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Media Owned by Wealthy Are Quick to Tell You Wealth Taxes Are a Bad Idea

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Re: Media Owned by Wealthy Are Quick to Tell You Wealth Taxes Are a Bad Idea

#231

Post by didibus »

maerF0x0 wrote: post #121
didibus wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That seems like the way the incentive is supposed to work no? Motivate the economy by furthering investment back into it.

If we tax wealth, people will be incentivized to generate non-wealth things. Why buy a stock if Biden will take 1% of it annually? May as well just buy rapidly depreciating status symbols instead.

> Why buy a stock if Biden will take 1% of it annually? May as well just buy rapidly depreciating status symbols instead

Because the stock will allow you to avoid paying taxes. By investing revenue in investment, as a company, you can avoid paying tax on the money. So if you're a small or medium sized business, you have two choices:

1) Cash out and buy a rapidly depreciating status symbol with the money, but get taxed on it at a higher rate.

2) Reinvest the money in growing your business.

At least that's what I understood from OPs reasoning.

Edit: Also spending money in depreciating status symbols is also a contributor to the economy.

Re: Media Owned by Wealthy Are Quick to Tell You Wealth Taxes Are a Bad Idea

#232

Post by tstrimple »

maerF0x0 wrote: post #181
ceejayoz wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> That's spending 42% of take home pay to have roommates! So, probably not affected much by a wealth tax. > $400k per year is about what it takes to run a middle class family w/ 2 kids in such a city. What? The median household income in NYC is about $63k.

The point is why should someone get progressively taxed when they are attempting to live a "median" American lifestyle. That is a home, a bedroom for each child (etc as the CNBC article pointed out)

They are still making nearly 6x the "median" income in their city so saying they are attempting to live a "median" American lifestyle is disingenuous.

Re: Media Owned by Wealthy Are Quick to Tell You Wealth Taxes Are a Bad Idea

#233

Post by nimbius »

slightly offtopic but ive always considered media to be the most fascinating asset controlled by wealth.

The news ensures rote reinforcement and education of the class system for the masses, while celebrities act as a sort of failsafe to avoid things like the 18th century French revolution.

individual celebrity popularity is permitted to ebb and flow, however a general aversion to or boycott of celebrities acts as a canary in a coal mine, alerting the most wealthy and opulent to the existence of a systemic backlash against the fundamental tenents of class inequality and, most importantly, the ruling class of wealth. This sort of unilateral distaste for celebrities was last seen during the COVID quarantine when celebrities insisted solidarity with their fans while sequestered in lavish mansions or private estates. the acrid contrast between pawns forced to work multiple jobs and elites who merely benefitted from the inconvenience of isolation in paradise produced a widespread backlash. In response, celebrities were recalled by media owners and a greater focus was put on thanking "essential workers" in media (print, tv, and billboards) as well as the Amazon news piece, which acted to repair and maintain the US populations perception of wealth as a net-good.

Re: Media Owned by Wealthy Are Quick to Tell You Wealth Taxes Are a Bad Idea

#234

Post by munk-a »

jquery wrote: post #188
munk-a wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it's pretty clear that corporate re-investment going up is good for the economy, perhaps looking at the equivalent lengths countries go to draw excess investment money from the international market in is a decent example - or maybe the WPA in the US where the government artificially injected money into employment to restart the economy.

You’re (edit: sorry, GP was) espousing the broken windows theory, though. Corporations already have a natural incentive to re-invest in themselves when it’s a profitable decision to do so.

I don't think so because the corporation isn't a person and no one actually has the corporation's best interests at heart. Everyone is invested or labour for the venture for money - some idealists may want to build a great thing - but those will be far in the minority compared to those that want to sell a great thing.

Reinvestment in a corporation is only naturally incentivized when that strategy appears to give the biggest RoI and not all money uninvested from markets, companies etc. will necessarily be reinvested in another venture.

Re: Media Owned by Wealthy Are Quick to Tell You Wealth Taxes Are a Bad Idea

#235

Post by [deleted] »

zdragnar wrote: post #34
tonystubblebine wrote: post #6

As a business owner, when taxes are low, I see that as an incentive to pocket profits. But when taxes are high, I see that as an incentive to hide the profits by investing in the future. I know this isn't always the case with everyone. And especially investors have a case that higher corporate taxes reduce the value of their investments, possibly to the point of not making them. But this incentive is so blatantly obv…

Strange. Business owner friends of mine have taken the opposite approach over the years. Taxes low? Start up something new, get it going. Taxes go up again? Sell it off (if they haven't already) and go back to early retirement doing whatever. Maybe it is largely the type of business that behavior changes. Their last venture was starting up an aquaponics farm in a borderline urban / suburban area, though I haven't kep…

[deleted]

Re: Media Owned by Wealthy Are Quick to Tell You Wealth Taxes Are a Bad Idea

#237

Post by czbond »

LatteLazy wrote: post #226
czbond wrote: post #127

Near 50% of American pay zero federal tax. The top 10% of all Americans pay 69% of all federal taxes currently. This is a point 'left out' of current discussions. Instead of increasing entitlements or adding yet more taxes - we lower the size of the government spending UNTIL it matches where most people pay for the services received in a more scaled manner. Source: https://taxfoundation.org/summary-latest-federal-inc…

The top 10% of wage earners pay all the tax. But they're not the top 10% by wealth or unearned income. Those guys are getting off free. Reducing income tax by properly taxing inheritance, cap gains or wealth itself would help people who work for a living instead of sitting on their arses and jealousy guarding what their grandfather's grandfather's grandfather brought over from the old country.

The amazing thing is we can ALL buy assets and be the "grandfather's grandfather's grandfather". It isn't hard. Even very small wealth compounds incredibly after 150 years.

Re: Media Owned by Wealthy Are Quick to Tell You Wealth Taxes Are a Bad Idea

#238

Post by [deleted] »

tonystubblebine wrote: post #6

As a business owner, when taxes are low, I see that as an incentive to pocket profits. But when taxes are high, I see that as an incentive to hide the profits by investing in the future. I know this isn't always the case with everyone. And especially investors have a case that higher corporate taxes reduce the value of their investments, possibly to the point of not making them. But this incentive is so blatantly obv…

[deleted]

Re: Media Owned by Wealthy Are Quick to Tell You Wealth Taxes Are a Bad Idea

#239

Post by CuriousSkeptic »

sempron64 wrote: post #125

I'm not wealthy enough for a wealth tax to apply, but a wealth tax is a colossal privacy and administrative burden on _every single taxpayer_. Assets must be accounted for when calculating wealth, so the tax service will be required to track and value assets including vehicles, homes, and material good etc. for every citizen to see if the wealth tax would apply to them -- if we didn't report material goods, the wealt…

One way to mitigate that is to not tax “wealth” arbitrarily. Instead imagine something more targeted like a land value tax. Property rights could be changed so that some assets that are in limited supply and posses capital value such as land, simply can’t just be owned, but are instead leased.

I mean wealth per se isn’t an issue. In the grand scheme of things what material goods you have matter little. It’s the unreasonable and unbalanced command over actual capital that create issues.

Re: Media Owned by Wealthy Are Quick to Tell You Wealth Taxes Are a Bad Idea

#240

Post by kortilla »

munk-a wrote: post #153
maerF0x0 wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If we tax wealth, people will be incentivized to generate non-wealth things. Why buy a stock if Biden will take 1% of it annually? May as well just buy rapidly depreciating status symbols instead.

Why work as an average american is the government will take 22% of it? Probably because trading stocks will still leave you with a lot more money than if you threw a tantrum, took your toys home and hid your money under your mattress - no plan that I've seen has investors paying capital gains at the level of their equivalent income - investment is still heavily subsidized.

You’re confusing wealth with income. A wealth tax means it the government is taking a cut even when you’re assets are declining.
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