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IBM looking for 12 years’ experience in Kubernetes administration

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Re: IBM looking for 12 years’ experience in Kubernetes administration

#231
post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This happened to me - got a call from a recruiter who said client needed 10 years. I replied 'I was a teenager back then' to which she said 'so you don't have enough experience?'. I responded 'Well I helped create the thing, it hasn't been around 10 years'. Silence followed, I was thoroughly dis-interested after that.

> I was thoroughly dis-interested after that. Why? The experience and intelligence of the recruiter has almost zero correlation to the experience and intelligence of the people you'd be working with. Recruiting people / HR are just an administrative barrier to get through. Once you speak to the actual team you'd be working with, you can start being more discerning of the quality of the people.

> The experience and intelligence of the recruiter has almost zero correlation to the experience and intelligence of the people you'd be working with.

How do you figure? If you're perfectly qualified for a job and they don't seem to recognize that, what are they selecting for? You don't think that incompetence would have an impact on the quality of the team you'd be joining?

Re: IBM looking for 12 years’ experience in Kubernetes administration

#232
This problem of such a mad job description arises because of the disconnect between the hiring manager and the recruiters/sourcers (often aided by extremely broken tech).

Hiring Manager: I need a person with 10+ years of exp

Sourcer/recruiter: Ok, what skillz?

Hiring Manager: Cloud, Dev, Ops, SysAdmin - 10 years

Sourcer/recruiter: mhmm, what else?

Hiring Manager: Oh, also, someone with good k8s experience will be great!

Sourcer/recruiter: so, that's like, how many years?

Hiring Manager: one or two on top of the ones I said before

Sourcer/recruiter: Got it!

This "12+ years with k8s" "15 yrs with React" "10 years with Powershell 5" situation is because of such disconnect. Having worked in that industry sector has made me so aware of how broken hiring is, it is such a dark and gloomy present and future - aided by more tools that get put by people who do not really want to solve the problem but just make it someone else's.

Re: IBM looking for 12 years’ experience in Kubernetes administration

#233

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://archive.fosdem.org/2019/schedule/event/kubernetesclu... I'd like to add that I find it scary that this basic info can't be found, neither by a cursory web search, nor on wikipedia. Makes you worry about a future generation raised in naive march-of-progress narratives wondering about how things came to be during the "dark ages" (= today) of the web

All of the patterns and default code referenced there were things I wrote or helped write or reviewed, and while a certain “java patterns” mindset was common in early devs, I can assure you we didn’t transcribe it from Java, we simply used patterns we were familiar with from previous languages. None of the open-source Kube project was “transcribed from Java” to the level being described here. Kris isn’t wrong, but th…

Understood, just mentioned it in this context. Actually I find the honest "our codebase sucks" attitude a good sign for a proj FWIW.

Re: IBM looking for 12 years’ experience in Kubernetes administration

#234

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean it also puts a bad light at the company. If they don’t even know when the software they want someone to be experienced in was released, how world they even judge if the applicant is competent in it?

Could just be a miscommunication between recruiters and devs of the company.

Which is a red flag on its own.

Re: IBM looking for 12 years’ experience in Kubernetes administration

#235
post #136
post #22

> I saw a job post the other day. > It required 4+ years of experience in FastAPI. > I couldn't apply as I only have 1.5+ years of experience since I created that thing. https://twitter.com/tiangolo/status/1281946592459853830

This happened to me - got a call from a recruiter who said client needed 10 years. I replied 'I was a teenager back then' to which she said 'so you don't have enough experience?'. I responded 'Well I helped create the thing, it hasn't been around 10 years'. Silence followed, I was thoroughly dis-interested after that.

Lie to them. They want you to lie to them. They are DEMANDING that you lie to them. They will PUNISH you if you don't lie to them.

So lie. It's what they want.

And if you don't, someone else will.

Re: IBM looking for 12 years’ experience in Kubernetes administration

#236

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I was thoroughly dis-interested after that. Why? The experience and intelligence of the recruiter has almost zero correlation to the experience and intelligence of the people you'd be working with. Recruiting people / HR are just an administrative barrier to get through. Once you speak to the actual team you'd be working with, you can start being more discerning of the quality of the people.

The recruiter likely didn’t write the job description. The team that needs the person did. If they are so stupid as to do this, I wouldn’t want to work for them either.

Usually the team does, HR reviews and makes corrections and then the recruiter gets it.

HR is where things can go very wrong.

Re: IBM looking for 12 years’ experience in Kubernetes administration

#237

Recruiters putting silly time requirements on skills is nothing new. My favorite moment of this type was at a meetup for .NET, where a recruiter came in and asked for too many years of experience, and the entire room burst out laughing. She just smiled, accepted the grief we all were giving her, and changed the job description to be accurate. I forget the exact wording she used, but I remember the gist of her respons…

> and changed the job description to be accurate

Accurate? No, I don't think that's the correct word. The value was changed, but it was gibberish before and remains gibberish afterwards.

Re: IBM looking for 12 years’ experience in Kubernetes administration

#238

Earlier quoted context omitted.

After I had worked as a software engineer for about 5-6 years, struggling with impostor syndrome during portions of that time, I decided to apply for a job at Google mostly just to see what would happen. Guess what happened? They ghosted me. Nothing. No 'thanks, but no'. Just nothing. I remember that it I felt embarassed and was frankly a bit ashamed that I hadn't received a reply. It took a while before I realized t…

It's tough. You can't take it personally. Most likely if you have a good buzzword list you're worth a conversation at least. Another data point: 30 years exp, I just finished a job search for remote s/w. Total time to sign was about 5 weeks. * 10 cold applications, all with good fits and detailed covers and research: 1 cold no; 1 few interviews then a no; 8 ghosts after bot ack * 1 internal referral: got to final tal…

Yeah, no, I know. Google is a big company and my application probably got lost, overlooked or buried in a sea of applications. Still, I think it reflects poorly on a potential employer to ghost candidates.

Re: IBM looking for 12 years’ experience in Kubernetes administration

#239
post #225

Earlier quoted context omitted.

After I had worked as a software engineer for about 5-6 years, struggling with impostor syndrome during portions of that time, I decided to apply for a job at Google mostly just to see what would happen. Guess what happened? They ghosted me. Nothing. No 'thanks, but no'. Just nothing. I remember that it I felt embarassed and was frankly a bit ashamed that I hadn't received a reply. It took a while before I realized t…

I think they dodged a bullet since you took it so personal.

No, I know it wasn’t anything personal. Google is a big company and my application probably got lost in a sea of applications. Still, I think it reflects poorly on a potential employer to ghost candidates.

Re: IBM looking for 12 years’ experience in Kubernetes administration

#240

I recently reviewed some resumes a recruiter (clearly) wrote for their candidates. The recruiter must have thought that listing every tech the applicant ever used was a good idea. Even long discontinued products. And they seemingly added typos, turned things into acronyms incorrectly, listed tech under incorrect categories, etc. They were so painful to read and I'd imagine would have embarrassed the candidates if the…

Your keyword matching hypothesis is likely correct, but doesn't that make the typos more damning?

The typos I saw were in descriptions, not any jargon that would be a keyword. Although case sensitive matching would have missed some of it.

JavaScript - yes

Javascript - yes

javascript - yes

JAVASCRIPT - no

JAVAScript - no

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