Everything You Know About Fitness is a Lie • Hacker News Board

Re: Everything You Know About Fitness is a Lie

#231

Post by xiaoma » Fri, Mar 04, 2011, 6:26 PM UTC

keeptrying wrote: post #83

mmaunder wrote: post #43

This is a one sided view of fitness. e.g. there is zero focus on cardio. Would be interesting to see one of these guys do a light 5 mile run. Look into real world training: running, hard hiking with a pack, mountain biking, swimming/surfing. These types of exercise have been the most rewarding for me in terms of skeletal, muscle and cardio fitness. The only thing I agree with in the article is that cardio machines in…

I once trained for a 5k race by doing just squats. I beat most of my "cardio" friends. When you start squatting above your BW then you'll be just as out of breath after 8 reps as after a full-on 5k run. Your heart will beat just as fast, and youll be sweating about the same. Also squats will improve your bone density. Don't be fooled that suffers like Laird get their physique from surfing. All of them dead lift and s…

>I once trained for a 5k race by doing just squats. I beat most of my "cardio" friends.

How fast were you?

Re: Everything You Know About Fitness is a Lie

#232

Post by richcollins » Fri, Mar 04, 2011, 6:27 PM UTC

NickPollard wrote: post #70

ilovecomputers wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Also, don't eat boxed foods or foods that went through multiple stages of processing. In Defense of Food by Michael Pollan spells it out very well, but I'll just give you my simple definition: Eating healthy is as close to eating dirt without actually eating dirt. Produce, grain, cheese, 1/2 pound to a pound of meat a week[1], and whatever else Marion Nestle recommends[1.5]. Just imagine what primitive man would eat.…

I'm not going to argue that what you describe isn't good, but 'nature intended us to' isn't a particularly solid argument. You could argue that nature intended us to die from Malaria by the age of 30, I'm very glad that for most of the world that's no longer the case.

It's more that we're taking health risks by eating novel foods (things that weren't available as we evolved). There is a lot of evidence that insulin response is responsible for metabolic syndrome. There is also some evidence that the lectins in grains promote malabsorption of dietary nutrients.

Re: Everything You Know About Fitness is a Lie

#233

Post by tjogin » Fri, Mar 04, 2011, 6:32 PM UTC

yummyfajitas wrote: post #185

tjogin wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Squats, dead lifts, bench presses, those are the Big Three. That's what you absolutely need to do, and if you do them it is where 90% of your results will come from. It's also the only exercises you need to ever do. Having said that, if you "like" some other exercise, like cable chest presses, dumbbell flyes, standing barbell bicep curls, crunches, or whatever, then fine do them (I do), but do so knowing that the Big…

What about pullups? The big three you mention don't seem to hit your upper back, biceps or shoulders much. (I'm a novice, genuinely curious.)

They're great, better than the complimentary ones I listed, but not strictly necessary if you do the Big Three.

The areas you mention are covered by the dead lifts, especially shoulders and upper back. The bicep is a relatively tiny muscle that we tend to over train because of its "reputation" so to speak, but at a beginner to intermediate level, it really does get enough from just the dead lifts. You might want to re-evaluate that when you can dead lift at least 2x your body weight though.

Re: Everything You Know About Fitness is a Lie

#234

Post by ilovecomputers » Fri, Mar 04, 2011, 6:32 PM UTC

Cushman wrote: post #222

ilovecomputers wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Also, don't eat boxed foods or foods that went through multiple stages of processing. In Defense of Food by Michael Pollan spells it out very well, but I'll just give you my simple definition: Eating healthy is as close to eating dirt without actually eating dirt. Produce, grain, cheese, 1/2 pound to a pound of meat a week[1], and whatever else Marion Nestle recommends[1.5]. Just imagine what primitive man would eat.…

As someone who went from being pretty overweight to really fit simply by following a policy of eating no sugar or grains and as much deliciously fatty meat, eggs and cheese as I want, I have strong skepticism towards the conventional wisdom about "healthy" foods.

You only made a case against the lipid hypothesis, which Michael Pollan also criticized in his book, so you have fallen into his trap of eating healthy and didn't even know it.

Re: Everything You Know About Fitness is a Lie

#235

Post by tjogin » Fri, Mar 04, 2011, 6:38 PM UTC

keeptrying wrote: post #204

yummyfajitas wrote: post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What about pullups? The big three you mention don't seem to hit your upper back, biceps or shoulders much. (I'm a novice, genuinely curious.)

I would do chinups/pullups/pushups/dumbell-presses instead of bench press. If you have long arms then bench press can lead to shoulder injuries as you approach 1xBW if you dont do it right. Lots of great info at t-nation.com .

Of those, only the dumbbell presses are even an alternative to the bench press.

Dumbbell presses are fine. But bench presses are better, and if you do them, you don't need to do dumbbell presses (but do, if you like them, I do too, as a complimentary exercise).

Injuries are nothing to scoff at of course, and you should always make sure to not put on more weight than you can safely manage. Regardless of exercise method.

Re: Everything You Know About Fitness is a Lie

#236

Post by mortenjorck » Fri, Mar 04, 2011, 6:39 PM UTC

JoelMcCracken wrote: post #144

desigooner wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's precisely why the "nature intended us to" argument doesn't really work for me when I hear people trying to convince me to try the Paleo diet. Whatever the benefits might be (besides making the author of those books a good chunk of money), they can be garnered by other means. What I hate even more is when a few devotees of such diets go on a slant about vegetarianism/veganism etc. etc.

I went from being a vegetarian to the paleo diet (or, actually, the "primal" variant). I thought about making this really long, but instead, realize that primal/paleo people use the primitive human as a model, a "common sense" starting base, and then apply liberal amounts of scientific knowledge to get a working solution. It has changed my life. When I follow the diet, it has been pretty impossible not to lose weight…

A good friend of mine made the same transition (vegetarian to paleo) and says the same: it changed his life.

Re: Everything You Know About Fitness is a Lie

#237

Post by kenjackson » Fri, Mar 04, 2011, 6:40 PM UTC

rdouble wrote: post #230

kenjackson wrote: post #182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Both are too easy to hurt yourself. This is why, for example, why deadlifts are generally not recommended for professional athletes. For example, notice Kobe doesn't do deadlifts: http://www.nbaplayerworkouts.com/kobe-bryant The delta in benefit is not worth a back injury.

That article says Kobe does power cleans, which are riskier than deadlifts for back injury.

I tend to find them a lot safer. The weight used is a lot less and is much more forgiving of improper back posture. With that said, for beginners, I do think that the Power Clean is more dangerous. More places to make a mistake. But for an ahlete with strength training background, deadlift is more dangerous, I think largely due to the weight. I've seen too many people with what looked like perfect form hurt their back.

Re: Everything You Know About Fitness is a Lie

#238

Post by freshfey » Fri, Mar 04, 2011, 6:46 PM UTC

jacques_chester wrote: post #133

jokull wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's an emphasis on improving scores and people get carried away for sure. But in the two boxes I've trained at there's a culture for good form and working on technique. "Honesty in motion, honesty in counting". I believe it's a CrossFit thing.

> I believe it's a CrossFit thing. Based on this claim I assume also that Crossfit invented the barbell, the bumper plate and gravity. The sudden outburst of anecdotes about how your Crossfit gym rooly trooly emphasises form seems to have come after years of sustained criticism by strength coaches and Olympic weightlifting coaches. It's as simple as this: nobody -- not me, not you, not your coach, not the pros -- nob…

I completely agree about the Oly lifts. There isn't a bad exercise, just bad form.

Re: Everything You Know About Fitness is a Lie

#239

Post by pjscott » Fri, Mar 04, 2011, 6:50 PM UTC

Splines wrote: post #160

baddox wrote: post #5

These links to auto-printing pages are unacceptable. Link me to the normal display article in these cases. I'll take it from there.

Browsers should just not have auto-printing. How much time is saved by not having to press CTRL+P? Likewise, how much time is wasted because of unintentional print dialogs (like this one) and how much time is wasted in developing and maintaining such a feature? I say cut it, nobody is going to miss it.

Printing from browsers in general is a mess. Is there a printable version of the page? Is there a CSS stylesheet that changes the appearance for print? Do you use Ctrl-P, or is there some little "click here to print" button you have to find on the page to not have everything be messed up?

I didn't realize how complicated this was until I tried to explain it to my grandparents.

Re: Everything You Know About Fitness is a Lie

#240

Post by rdouble » Fri, Mar 04, 2011, 6:50 PM UTC

kenjackson wrote: post #237

rdouble wrote: post #230

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That article says Kobe does power cleans, which are riskier than deadlifts for back injury.

I tend to find them a lot safer. The weight used is a lot less and is much more forgiving of improper back posture. With that said, for beginners, I do think that the Power Clean is more dangerous. More places to make a mistake. But for an ahlete with strength training background, deadlift is more dangerous, I think largely due to the weight. I've seen too many people with what looked like perfect form hurt their bac…

I have a back injury from weightlifting in high school, so I view deads (and the entire "olympic lifts for desk jockeys" meme) with suspicion. However, I think people mainly get in trouble because they try to do too much weight, too soon.