Why is Apple acting like an asshole? • Hacker News Board

Re: Why is Apple acting like an asshole?

#231

Post by baddox » Wed, Sep 16, 2020, 5:40 PM UTC

romanoderoma wrote: post #152

nlitened wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why wouldn't you use Android then? I would personally like to continue paying higher prices to protect myself from low-quality background-syncing byte-code-obfuscated web-pages with push notifications, please.

> I would personally like to continue paying higher prices to protect myself from low-quality background-syncing byte-code-obfuscated web-pages with push notifications are you really saying you would pay higher prices because you can' t press the "no" button and never visit the same website again?

Yes, absolutely! Just like I'd rather pay for Apple Arcade so that I don't have to wade through the sewage of free-to-play games clicking "no" on in-app purchase requests and hiding spammy notifications. Just like I'd rather pay for streaming services with no ads rather than having to mute commercials on live TV or skip commercials on DVR'd TV.

It's not absurd to me to pay for platforms that attempt to preemptively remove filth rather than need to be on the constant lookout for filth. This is particularly true when most of these entire ecosystems (the web, app stores, video content) seem to be based on sneaking filth in front of your eyes at every available opportunity.

Re: Why is Apple acting like an asshole?

#232

Post by leptons » Wed, Sep 16, 2020, 5:40 PM UTC

srtjstjsj wrote: post #183

valuearb wrote: post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple has never had even 50% of the US smartphone market. https://www.counterpointresearch.com/us-market-smartphone-sh...

iOS is 60% of the mobile (phone+tablet) market https://gs.statcounter.com/os-market-share/mobile/united-sta...

>Statcounter is a web analytics service. Our tracking code is installed on more than 2 million sites globally.

Sorry but this is not an effective way to gauge market share of a browser or a platform. That 60% figure you're throwing around is not an absolute metric. It's based only on visitors to websites that use the "Statcounter" tracking code. There definitely is a large margin of error using this to gather statistics about market share.

In comparison, the other commenter's link is actually more accurate because:

>This report is one of the series of reports which tracks mobile handset: Smartphone and Feature Phone shipments every quarter for more than 140 brands covering more than 95% of the total device shipments in the industry.

Tracking site visitors based on sporadic implementation of a tracker, vs getting actual numbers of units shipped/sold. I'm going with the actual numbers, not the sort-of-guessing of Statcounter.

Re: Why is Apple acting like an asshole?

#233

Post by CamJN » Wed, Sep 16, 2020, 5:41 PM UTC

remexre wrote: post #180

danielscrubs wrote: post #171

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Email would get drowned with all the other apps with the same idea, which is exactly why Apple shouldn’t allow it.

Why Apple shouldn't allow websites to email you instead of causing those websites to create iOS apps?

No, it's why apple shouldn't allow notifications from the web. People are already drowning in notification spam from native apps. To the point where Apple has added three different ways the OS prompts you to disable notifications.

People just allow everything and then get overloaded by all the worthless interruptions.

Re: Why is Apple acting like an asshole?

#234

Post by nemothekid » Wed, Sep 16, 2020, 5:42 PM UTC

dayjobpork wrote: post #84

Don't worry Apple hates users too. I've once had a Windows update break software, and I was easily able to downgrade the broken update (and it wasn't really MSvs fault entirely, graphics driver issue). Multiple times I've had ipad updates break apps, and some apps have never worked again because the developers don't bother updating the app, and Apple blocks downgrading because...

And yet you ask any developer shop they will say it’s a good thing that they don’t have support 20 different OS matrixes like they do on Android

Re: Why is Apple acting like an asshole?

#235

Post by rangoon626 » Wed, Sep 16, 2020, 5:43 PM UTC

lolsal wrote: post #176

pojntfx wrote: post #3

Honestly, this is why we need the Web. But Apple even blocks that since they don’t allow any browser engine apart from Safari, meaning that there is no - Add to homescreen dialog - Background sync - Proper push notifications - Proper WASM support (a lot of features are missing) Honestly, at this point, the government should step in, like they did at the end of the last century with Microsoft. Walled gardens hurt inno…

It boggles my mind that a company makes a fairly innocuous decision (which you would expect consumers to punish them for) like requiring all web views to use the same renderer as Safari, and there are people like you rushing to have the government jump in and regulate "the kind of rendering for web pages that a private company allows on their devices". Seems like total insanity to me and I don't understand it.

Apple does not own the device though.

If they own the device, then I want my 1k back.

Re: Why is Apple acting like an asshole?

#236

Post by matheusmoreira » Wed, Sep 16, 2020, 5:44 PM UTC

dionian wrote: post #201

foepys wrote: post #191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

True, but I can still run my program that I compiled back in 1999.

you also have largely the same OS and hardware architecture that you did in 1999

Modern Linux kernels can also run binaries compiled in the 90s. Apple just doesn't care.

Re: Why is Apple acting like an asshole?

#237

Post by CamJN » Wed, Sep 16, 2020, 5:44 PM UTC

srtjstjsj wrote: post #184

eddieroger wrote: post #148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's a misuse of "monopolistic" - 60% is not a majority to the point of no competition. Any developer could write an Android-only app if they wanted, they just don't do it.

Most consumers only handle one phone.

So? Apple has a monopoly on Apple products? Big deal. Ford has a monopoly on Ford trucks, Sony has a monopoly on playstations.

Re: Why is Apple acting like an asshole?

#238

Post by DenseComet » Wed, Sep 16, 2020, 5:45 PM UTC

saagarjha wrote: post #124

alex_duf wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Gee, it sounds like even devs internally weren't aware of it and everyone's scrambling.

Probably. Unless they’re something that clearly explains why this update just had to go out tomorrow, like new iPhones shipping or something, the people who signed off on this should be writing a report tomorrow about how badly they’ve damaged developer relations and created a huge amount of work internally for the app review team and probably the engineering as well. The fact that the main part of the even from toda…

It's likely because of the Apple Watch Series 6, which will almost certainly release with WatchOS 7, which is in-turn only compatible with iOS 14. The Series 6 launches Friday, so if they wanted to delay iOS 14, they'd have to delay that launch too.

Re: Why is Apple acting like an asshole?

#239

Post by spideymans » Wed, Sep 16, 2020, 5:45 PM UTC

scarface74 wrote: post #205

romanoderoma wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I would personally like to continue paying higher prices to protect myself from low-quality background-syncing byte-code-obfuscated web-pages with push notifications are you really saying you would pay higher prices because you can' t press the "no" button and never visit the same website again?

Along with every time I have to press OK to the “we used cookies” dialog, using the web is already like a “punch the monkey” game.

These modern web APIs have a massive user experience problem, and if we want the web to be truly competitive with native, we'd be foolish to ignore that.

Beyond the "punch the monkey" game you mention, another massive problem is that web push notifications have just become another vector to deliver spam to users. If you look at devices belonging to "normal" users, you'll often see dozens of spammy web notifications (pornographic content, "30% off, BUY NOW", etc...). And because these are average users, they don't necessarily understand how to configure their devices to reduce or eliminate the spam.

Web push notifications needs a way to proactively filter out those that abuse the API, otherwise its doomed to become just another vector for spam that pisses off end users.

Re: Why is Apple acting like an asshole?

#240

Post by tmd83 » Wed, Sep 16, 2020, 5:45 PM UTC

ClumsyPilot wrote: post #200

malux85 wrote: post #192

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah agree, and I'd say it's better to hide them away in settings because most users have no idea what those error messages mean. For example my auntie calling me in tears because windows "had performed an illegal operation" (verbatim error message text) and she was terrified she was going to prison.

Stongly disagree, as much as this example is hilarious and toching, it really isn't typical. Many non-dev folks around me have resolved windows errors by typing the error message or code into google - if they are spesific and well written, they enable you to do that!

Strongly agree with you. When Apple things fails to 'just work' it is a nightmare. I used to have this issue for downloading MacOS updates. My internet wasn't too fast and it would get interrupted and restart from zero. Who can't do download resume in the last 10 years, I would assume only apple. My office network was faster and we also had those cache server, it worked for everyone except me. MacOS provided zero hint and it 'just failed to work'. Office internet was fast enough to download in multi MB/s yet Apple update weeks after released (so I don't think there was rush and it was US night) would have speeds 50 KB/s to This is just one example that I vividly recall. The simplest of operation downloading of an update, only apple can make it as big a nightmare as it was. Now they do a lot of things fabulously but when the fail they just fall on their face and ignore it or they would fail where I can't even imagine how to fail this bad.

The latest blunder (again download), my iPhone lost it's wifi after a fall and wow! behold you can't download an update over cellular. Apple will make you save your money by not using your expensive cellular data after all it's so much more expensive than your $800 phone.