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Intel chief Pat Gelsinger: Too many chips made in Asia

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Re: Intel chief Pat Gelsinger: Too many chips made in Asia

#231
post #156

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We are in a cold war because, like back in the day with the USSR and the old cold war, China doesn't want to turn into an Asian copy of the US. I'm no fan of PRC but I wish more countries would do the same. Traveling a lot today and you'll see American cultural imperialism everywhere. Besides, we do need another power to compete with the US so it can't do what ever the f** it wants to. Sadly the only real competition…

> I for one would rather see more power on the hands of Russia and PRC if the only alternative were complete Americanization of the world. America is far from perfect, so many things are broken it is insane, but to prefer to have a stronger Russia or China is bewildering to me. Everything that is bad about America is equally bad or worse in both of those places plus an undeniable loss of liberty. Cronyism, inequality…

>it boggles my mind that people think this way.

I don't agree at all that the things that are bad in the US are as bad or worse with those countries, first of all because it is a misunderstanding that it is "in the US" because the problem I was referring to with the US is outside the US.

The US is doing everything it can to control and dominate the world and we need a counterweight to stop this ASAP. It does much more harm than good. What happens inside US borders is another matter. The problem is when the US can do as it pleases which is basically what it is like today. I dislike Russia too but if Russia makes the US pause before invading a country or the PRC did the same it is a win in my book. The US is an extreme aggressor and someone need to force its fleets back where they belong and stop its political steamrolling.

Besides the problem of using its military to "make right" we are also seeing a death of culture because of Americanization. If half of huge US businesses were exchanged overnight to other strong nations businesses the world would become a better place. McDonald's and Disney doesn't belong outside the US as the dominant local business. Local burger and movies does. We live in a time where many children think American food and films are the norm, instead of something foreign, new and exotic as it should be. Every culture is becoming one culture. It smells a lot like something PRC does that the US is extremely critical about but is doing much more itself..

Of course I'd rather see the EU as a power that could put the US in its place but I'd also rather see Russia or PRC doing so if the alternative is no-one doing it.

ETA: Saying imperialist tendencies are worse in Russia and PRC than the US is mindboogling. Russia and PRC does a lot of bad things but they are light-years behind the US in imperialism.

Re: Intel chief Pat Gelsinger: Too many chips made in Asia

#232

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> ...I can't think of any project entirely focused on building from scratch and kick-starting the industrial motor of modern civilization. That's a national defense-scale ambition, and it is akin to asking, "what are the minimal constraints to reproduce X tech tree with Y years steady state sustainability?" You're basically asking what it takes to establish an independent human colony without support from home. The L…

I wasn't aware of the long now project, I'll look into it. The point is that it's not totally from scratch and there's a very good proportion that can be passed on easily and a lot of trial & errors and research doesn't have to be done again. Mathematics can be learned with only books, important concept such as calculus doesn't have to be rediscovered. Major scientific discoveries don't have to be reinvented. Hard le…

> The point is that it's not totally from scratch and there's a very good proportion that can be passed on easily and a lot of trial & errors and research doesn't have to be done again.

The catch is there is a world of difference between what is in written form and operational practice, and yet another world of difference in operational practice at scale. Most of what is unwritten in civilization are operational practice, and doing so at scale; most of that is encoded behind commercial enterprises' walled gardens of information.

As a concrete example, figure out what it would take to reconstruct the melt blown material manufacturing equipment. Or what it would take to construct an MDX lab. Or "just" a machine shop like Fireball Tools' capabilities. That kind of knowledge is extremely slow to percolate into an information transmissible form, if it ever makes it there. We don't have mind state capture and replay, unfortunately.

There is lots of material on an even "lower" tech base-oriented activity, small-scale farming and/or ranching. And out of the tens of thousands of people in the developed world every year who want to take the plunge to grow their own food, there is insufficient "cookbook" recipes they can follow to enable them to easily do so, and of the many who do take the plunge, most do not stick it out past five years.

People get a taste of this dynamic anytime they venture into hobbies that require some form of self-sufficiency, like hiking, camping, blue water sailing, and so on. The logistical tail to support those activities to where they can "launch" is quite extensive.

I agree infrastructure-damaging incidents are extremely unlikely to uniformly take out all supply chains across the board. But planning-wise, there is no way to tell which parts of infrastructure would be adversely affected. The best we have been able to do as a species is to route around the damage on a best effort basis, relying upon the diversity/redundancy of sourcing and logistical alternatives, like with the COVID-19 pandemic and the Suez Canal backlog.

As a "DR plan for civilization" posture however, that is insufficient. Like Microsoft Word, such a planner has to cater to lots of different scenarios (users), each with its own unique set of induced infrastructure gaps (requirements), ending up with a Franken-plan (Microsoft Word). It's not an easy or compact problem to solve as far as I can tell, though I'd be happy to be shown wrong. If we ever want to make off-world settlement a reality in the far future, then we have to solve this problem to some degree.

The thought has occurred to me that making such a plan too compact holds within it a dark pattern: if it is too accessible to too-small an entity, then it encourages elites with sufficient resources and megalomania to pursue their own ideations of a world created in their own image. I suspect without humaniform robots and GAI however, that won't become a possible reality. I believe the scale and complexity of mind states to transfer around (densities of which are limited by human lifespans and in the base case, available energy) to accomplish the goal dictates pretty large population requirements out of reach of all but combinations of developed-world nation-states.

It isn't all dire. We've solved this before, up to around the 17-18th century, arguably tapering off the competence around the 19th century. We haven't dusted off the outdated DR plan and updated it for our new "platform".

Re: Intel chief Pat Gelsinger: Too many chips made in Asia

#233
post #231

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I for one would rather see more power on the hands of Russia and PRC if the only alternative were complete Americanization of the world. America is far from perfect, so many things are broken it is insane, but to prefer to have a stronger Russia or China is bewildering to me. Everything that is bad about America is equally bad or worse in both of those places plus an undeniable loss of liberty. Cronyism, inequality…

>it boggles my mind that people think this way. I don't agree at all that the things that are bad in the US are as bad or worse with those countries, first of all because it is a misunderstanding that it is "in the US" because the problem I was referring to with the US is outside the US. The US is doing everything it can to control and dominate the world and we need a counterweight to stop this ASAP. It does much mor…

> ETA: Saying imperialist tendencies are worse in Russia and PRC than the US is mindboogling. Russia and PRC does a lot of bad things but they are light-years behind the US in imperialism.

Russia, in the last decade, annexed a region of another country. China is in the active process of annexing a region of the South China Sea for resources and using its newfound economic strength to project its power via the Belt and Road initiative.

I think you're focused on avoiding cultural hegemony to the actual detriment of the liberty of mankind. These are not countries that even pretend to have liberty as a core tenet - being an outspoken critic in both places is dangerous, Russia even flexed its power and killed people in the UK!

I'd rather eat McDonalds for the rest of my short, fat life than be at risk for being killed for being an outspoken critic of the government.

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