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The virus that causes the common cold can effectively boot the Covid virus out

bbc.com

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Re: The virus that causes the common cold can effectively boot the Covid virus out

#231

Post by Retric »

nanis wrote: post #224
Retric wrote: post #176

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> There is no thing called "science" that finds answers. That’s equivalent to suggesting people can’t do chess. Semantically it may be accurate, but it’s intentionally obtuse. Language doesn’t actually work that way. Anyway, science isn’t experiments and building hypothesis etc. That’s part of the process, but really quite small pieces of a greater whole. It’s the long processes of generations refining and testing ea…

I am not sure I understand the statement about chess. It is important to understand that scientists are individuals with individual incentives. While some have an inherent drive towards getting closer to truths via the application of the scientific method, others may find other things more important. Abstracting "the science" from scientists is a convenient way of training other people in the acceptance of the propos…

Chess is an abstract set of rules not the thought process behind making a move or the physical action of moving a piece. As such nobody actually does chess.

You can play chess, as in follow the rules, or be a scientist, as in contribute to the progress of science, but nobody is the physical embodiment of chess or science.

Edit: To be as clear as possible, the President isn’t Democracy, but Democracy still exists in that you can meaningfully destroy it.

Re: The virus that causes the common cold can effectively boot the Covid virus out

#232

Post by Shorel »

gher-shyu3i wrote: post #101
WhompingWindows wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"the tiniest creatures God in his wisdom put upon this earth" The writing is nice but flawed. Since War of the Worlds, we have advanced tremendously and no longer need intelligent design or creation myths to explain microorganisms. Reproducible, testable science demonstrates that in the primordial oceans, self-replicating molecules which were slightly better at self-replicating produced globules of matter capable of…

Science does not and will not be able to explain the origin of life. The statement still holds. It's very arrogant of us to assume otherwise.

Neither will religion.

It is very arrogant of any ideology to pretend it can explain things it can't.

Re: The virus that causes the common cold can effectively boot the Covid virus out

#233

Post by elsonrodriguez »

elliekelly wrote: post #210
Verdex wrote: post #186

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is one of the things that I like about the expanse series. When people first start moving out to alien ecosystems, they specifically go into how alien viruses etc are probably not going to be a problem. The metaphor they use is "mining" basically. Where they're not concerned that people will get infected, but they're concerned that some organism will find out that people are full of some resource that the organi…

I’ve never heard of the Expanse series but your mining comment is both terrifying and intriguing! DuckDuckGo tells me it’s both a series of novels and a Syfy TV series - I’m curious which one (or perhaps both?) you’re referring to so I can add it to my read and/or watch list.

I experienced the Expanse by watching the first season, binging all the books because I was impatient, then watching the rest with my partner.

I feel I've gotten the best of both by doing that.

Re: The virus that causes the common cold can effectively boot the Covid virus out

#234

Post by [deleted] »

BoiledCabbage wrote: post #222
timr wrote: post #215

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Why do you keep saying these measures have done nothing to rhinovirus? Because they haven't. > The link you've shared does not support that. It shows relative percentages - and you're confusing that for absolute infection counts. I am not confusing it. It shows you the percentage of samples they test that come up positive for rhinovirus (and other things. They test for all of the things listed, in parallel.) Influe…

Again, you're confusing percentages. To use some simplified numbers to explain it - consider that normally 100,000 people are infected with some form of respiratory virus on a daily, basis and 20% of those are rhinoviruses, then that means there are 20,000 daily rhinovirus infections. And let's also say that strains of influenza are another 20% and 20,000/day. Now what is happening, is in a covid world, due to masks…

[deleted]

Re: The virus that causes the common cold can effectively boot the Covid virus out

#235

Post by spinny »

well guess we are all f'ed anyway ... many countries are reporting record low numbers for the common cold ... because covid. in many places the common cold is the new covid, it seems.

and my fifi's got massively offended by the usage of the word "trump". my inner ninja karen is about to pull the facemask and do a reeeeeeeeeee mortal kombat finish move

Re: The virus that causes the common cold can effectively boot the Covid virus out

#237

Post by postalrat »

BoiledCabbage wrote: post #226
manwe150 wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If I'm reading that chart right, it is the percentage of sicknesses caused by each virus type, not the rate of sickness in the population. So we don't have information in this chart on the absolute prevalence. The change in relative rates may suggest which measures are relatively more effective on different viruses, but doesn't help us analyze the effectiveness of the current narrative. On the research presented in t…

> If I'm reading that chart right, it is the percentage of sicknesses caused by each virus type, not the rate of sickness in the population. So we don't have information in this chart on the absolute prevalence. The change in relative rates may suggest which measures are relatively more effective on different viruses, but doesn't help us analyze the effectiveness of the current narrative. That's exactly correct, and…

If that's exactly correct why doesn't it always add up to 100%?

Re: The virus that causes the common cold can effectively boot the Covid virus out

#238

Post by mrkstu »

burnte wrote: post #192
hinkley wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's a concept in domestication that it's not always clear in a symbiotic relationship as to which party is in 'control' of the relationship, especially when one party gets a huge boost in reproductive rates from the other. Did humans domesticate dogs, or did dogs domesticate humans? Viruses are specialized. They won't attack aliens. Bacteria might. It's the fungi in many respects that are the masters of this plan…

Viruses will attack anything they can successfully reproduce in, they have absolutely no preferences. They are binary, they survive and thrive or they don't. That's why some viruses can sucessfully jump species, and some can't, some viruses are able to survive in multiple hosts through dumb luck. Yes, they all need specific types of conditions in their hosts to survive, but they don't care if it's a big, a dog, a hum…

Viruses have evolved to hijack DNA- I'd find it highly unlikely a truly alien biology would be susceptible to earth viruses. Maybe some truly primitive precursor virus may have been able to, but I'd think any of those would be long gone.

Re: The virus that causes the common cold can effectively boot the Covid virus out

#239

Post by BoiledCabbage »

timr wrote: post #229
BoiledCabbage wrote: post #226

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If I'm reading that chart right, it is the percentage of sicknesses caused by each virus type, not the rate of sickness in the population. So we don't have information in this chart on the absolute prevalence. The change in relative rates may suggest which measures are relatively more effective on different viruses, but doesn't help us analyze the effectiveness of the current narrative. That's exactly correct, and…

> the poster is continuously misinterpreting a rate as a fixed quantity. I am not. It is a measurement of the percentage of samples in a surveillance network, positive for each pathogen. Here is the methods paper: https://publichealth.jmir.org/2018/3/e59/ Here is the relevant section: > To calculate the pathogen detection rate (as displayed in Figure 2 [second data view] and on the Trend website), we compute the rate…

I think this will be my final reply on this topic. I appreciate you posting links to support your view, but I don't believe you're taking time to reflect on what I'm saying.

> The fact that rhinovirus continues to circulate so widely

This statement cannot be made from the link you posted. This is a rate. A frequency rate among sampled data. However it does not track the number of samples occurring. No amount of averaging can cover that. As a result, a person cannot make a conclusion to support the above statement on frequency of circulation of rhinovirus.

> Rhinovirus has continued to circulate at normal levels.

This statement is not supported by the data you list. The description you provide above even supports my argument. They are adjusting for capacity differences, but are still reporting a rate.

This is the key statement they make supporting my point:

> To adjust for the capacity differences between sites, a national aggregate is calculated as the unweighted average of individual site rates.

They are averaging rates of infection. You cannot use that to make the statement that you're making that "Rhinovirus has continued to circulate at normal levels."

This is all very well understood stats. The only thing I can suggest at this point is to do some background reading on statistics, sampling and statistical inference.

I'm trying to both be cordial about it, as you have been cordial in your tone and appear to have an earnest interest in this topic - but also trying to make clear that you are unintentionally spreading false information.

You are doing something that statistics 101 makes clear is invalid to do. I'm not certain how else to put it. My only request is that you refrain from repeatedly posting. It is incorrect information, and it turns out it isn't just an invalid conclusion, it's actually the opposite of what is occurring.

Keep the enthusiasm, but just understand the math/stats a bit more.

Re: The virus that causes the common cold can effectively boot the Covid virus out

#240

Post by mrkramer »

nomy99 wrote: post #179
mrkramer wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Should I cry that mother nature doesn't like me? It's not like I can do something about natural disaster(hurricane, flood, earthquake, volcano eruption etc.) killing me.

No but you should not assume that defaulting to the victim's mindset will help your chances of survival. Your initial comment implied that nature has your best interest in heart; and your child comment is contradicting it? What's so hard about taking a cautious approach and proactively increase your chances of survival? I.e get to higher grounds (floods), evacuating(hurricanes), get vaccinated (covid + new diseases?)…

I don't have time to explain you anymore but I will say this. I'm liberal, pro God and pro Science. I don't have anything against God or nature taking my life away or improving it (evolution) and I don't have anything against defense mechanisms like natural disaster controls or public health measurements like vaccination but I want my freedom. Someone said vaccination is our evolution I agree maybe we are approaching singularity but nobody can forbid me to work or travel because of 1 pathogen. I took all vaccines prior to this but I will not take this one so I can laugh at COVID passport because I live in free Europe and not in Hitler's Europe anymore. If this pandemic is something nearly close to Spanish Flu or Black Plague which took hundreds of millions of lives I would be the first one to take vaccine but not like this.

WHO's dubious approach and dubious rhetoric only made me suspicious. I'm still waiting for their investigation on where and how pandemic originated.

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