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In internal memo, Apple addresses concerns around new Photo scanning features

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Re: In internal memo, Apple addresses concerns around new Photo scanning features

#231

Post by dendriti »

stefanve wrote: post #189
akomtu wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Pictures is just a pretense. Step #2 will be URLs of pictures that users send each other using the phone's keyboard. Step #3 will quietly expand the definition of a URL to any keyboard input. At that point, Apple will have a god's eye view into all communications of their users, be it over WhatsApp, Signal, SMS or an online forum. Imagine having a dashboard that shows in realtime with gps coordinates how many text me…

If Apple wanted to do all that they can, they don’t really need a special feature for that and tell te world.

Do you really think that "Apple is capable of doing this" is a meaningful rebuttal to "Apple will actually do this"?

Re: In internal memo, Apple addresses concerns around new Photo scanning features

#232

Post by stjohnswarts »

babesh wrote: post #133

Apple is the best venue for the government to get you used to your local data spied upon. Boil the frog. I do wonder what China and other countries will do. Will this system be under the control of US authorities?

I believe we'll just be the testing ground. Apple has no doubt to capitulate and use this for China so they can track down Pooh memes and similar anti-Chinese content for thought crimes against the party.

Re: In internal memo, Apple addresses concerns around new Photo scanning features

#233

Post by dendriti »

zimpenfish wrote: post #209
dannyw wrote: post #177

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is especially important given that NSO Group's Pegasus' works through sending multimedia iMessages/WhatsApps with exploits. The former auto-uploads to iCloud, and the latter can be configured to auto-upload all received media to iCloud. It almost sounds like a feature Apple is building to explicitly support the imprisonment of dissents through tje false planting of child pornography. What the actual f--k?

> It almost sounds like a feature Apple is building to explicitly support the imprisonment of dissents through tje false planting of child pornography. But you can already do this without these changes - cf the UK police officer currently under investigation for having CP on her phone that someone else sent her and (she claims) never opened. https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2020/aug/02/former-polic...

Once again, "People can already do this" is not a rebuttal or a defense.

Re: In internal memo, Apple addresses concerns around new Photo scanning features

#234

Post by stjohnswarts »

yawaworht1978 wrote: post #194

This makes me think, how do we know for sure that apple can't keylog WhatsApp or other e2e correspondence? Is it obvious in some open source code like signal or are there other hacks to prove/disprove this as a user?

I suspect currently they do nothing, however in the long run they control everything on their devices so there's no reason to think they can't do the same thing to signal, whatsapp or telegram.

Re: In internal memo, Apple addresses concerns around new Photo scanning features

#235

Post by kuratkull »

mclightning wrote: post #165
RavlaAlvar wrote: post #73

I really don’t understand why apple is doing this. What point are they trying to score and from whom ? Do they think implementing a spyware in iPhone would boost sales? Or does it bring revenue from charging government agency to use this feature? I just don’t get it.

So they can claim only Pedos use android

This is actually vaguely what I came up with, which is: "no Apple user is a practicing pedo".

Which is a very scary statement any company to make (the means to get to that point?!). But I am sure some countries see this is as a great technology to push for slogans of their own: "no citizen of Nonhomostan is a practicing homosexual!", "no citizen of Oppositionkillerian has any mind-corrupting western banners on their phone!"

This technology will allow large powers to make sweeping statements about data kept on private devices.

Re: In internal memo, Apple addresses concerns around new Photo scanning features

#236

Post by stjohnswarts »

dmitrygr wrote: post #126

I was planning to switch to iPhone this year. I no longer am. I do not want any device that would turn me in to police. For any reason. That is just not okay. To start with, because software has bugs. To end with, because principles matter.

don't do it, i did it last year and bought a top end mini and new iphone. They burned this bridge though, I guess it's back to Android and using adb to degoogle it and use open source apps to replace the google apps

Re: In internal memo, Apple addresses concerns around new Photo scanning features

#237

Post by smsm42 »

stjohnswarts wrote: post #212
Someone1234 wrote: post #38

Apple's mistake is that they seemingly believe there is pushback because people misunderstand how it works. The reality is more nuanced: People understand exactly how it works, and how it works is that it is turn-key onboard spyware, that Apple pinky-swears isn't being used wrong today . For example if the scope/mission expands (e.g. foreign governments), suddenly you've created a drag-net for whatever "badness" is o…

I see whataboutism (google drive scans! ms scans!) and "here are the technical details of why we can't just look..." . The bottom line is that none of that matters. the 99.999% problem is Apple is spying on you on your. own. device. I don't know how many techies I've had to shoosh and point that out. It doesnt matter what kind of hash or algo or "layers of protection" are being used. What they are doing is inherently…

The mistake here is thinking iphone is your own device. If they can view anything stored there, remove anything from there, control anything you install and run, disable it at any moment they wish - do you actually own it, or you just granted the use of it as long as Apple approves of it? Apple certainly doesn't ask your permission to do anything on "your own device" - but you have to ask theirs. Is that how ownership works?

Re: In internal memo, Apple addresses concerns around new Photo scanning features

#238

Post by stjohnswarts »

jasonlfunk wrote: post #105

If we pretend for a minute, which may not be hard, that Apple isn't trying to "think of the children" - this feature seems like a good step to protect themselves from the legal implications of having CP on their servers. I don't know what all the ramifications would be, but I imagine that if a CP ring was discovered using iCloud as a storage medium, Apple could get in a some big trouble.

there's nothing stopping them from scanning on their servers, google and dropbox already do it.

Re: In internal memo, Apple addresses concerns around new Photo scanning features

#239

Post by smsm42 »

Someone1234 wrote: post #38

Apple's mistake is that they seemingly believe there is pushback because people misunderstand how it works. The reality is more nuanced: People understand exactly how it works, and how it works is that it is turn-key onboard spyware, that Apple pinky-swears isn't being used wrong today . For example if the scope/mission expands (e.g. foreign governments), suddenly you've created a drag-net for whatever "badness" is o…

It's not a mistake, it's a rhetorical trick - to present somebody opposing your actions as a misinformed idiot that just doesn't know what they're talking about, and once proper technobabble is deployed every reasonable person would realize their mistake. And if they don't, they must be much bigger idiot than we thought, there's no other reasonable conclusion.

Re: In internal memo, Apple addresses concerns around new Photo scanning features

#240

Post by stjohnswarts »

tengbretson wrote: post #70

I honestly don't get the uproar here. This is opt-in, so how is it any more outrageous than existing MDM software that people opt-in to for work reasons which are way more invasive?

It's not opt in. Please do more reading on it. Because of a technical "limit" currently you can turn off icloud photos and get out of the worst of it but then you also handicap your device and one of the reasons people buy into the apple platform in the first place.
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