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Google Fights Back

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Re: Google Fights Back

#231

Post by clairity »

TulliusCicero wrote: post #203
clairity wrote: post #191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

you're rationalizing, i.e., looking the other way to avoid cognitive dissonance. but part of why we have such big brains is to anticipate the future, not simply accept events as they occur. what might the future you say? should we ignore that gas leak in the kitchen because it hasn't killed anyone yet? it's important to expose this kind of mis-rationalization, especially when tiny individual harms accumulate otherwis…

This word, I don't think it means what you think it means. > should we ignore that gas leak in the kitchen because it hasn't killed anyone yet? No, but it's hard to see how using personal data to sell ads is going to cause a harm anywhere near as bad as a person dying.

> "...using personal data to sell ads..."

again with the misdirection. look the other way if you like, but you're letting google choose the information you access and believe (even with ads). if you don't understand the power therein, maybe you should study more of your namesake.

Re: Google Fights Back

#233

Post by gowld »

mirkules wrote: post #160
kinkrtyavimoodh wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> deeply unethical the way it was presented to me as a user How was it presented to you in a way that you found deeply unethical? As I understand it shows up as a soft notification on your phone.

It is unethical, or at the very least, unsettling the way it is presented. I am actually in awe at how many folks - especially HN folks - are ok with this. Years ago, I looked at my Google dashboard. They knew when i filed for taxes, how much was owed/reimbursed, my medical history. NONE of which I consented to Google using. Google is constantly eroding the expectation of privacy we have wrt to our emails (and probab…

Some people appreciate the convenience of an automated valet, and use opsec to have their sensitive conversations on secure channels. It's not any more secure to store all your data on a webmail server that doesn't provide the Assistant stuff -- they can still leak or sell that data.

Re: Google Fights Back

#234

Post by gowld »

Jach wrote: post #215
areoform wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> but 100 years will anyone care that you had the flu on May 7 2019 My future health care provider might. Maybe they’ll spike rates by figuring out how often I’m ill using this data. Maybe I will marry a congressman someday and the sext that I sent today to my BF will be used to blackmail us. Maybe 30 years from now, people will be able to use my youthful indiscretions as leverage. Maybe I won’t get certain jobs beca…

Maybe they'll lower your rates by figuring out how often you're ill. Similarly with life insurance. Or they might not change. Maybe someone will try to blackmail you and your congressman husband, but both of you will just shrug, because no one cares at all about nudes. Not even you, after a few more decades of information wanting to be free and becoming free and public. Maybe it's better that you didn't get those job…

That's a whole lot a Maybe that's drastically at odds with millenia of human nature and human history.

Re: Google Fights Back

#235

Post by scarejunba »

bovermyer wrote: post #13

I'm impressed with the direction Google is taking, and how they've pivoted in the face of public awareness of privacy concerns. I like the Google products and services that I use. There are some that I miss (Reader) and some that just confuse me (Bookmarks), but the core works for me. Based on commentary I've seen, I may be the only person on Hacker News to think so. Regardless, I'm hopeful for the future.

Me too. Their stuff just works and where it doesn't, I want to give it more of my data.

Re: Google Fights Back

#236

Post by [deleted] »

pdimitar wrote: post #158
amf12 wrote: post #157

Earlier quoted context omitted.

iPhone has the Google keyboard in the app store. I use Swype keyboard though.

I know and use it. But it's much less precise than its Android counterpart due to Apple not giving it the exact touch sensor readings. As a result, it's not that good. :(

[deleted]

Re: Google Fights Back

#237

Post by lwhsiao »

mceachen wrote: post #189
darkwizard42 wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you are espousing an "ADS ARE INHERENTLY BAD" mentality that just doesn't resonate with people. I want to know about the best services that are useful for me. I do not want to be advertised women's swimsuits on Instagram (I'm a male with no interest in purchasing said item). When I see ads that are useless its infuriating. However, when I see an ad for Allbirds or a cool new leather jacket, I feel very much i…

Please don't discount how deep the rabbit hole goes with adtech. I spent over a decade in adtech. I have several patents from > 8 years ago for metadata-based ad targeting. While I agree with you that it is better to see relevant ads over irrelevant ads, the datastores that enable fine-grained behavioral targeting is, simply put, just too much power for any corporation (or government) to wield. Corporations directly…

> One of the richest sources of metadata about you and your loved ones are your photos. I quit my day job to build a self-hosted, life-scale photo store, partly as a passion project, partly driven by disgust and penance from prior adtech work.

This sounds interesting. Do you have any links you can share?

Re: Google Fights Back

#238

Post by esoterica »

jtolmar wrote: post #197
joefkelley wrote: post #178

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wait, so you trust them to store the email, and parse it for something like spam detection, but not for some smarter feature? What specifically are you concerned about that is a problem with this and not with them having the email in the first place? Sounds like you shouldn't be using Gmail at all tbh.

You trust snail mail carriers not to read your mail. The digital equivalent of the envelope is encryption - the carrier is allowed to see the outside but not the inside. The function of encryption is lack of comprehension - the carrier still knows the exact encrypted bytes of your mail, but cannot comprehend it. We generally accept that this is already a useful proxy for privacy. Imagine a mail protocol that somehow…

That is a philosophically incoherent model of privacy. The singularity notwithstanding, computers cannot “comprehend” anything. Spam filtering and credit statement parsing are no different. It’s all just ones and zeros being shuffled around.

Re: Google Fights Back

#239

Post by OkGoDoIt »

amf12 wrote: post #157
pdimitar wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh I agree on the text input completely. Google's keyboard on Android is like a mind reader when you do swipe/gesture typing. If there's one thing I miss dearly in Android to this day it's exactly that.

iPhone has the Google keyboard in the app store. I use Swype keyboard though.

On iOS, 3rd party keyboards block access to the voice typing function which is a dealbreaker for me. At least on my iPhone SE, it takes so long to switch between a 3rd party keyboard and the iOS keyboard to use voice typing that it's too painful to be worth it.

Re: Google Fights Back

#240

Post by 01100011 »

pgeorgi wrote: post #75
loudtieblahblah wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Google is already not Google. The "Don't Be Evil" corporation that valued open source rather than open-washing, that valued openstandards over "oops, we didn't mean to break that for you!" isn't here anymore. The company that bends over backwards, much farther than the law requires, to enable the surveillance state. I despise Apple. Especially on mobile. No SDCards, no headphone jack, walled garden app stores. Ugh ug…

> And i don't believe for a second the data they're allowing you to "autodelete" genuinely gets deleted. It just gets removed from your view. While "deleted" might take a while (eventual consistency FTW), any company with a presence in the EU has a lot to lose if such a scheme (beyond what they declare, eg. "31 days to recover your account") ever sees the light of day.

I wonder how they define 'your data'? If I train a neural net to recognize you and predict your behaviors and preferences, are the weights of the network yours, or can I keep them? What if the network covers you and your family? Do I have to retrain my network?
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