I wasted $40k on a fantastic startup idea (2020) • Hacker News Board

Re: I wasted $40k on a fantastic startup idea (2020)

#231

Post by hoofhearted » Mon, Mar 28, 2022, 11:24 PM UTC

IanCal wrote: post #189

randomdata wrote: post #148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Proving what needs to be proven is the role of the prototype. That can also be an important step on your journey, but the MVP is about building a product that is considered viable. Literally. If you don't yet know what is viable in the market, how could you even begin to build something that is viable? You don't yet know what viable means.

I've had this argument before, from the same side you're coming at it from, and I was wrong. It's really not about building a viable product in that sense - the Dropbox demo video is the classic example of an MVP that isn't a "product" as such.

My understanding of Flexport’s journey is the same as this. Ryan had insight into the fact that shipping stuff across the globe is difficult from his previous businesses. He created a landing page offering to import shipments into the U.S., first shipment free, and had a couple major signups. He had someone build him a prototype and he continued to validate his idea while he waited for an import license. Flexport did all 4 MVP steps listed above, but they also identified and established a moat early on.

Re: I wasted $40k on a fantastic startup idea (2020)

#232

Post by bspear » Mon, Mar 28, 2022, 11:26 PM UTC

> So I built something people wanted. Consumers wanted it, doctors wanted it, I wanted it. Where did I go wrong?

They didn't want it enough. More specifically, the exchange of benefits for the cost was not clear enough

Re: I wasted $40k on a fantastic startup idea (2020)

#233

Post by jmhmd » Mon, Mar 28, 2022, 11:31 PM UTC

> There was this giant thing called healthcare right, and its main purpose is improving health—trillions of dollars are spent trying to do this.

As a physician, lol. Lmao

Re: I wasted $40k on a fantastic startup idea (2020)

#234

Post by elwell » Mon, Mar 28, 2022, 11:38 PM UTC

I'll invest energy and opportunity cost into my startup ideas, but not cash.

Re: I wasted $40k on a fantastic startup idea (2020)

#235

Post by pandatigox » Mon, Mar 28, 2022, 11:41 PM UTC

galaxyLogic wrote: post #216

BoiledCabbage wrote: post #199

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree. And what Tom didn't realize is that Doctors aren't financially incetivized to give better healthcare. There is no money in it for them. If anything, return visits because of a partial prior resolution make more money. Now clearly I'm not saying that doctors try to give bad diagnoses for profit (because they don't). But beyond a certain minimum bar, and on a purely financial basis, improving diagnostics or pr…

Quoted post unavailable.

So like a hospital?

For private practitioners, you forget that referral is another source of income. That relies on maintaining good relationships and being seen as competent enough amongst your peers. So there are various avenues for making money, and each private practitioner has different motivations for pursuing those different venues.

Re: I wasted $40k on a fantastic startup idea (2020)

#236

Post by potatoman22 » Mon, Mar 28, 2022, 11:49 PM UTC

BoiledCabbage wrote: post #199

kdkirsch wrote: post #191

I’m a physician. I really appreciate Tom’s enthusiasm, but I think that enthusiasm led him to overestimate the significance of the problem. Moreover he didn’t really understand for whom he was building this product. At first he thought it would be a consumer product. But he realized that consumers would not pay/subscribe and later learned that advertising wouldn’t work. Next he thought doctors would pay because “Doct…

I agree. And what Tom didn't realize is that Doctors aren't financially incetivized to give better healthcare. There is no money in it for them. If anything, return visits because of a partial prior resolution make more money. Now clearly I'm not saying that doctors try to give bad diagnoses for profit (because they don't). But beyond a certain minimum bar, and on a purely financial basis, improving diagnostics or pr…

The financial incentives behind care differ greatly between states and health systems, so you can't just make blanket statements like that. Look up accountable care organizations and value-based care. We're still in our early stages, but our country is trying to figure out how to properly incentivize care, I hope.

Re: I wasted $40k on a fantastic startup idea (2020)

#237

Post by LexGray » Mon, Mar 28, 2022, 11:50 PM UTC

Sounds like Yelp for drugs.

Your real profit would have been to follow the Yelp model to charge for placed ads and charge to manage reviews.

Just as Yelp gets a cut of online orders you could have partnered with mail order drug companies for a percentage to order directly.

If you wanted to get into really morally grey area do the doctor shopping too. Who prescribed what.

Re: I wasted $40k on a fantastic startup idea (2020)

#238

Post by webmaven » Mon, Mar 28, 2022, 11:56 PM UTC

acegopher wrote: post #152

crispyambulance wrote: post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To be fair, those "ducks-in-a-row" questions are NOT easy to answer and it's easy for someone to fool themselves with a BS answer. Moreover, there are plenty of ridiculous ideas that someone would never think anybody would "pay for" that make tons of money in spite of themselves. In the end it's all about taking calculated risks. Should the OP have learned more about the market he was trying to operate in AT SOME POI…

Right, even VCs don't know the answers. But the difference between a VC and a founder is that a VC invests in 100 companies not knowing which will succeed, but a founder only is investing in one.

And since VCs make practically all of their returns from that one hypergrowth 1000x company, they can push founders to swing for the fences even though that also makes startups more likely to fail.

For many founders, a 5x return would still be a life altering result, but to most VCs that doesn't really move the needle. It's nicer than 0x of course, but no more than that.

Re: I wasted $40k on a fantastic startup idea (2020)

#239

Post by notatoad » Tue, Mar 29, 2022, 12:00 AM UTC

BoiledCabbage wrote: post #199

kdkirsch wrote: post #191

I’m a physician. I really appreciate Tom’s enthusiasm, but I think that enthusiasm led him to overestimate the significance of the problem. Moreover he didn’t really understand for whom he was building this product. At first he thought it would be a consumer product. But he realized that consumers would not pay/subscribe and later learned that advertising wouldn’t work. Next he thought doctors would pay because “Doct…

I agree. And what Tom didn't realize is that Doctors aren't financially incetivized to give better healthcare. There is no money in it for them. If anything, return visits because of a partial prior resolution make more money. Now clearly I'm not saying that doctors try to give bad diagnoses for profit (because they don't). But beyond a certain minimum bar, and on a purely financial basis, improving diagnostics or pr…

> Doctors aren't financially incetivized to give better healthcare.

I think that's an overly nihilistic and not entirely accurate viewpoint. Good doctors get more patients through referrals, and once they have enough patients they can be more selective about which patients they take on. And they make more money. Bad doctors will lose trust and patients.

What doctors aren't incentivized to do is provide marginally stronger drugs. If aleve works a little bit better but tylenol is easier on your stomach, then is Aleve really "better"? If you actually need a stronger painkiller you can just up the dose. Medicine is rarely a black and white "best" situation.

Re: I wasted $40k on a fantastic startup idea (2020)

#240

Post by didntknowya » Tue, Mar 29, 2022, 12:05 AM UTC

BoiledCabbage wrote: post #199

kdkirsch wrote: post #191

I’m a physician. I really appreciate Tom’s enthusiasm, but I think that enthusiasm led him to overestimate the significance of the problem. Moreover he didn’t really understand for whom he was building this product. At first he thought it would be a consumer product. But he realized that consumers would not pay/subscribe and later learned that advertising wouldn’t work. Next he thought doctors would pay because “Doct…

I agree. And what Tom didn't realize is that Doctors aren't financially incetivized to give better healthcare. There is no money in it for them. If anything, return visits because of a partial prior resolution make more money. Now clearly I'm not saying that doctors try to give bad diagnoses for profit (because they don't). But beyond a certain minimum bar, and on a purely financial basis, improving diagnostics or pr…

your comment makes sense from a layman's perspective of logic and economics. but in the industry you'll find most doctors actually do not want to see patients for revisits and would rather a pill or injection solve the problem in one go. unfortunately due to biology this is rarely the case, and managers/pharma reps/business dev are keen to capitalize on it- not the overworked doctors.