Alarming surge in drug-resistant HIV uncovered • Hacker News Board

Re: Alarming surge in drug-resistant HIV uncovered

#231

Post by tripzilch » Sat, Aug 03, 2019, 8:51 AM UTC

ghostwriter wrote: post #81

iamnotacrook wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's hard to imagine nowadays for many people, but ignorant, uninformed opinions like the one you just typed were quite rare before the internet; now they're commonplace. You're not supposed to make up stuff to defend your country, nor to parrot some crap someone else said without thinking about it. You're supposed to think about stuff and make at least a little effort to determine whether something is true, or wheth…

Can you substantiate your rant with facts? The U.S. for decades has been the leading country in drugs r&d and other countries do use the results of it on subsidized terms. https://www.abpi.org.uk/facts-and-figures/science-and-innova...

I find this SO hard to believe. It just does not pass the bullshit test, you know?

How come the US spends zillions on drug research and then sells that research for pennies to everybody except themselves?

I mean the logical conclusion to me, is that the real value of this drug research is in fact much lower than the pharma industry pretends it to be, hence they can't sell it for such insane prices abroad as they can in the US where they control regulation.

Also, there is this comment which, if true, illustrates that point perfectly: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20582411

Re: Alarming surge in drug-resistant HIV uncovered

#232

Post by tripzilch » Sat, Aug 03, 2019, 9:04 AM UTC

StreamBright wrote: post #131

Nasrudith wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Monosopy doesn't depend upon anything the US does. They have local control of IP even if they tied it to others. There would be costs involved but they can always tell them to get stuffed and manufacture their own if they won't be reasonable. Notably there is a lack of pharmaceutical companies who decide to abandon world markets entirely because positive N is always greater than 0.

I mean US produces recently the 57% percent of new drugs. https://media.xconomy.com/wordpress/wp-content/images/2014/0... I am not sure this explains the discrepancy between the healthcare cost between US and Switzerland. More in depth analysis: "There were two causes of this massive increase: government policy and lifestyle changes. First, the United States relies on company-sponsored private health insurance. The g…

> For example, U.S. hospital prices are 60 percent higher than those in Europe.

That's a rather weird statement.. I suppose it's true in some sense, but what I'm reading online from real people in the US is that they get bills that are easily 10-100x as much money for going to the hospital than I get.

There's a few others I wonder about:

> These programs spurred demand for health care services. That gave providers the ability to raise prices.

At least requires some numbers, because I'm constantly hearing about Americans not going to the doctor because for the real fear it might bankrupt them.

> The healthiest 50 percent only consume 3 percent of the nation's health care costs.

This is also questionable. Again maybe technically true, but not suitable for conclusions.

The ailments, pain and other bad stuff that Americans will walk around with instead of going to the doctor is incredible (again for the real fear it might bankrupt them). In the US I spoke to a real person who was trying DIY dentistry. There was an AskReddit thread about what general advice doctors say people shouldn't do, and the top advice was: don't perform operations on yourself.

I'm pretty sure it's the price driving down demand.

> The U.S. medical profession does a heroic job of saving lives.

Wait, why does it suddenly stop comparing to the EU?

> But it comes at a cost. Medicare spending for patients in the last year of life is six times greater than the average. Care for these patients costs one-fourth of the Medicare budget. In their last six months of life, these patients go to the doctor's office 29 times on average. In their last month of life, half go to the emergency room. One-third wind up in the intensive care unit. One fifth undergo surgery.

And this is different in the EU because ... ?

I don't like these statistics. I think they're using them to lie with.

Re: Alarming surge in drug-resistant HIV uncovered

#233

Post by tim58 » Sat, Aug 03, 2019, 2:03 PM UTC

feanaro wrote: post #106

roel_v wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It meant (to me) that there are several 'pockets' of this happening simultaneously, it's not some local 'strain' or 'outbreak'. I thought it was a crucial thing to add, for nuance. Not sure why you're so agitated over this.

I think it's because the poster understood it as saying they were geographically distant "from us", rather than that they are geographically distant from each other .

root comment here. For the record I intended to use the term to imply that they are geographically distant from each other and the mutation is probably not from single parent.

Re: Alarming surge in drug-resistant HIV uncovered

#234

Post by rowanG077 » Sat, Aug 03, 2019, 2:37 PM UTC

malandrew wrote: post #228

rowanG077 wrote: post #226

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't hate the player hate the game. The consumer didn't choose to have greedy companies that like to make a quick bug over someones suffering.

The consumer only exists because of these "greedy companies". You can't consume what doesn't exist.

What? A person being sick only exists because of "greedy companies"? Are you on drugs or something?

Re: Alarming surge in drug-resistant HIV uncovered

#235

Post by malandrew » Sat, Aug 03, 2019, 5:12 PM UTC

rowanG077 wrote: post #234

malandrew wrote: post #228

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The consumer only exists because of these "greedy companies". You can't consume what doesn't exist.

What? A person being sick only exists because of "greedy companies"? Are you on drugs or something?

a person who is sick is just a person who is sick. They don't become a consumer until they consume something and for that you need someone to produce something to consume. A consumer is defined by consumption. Consumption is only possible if there is something to consume. They is only something to consume if that something is produced/created. That means that someone cannot be a consumer without the people who create whatever it is they consume.

This is pretty simple semantics. Not sure what you're struggling to understand here.

Re: Alarming surge in drug-resistant HIV uncovered

#236

Post by malandrew » Sat, Aug 03, 2019, 5:19 PM UTC

tripzilch wrote: post #231

ghostwriter wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you substantiate your rant with facts? The U.S. for decades has been the leading country in drugs r&d and other countries do use the results of it on subsidized terms. https://www.abpi.org.uk/facts-and-figures/science-and-innova...

I find this SO hard to believe. It just does not pass the bullshit test, you know? How come the US spends zillions on drug research and then sells that research for pennies to everybody except themselves? I mean the logical conclusion to me, is that the real value of this drug research is in fact much lower than the pharma industry pretends it to be, hence they can't sell it for such insane prices abroad as they can…

Chicken and the egg question:

If this regulation in the US did not exist, would these drug companies and the medicines they've developed even exist?

Which came first the patent protections or the companies that depend on them?

In the case of orphan drugs, it's indisputable that it was the legal framework enabling profits that made orphan drug development possible.

Re: Alarming surge in drug-resistant HIV uncovered

#237

Post by ChrisRR » Tue, Aug 06, 2019, 7:41 AM UTC

jdietrich wrote: post #150

ChrisRR wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's insane. In the UK the NHS doesn't supply it yet, and GPs won't officially recommend it. But you'll find the NHS clinics quite often recommending prep purchase through international websites and referring you to HIV charities. It costs about £30 pm in that case which is about $40 Often they'll be running studies at the same time to assess the feasibility of Prep on the NHS.

PrEP is now available on the NHS in Scotland and on a pilot basis in England, Wales and Northern Ireland. https://www.iwantprepnow.co.uk/prep-on-the-nhs/

Thanks for the info