The NFT market bubble has popped? • Hacker News Board

Re: The NFT market bubble has popped?

#231

Post by bhandziuk » Thu, Jun 03, 2021, 3:01 PM UTC

gomox wrote: post #147

nly wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Paintings have provenance. If you own a Da Vinci you're literally able to touch the canvas that the master himself touched. Your ownership will forever be apart of that works history, and it's yours to enjoy privately and exclusively whenever you want. It's an indulgence. Nobody will ask you in 20 years what it was like to own an NFT, because they can all have the exact same experience by just looking at the blockcha…

The NFT is a token for the story behind it, just like the artwork. It is issued by the artist. It has even better provenance tracing than the artwork, which could be a fake.

What's to stop an artist from selling you a print as an original through an NFT?

Re: The NFT market bubble has popped?

#232

Post by HeadsUpHigh » Thu, Jun 03, 2021, 3:01 PM UTC

s-lambert wrote: post #193

didericis wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cryptocurrencies have also been used as a way to escape hyperinflation and retain savings despite a coercive and highly restrictive government, eg Venezuela. When a system becomes corrupt and dysfunctional and normal transactions and savings become ineffective or illegal, cryptocurrencies have proven themselves as a viable means of escape. The value of that is hard to understate. I agree that a lot of other applicati…

In cases like Venezuala, what's the long-term goal of holding crpyto though? That the country somehow collapses and is rebuilt with a normally inflationary currency with a less restrictive government? Or is the idea that you build up savings to eventually leave the country? It doesn't really seem like a long-term solution or one that'd help more than a small amount of people.

The idea is to not have your money lose half its value on a daily basis. Or to have relatives send you money from abroad. There doesn't need to be an endgame, it just fulfils a need of these people.

Re: The NFT market bubble has popped?

#233

Post by bhandziuk » Thu, Jun 03, 2021, 3:10 PM UTC

domid wrote: post #30

Bubbles are not always the end. Actually quite the opposite. It's just the beginning. I'd give about 1-2 years for the NFT market to rebound. As the technology matures so will the supply. Demand will follow. It took about 3 years for Bitcoin to surpass Bitcoin 2017 bubble price levels. It took about 6.8 years for prices to rebound to dot-com bubble price levels.

Well when the housing bubble popped people stopped living in homes so I don't know if you're right.

Re: The NFT market bubble has popped?

#234

Post by driverdan » Thu, Jun 03, 2021, 3:12 PM UTC

cma wrote: post #187

qwerty456127 wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"I will never own a home" is not the only reason. The whole financial system is "fuck you this and fuck you that, incl. when you least expect and depend the most, and we won't tell you why". Yesterday here were news about PayPal terminating an account without explanation again (by the way, even when they don't ban you, their verification and customer services are a disaster anyway). This bullshit has to stop. Every p…

> Yesterday here were news about PayPal terminating an account without explanation again In the past few weeks crypto has shut down energy infrastructure, meat processing, and a major ferry service. It's also burning 1% of the world's electricity and rapidly growing.

> In the past few weeks crypto has shut down energy infrastructure, meat processing, and a major ferry service.

You're conflating cryptocurrency with ransomware attacks.

Re: The NFT market bubble has popped?

#235

Post by iSnow » Thu, Jun 03, 2021, 3:12 PM UTC

andrefuchs wrote: post #79

iSnow wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Gas on ETH is super low right now, around 20Gwei which translates into a $1 fee for a send and maybe $5 for minting an NFT. Tezos on the other hand is a complete ghost town, it has absolutely no traction - and I say this as a soon to be ex XTZ holder.

Interesting, please share your sources.

1) https://defipulse.com/

the first defi dapp not on ETH is BTC Lightning on rank #42.

2) https://debank.com/ranking/locked_value

something like 75% is on ETH, 95% or so on ETH + BSC (centralized ETH clone) + MATIC (ETH sidechain). The only chain that's not directly or indirectly tied to ETH is FTM.

3) onchain-volume, https://blockchair.com/compare and https://tzstats.com/

ETH transacted $20.6bn over the last 24h, XTZ 10.8 XTZ * $3.8 = $41.5m. It's not even close, it's a couple orders of magnitude away.

Re: The NFT market bubble has popped?

#236

Post by woah » Thu, Jun 03, 2021, 3:15 PM UTC

vesinisa wrote: post #5

I am hardly surprised. While Bitcoin maybe had theoretical uses as a currency a decade ago, the NFT hype never made any sense whatsoever to begin with.

NFTs bring the willfull ignorance of the anti-crypto crowd into stark relief. I had a roommate 10 years ago who was a video artist. She would do gallery showings and sell videos for hundreds of thousands of dollars. She had been doing it since the 90's. Her videos could be downloaded from her website, so what was she selling? Certificates of authenticity, that certified that the holder owned the art.

All criticisms of NFTs could just as easily be applied to the way that all digital artists have always sold their art. Where were you, ten years ago? Why weren't you yelling at my roommate for being a scammer?

Re: The NFT market bubble has popped?

#237

Post by driverdan » Thu, Jun 03, 2021, 3:15 PM UTC

Grustaf wrote: post #111

yoz-y wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm a bit torn about this. For example it is generally believed that say SONY should not get a cut if I resell a CD I've bought. Why should this be different for paintings?

1. If it is known from the start that this is how it works, you can just avoid those CDs. 2. CDs are copies, NFTs are sort of originals, so it's pretty different.

> NFTs are sort of originals

There is no such thing as an original digital media asset. The digital media attached to an NFT is by definition a copy.

Re: The NFT market bubble has popped?

#238

Post by dleslie » Thu, Jun 03, 2021, 3:23 PM UTC

driverdan wrote: post #234

cma wrote: post #187

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Yesterday here were news about PayPal terminating an account without explanation again In the past few weeks crypto has shut down energy infrastructure, meat processing, and a major ferry service. It's also burning 1% of the world's electricity and rapidly growing.

> In the past few weeks crypto has shut down energy infrastructure, meat processing, and a major ferry service. You're conflating cryptocurrency with ransomware attacks.

I think it's reasonable to link the two, but not conflate them. Crypto has certainly made ransomware a much more viable attack vector. A crypto address is easier to hide behind than a bank account number or mailing address or drop location.

Re: The NFT market bubble has popped?

#239

Post by rymate1234 » Thu, Jun 03, 2021, 3:23 PM UTC

yebyen wrote: post #103

southerntofu wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> A large % of people now believe that the finance industry only exists to work against them and make an elite minority rich. Yes, because that is the very definition of capitalism: people own, others work. That's the reason modern forms of slavery, colonization and patriarchal control were developed, historically. See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_capitalism or Silvia Federici for some great perspectives…

> Spending billions of KWh on blockchains so rich people can speculate on buying their own number (correct me if i'm wrong but to me a NFT is just a number) is just part of this. You say this as if numbers have no utility. Is an IP address "just a number"? What about a /8 cidr block? How much energy should we be allowed to spend to secure global address space and provide a secure implementation of identity for all pe…

> Because you know what happens when private property is abolished? Spoiler, only the well connected and powerful will hold private property

If only a few people can own private property then you haven't abolished private property, you've just limited who can own it.

This was the main issue caused by the massive state control of Marxist Leninist countries like the Soviet Union -- by centralizing all control within one single political party you essentially just replace an economic elite with a political elite. Couple that with the democratic centralism you often find in these single party ML countries and suddenly you have something that's a lot less like the communal living the OP was referring to.

I'm not saying abolishing private property will be some magical fix all, but I also don't think using the soviet union as an example of why it won't work is a good example. You could have a society where usage of resources is governed by consensus rather than "lol stalin said so" but consensus is obviously a lot harder to do on a global scale than a small communal village

Re: The NFT market bubble has popped?

#240

Post by sjg1729 » Thu, Jun 03, 2021, 3:26 PM UTC

Igelau wrote: post #230

nly wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Imho it stems from a lack of understanding and faith in the financial services industry, probably exacerbated by the financial crisis. A large % of people now believe that the finance industry only exists to work against them and make an elite minority rich. There's a strong sense of "Fuck You, I Got Mine" from the last generation, so the current generation is saying "Fine, I'm going to invent my own system... with B…

> After many hours I couldn't find anything even remotely interesting. This has been my issue with dApps as well. It's always "thing that does some stuff with ETH" which is only valuable and interesting if you already assume ETH is valuable and interesting. I guess most people make the leap of faith by putting money into them, but on sheer technical merit, dApps just aren't that interesting.

I agree in a lot of cases, but a couple months ago I saw a pretty interesting idea on HN: https://sarcophagus.io . While I think there are some issues with this protocol, it convinced me there are some pretty interesting problems that can be solved with new and unintuitive social/technical means with dApps.

(un-disclaimer: not affiliated, not an owner, not a user)