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3,000 eggs abandoned after drone scares birds in California

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Re: 3,000 eggs abandoned after drone scares birds in California

#231

Post by cjensen »

thatguy0900 wrote: post #217
cjensen wrote: post #106

I'm a birder, so some extra info... On dogs, training and leashes only matter a little. The problem is birds immediately identify a dog as a dangerous predator. They are far less bothered by humans. Birds pay more attention that we might realize. They identify potential threats from much farther away that we do. This leads to them being disturbed even when the casual rule-breaking dog walker thinks "I'm not doing any…

How do these birds exist in the wild if a single predator sighting causes them to abandon their eggs? Edit: I'm downvoted, so this is a legitimate question. How could it be that these birds have lasted when one predator causes the abandonment of 3000 eggs? Has no predator ever appeared on these islands?

That's exactly why I'm surprised. I don't understand why the birds don't come back after the excitement is over -- except possibly the ones closest to the crash site.

Re: 3,000 eggs abandoned after drone scares birds in California

#232

Post by swader999 »

treeman79 wrote: post #193
swader999 wrote: post #186

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In some places they are aptly named "off leash parks".

Those are full of drama. Someone’s dog gets bitten every week or so and it’s a huge outrage. Periodically a little dog goes into the big dog area and gets torn to shreds. Now I have used same locations many times without issues. But it happens.

And there's always that one dog that hogs the fetch ball. Good for the vet business.

Re: 3,000 eggs abandoned after drone scares birds in California

#233

Post by Rovanion »

lumberingjack wrote: post #228
lifeisstillgood wrote: post #189

I am guessing that drones are to birds what a Martian invasion would be to us - suddenly a new species has arrived and is persistent - it can go everywhere birds can go, it has spare energy enough to make aggressive noises constantly and it completely ignores any aggressive actions and attacks made to drive the drone off. It has arrived and taken over the territory completely - so abandon the area. My problem is if m…

Domesticated cats have completely eradicated several United States bird species nobody called for eradication of cats

Perhaps they should have?

Re: 3,000 eggs abandoned after drone scares birds in California

#234

Post by sizzle »

Why not put cameras on perimeter and figure out some unhackable protocol for drones to identify themselves once entering these protected geofences. The drone should autopilot away from the geofence via the protocol and it should be some encrypted method that no one can spoof and signed by various agencies protecting wildlife, etc.

Thoughts?

Re: 3,000 eggs abandoned after drone scares birds in California

#235

Post by prawn »

everybodyknows wrote: post #22
prawn wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I fly drones including with commercial filming permits at conservation parks/islands with large bird populations. Different types of birds react in various ways to a drone though I've never noticed similar birds to these act in an overly panicked way. Some types of birds will take flight and then resettle, some will circle closely and try to intimidate the drone (galahs), some charge or consider attacking it (osprey,…

As a mitigation, consider a slower, quieter, winged drone. With gyro stabilization, one could be built to mimic the profile of a large non-predator, recognizable as such to the vulnerable birds. Vulture, goose, albatross ... Drone hackers: Consider the business opportunity here.

My interaction with birds is not a key part of my drone work, just incidental. The drone I have is the best option for what I need - often need to launch from a boat, hand-catch, move precisely amongst trees, etc.

Re: 3,000 eggs abandoned after drone scares birds in California

#236

Post by prawn »

ericmcer wrote: post #79
prawn wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I fly drones including with commercial filming permits at conservation parks/islands with large bird populations. Different types of birds react in various ways to a drone though I've never noticed similar birds to these act in an overly panicked way. Some types of birds will take flight and then resettle, some will circle closely and try to intimidate the drone (galahs), some charge or consider attacking it (osprey,…

Wouldn’t the drones flying put it into a whole different threat category from humans/dogs/bikes? Birds are probably smart enough to realize hikers cannot threaten them or their eggs if they are up in a tree, but a large, fast flying object is pretty much game over for them and their eggs unless they abandon the area entirely. Your theory that dogs are the main cause just doesn’t make sense to me, birds can’t be so du…

Coastal birds like these are laying their eggs openly on the sand. You can see a picture here:

https://bit.ly/3gcjZbY

A dog off-leash would rip through and harass ever bird in the vicinity as well as damage any egg they wanted to. The "island" looks like it's in a shallow swamp that a dog could run across easily enough, though someone mentioned the area is usually fenced.

Here's a video of me flying a drone slowly over a group of crested terns sitting on rocks (birds similar to those in the story). I am maybe six feet above them. The only time they really moved was when a large wave hit the rocks and they left and returned when it subsided. There are a few dozen birds under the drone, while others are returning after the wave washed through - you can see they are not particularly bothered by it. (Obviously a drone crashing into the ground would spook them more.)

https://bit.ly/2T4t5PT

Re: 3,000 eggs abandoned after drone scares birds in California

#237

Post by alentist »

smcl wrote: post #227
alentist wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> As you noted it’s a tragedy of the commons—-because unquestioned individual freedom is prized so heavily in USA, some dog owners take advantage of it without appropriate precaution, and those people tend to do things like call the police on black people This passage doesn't make sense. It's a word salad.

Wait it's not actually word salad, it makes sense. I was out and about and wasn't able to spend time reading it before dashing off my flippant jokey reply below, so I only read it now. So despite the Saturday Spliff, blamazon is pretty coherent. Can you describe what doesn't make sense to you?

I'm not sure where to begin, and frankly I'm astonished you think any of it "makes sense".

To start with, do you know what a tragedy of the commons is?

Second, why would "individual freedom being prized so heavily" entail "people tending to do things like call the police"? Are you familiar with https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unofficial_collaborator and the like in authoritarian countries?

Third, what's the source for this bizarre claim that "those [dog owners] tend to do things like call the police on black people"?

Fourth, in what way is the latter at all relevant to the topic?

Re: 3,000 eggs abandoned after drone scares birds in California

#238

Post by swiley »

sizzle wrote: post #234

Why not put cameras on perimeter and figure out some unhackable protocol for drones to identify themselves once entering these protected geofences. The drone should autopilot away from the geofence via the protocol and it should be some encrypted method that no one can spoof and signed by various agencies protecting wildlife, etc. Thoughts?

My understanding is that larger drones (like any other aircraft) must carry transponders that report a registered call sign. Sure it's "hackable" by lying but that's a crime.

Re: 3,000 eggs abandoned after drone scares birds in California

#239

Post by kzrdude »

cjensen wrote: post #106

I'm a birder, so some extra info... On dogs, training and leashes only matter a little. The problem is birds immediately identify a dog as a dangerous predator. They are far less bothered by humans. Birds pay more attention that we might realize. They identify potential threats from much farther away that we do. This leads to them being disturbed even when the casual rule-breaking dog walker thinks "I'm not doing any…

I don't think people are used to following the rules anymore. Not when they themselves have to check. People like automatic control systems. In this case, something that bricks the drone if it goes across the fence :) (But that's just my tongue-in-cheek solution).

Re: 3,000 eggs abandoned after drone scares birds in California

#240

Post by mola »

lumberingjack wrote: post #228
lifeisstillgood wrote: post #189

I am guessing that drones are to birds what a Martian invasion would be to us - suddenly a new species has arrived and is persistent - it can go everywhere birds can go, it has spare energy enough to make aggressive noises constantly and it completely ignores any aggressive actions and attacks made to drive the drone off. It has arrived and taken over the territory completely - so abandon the area. My problem is if m…

Domesticated cats have completely eradicated several United States bird species nobody called for eradication of cats

Cats are living things which we have a special relationship with, drones are not. Some culture value life more than things, so unsurprisingly it'll be easier to propose a ban things than the eradication of cats.
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