re: What does “shitty job” mean in the low-skill, low-pay world?

#240

Post by jltsiren »

mrjangles wrote: post #107
pphysch wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

US and more socialist EU countries may have similar CPIs, but when we get to talking about education, rent, healthcare, transportation, etc the differences can be stark. Yes, people in US earn more and get taxed less. But they also spend a lot, lot more on necessities via shadowy cost structures like student loans and insurance and >$1,000 ambulance rides.

This is often measured by researchers. It is called a "cost of living" calculation, and every one of these that I have seen indicates that this isn't the case.

For anyone who has lived in several countries, it should be obvious that direct cost-of-living comparisons rarely make sense. The actual costs depend so much on your income level and life situation that no single number can accurately reflect them.

Let's take Finland, the UK, and the US as examples, as they are the countries I'm most familiar with. At $30k/year (individual income), the US is much more expensive than the other two, mostly due to things like healthcare, childcare, education, unemployment, sick/parental leaves, and pensions. The UK might be a bit more expensive than Finland.

At $100k/year, the cost of living is more or less similar in all three countries. The weight of benefits and subsidized services is lower, because they take a smaller fraction of your income. The US may still be more expensive if you have kids, but it can also be cheaper if you don't have them and are never going to get then. The UK may also be a bit cheaper than Finland due to lower taxes.

At $200k/year, the US is the cheapest country and Finland is the most expensive one, primarily due to taxes.

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