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Lyft Files for IPO

reuters.com

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Re: Lyft Files for IPO

#231

Post by [deleted] »

calvinbhai wrote: post #213
jazzkingrt wrote: post #204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What a great example! I'm realizing that perhaps the "second mover advantage" may be more pronounced in markets with low switching costs. Flyers can easily compare airline prices against one another, and drivers are incentivized to boot up 2nd, 3rd and 4th driving apps. Low-margin businesses can't afford to spend as much on R&D, make mistakes, etc. They have to win with small executional advantages.

IIRC, Lyft was the first mover, Uber shamelessly ripped off Lyft's model that anyone can be a driver and come out with Uber X. So, imo Lyft was the first mover, but was smart to let Uber face all the heat sacrificing short term growth for long term success. Uber has been in too many things for me to believe that they can sustain the business (I may be wrong)

[deleted]

Re: Lyft Files for IPO

#232

Post by a13n »

docker_up wrote: post #63

From a purely investment point of view, why would anyone invest in Lyft over Uber? Lyft has a smaller footprint and only operates in the US (except Toronto). They are more susceptible to economic conditions in a single country, the US, and every point of marketshare they get is a zero-sum game against Uber and presumably expensive because Uber won't give it up for free. Uber has a global operations, is in multiple st…

I have the opposite opinion. Why would anyone invest in Uber over Lyft?

Uber has a brand people hate, and is losing market share to Lyft. They have room to shrink.

Meanwhile, Lyft has a brand people love, is taking market share from Uber, and is starting to expand internationally (Canada). They have room to grow.

Re: Lyft Files for IPO

#233

Post by docker_up »

pmart123 wrote: post #195
docker_up wrote: post #63

From a purely investment point of view, why would anyone invest in Lyft over Uber? Lyft has a smaller footprint and only operates in the US (except Toronto). They are more susceptible to economic conditions in a single country, the US, and every point of marketshare they get is a zero-sum game against Uber and presumably expensive because Uber won't give it up for free. Uber has a global operations, is in multiple st…

Southwest Airlines for a long time just focused on point-to-point flights, avoiding money-losing flight patterns that routed passengers through a Chicago to New York type connection. Additionally, SWA only maintained 737's, and free checked baggage allowed for faster onboarding and deplaning, and therefore, faster turnaround times. Eventually, this little airline became the largest airline after the major airlines bo…

> Instead of settling a lawsuit over allegedly stealing self-driving car technology, it is focusing on its core product. Instead of buying 19-month-old scooter company for $2B, it is spending money on its core value proposition.

But Lyft has a self-driving car group in Palo Alto, and it bought the bikesharing company, Motivate.

Re: Lyft Files for IPO

#234

Post by chimeracoder »

Lammy wrote: post #228
calvinbhai wrote: post #213

Earlier quoted context omitted.

IIRC, Lyft was the first mover, Uber shamelessly ripped off Lyft's model that anyone can be a driver and come out with Uber X. So, imo Lyft was the first mover, but was smart to let Uber face all the heat sacrificing short term growth for long term success. Uber has been in too many things for me to believe that they can sustain the business (I may be wrong)

Sidecar was the first mover :) https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sidecar_(company)

Sidecar launched in 2011. Lyft nominally launched in 2012, but was really a continuation of the same product and company that the founders had been running since 2007, just under a different name.

Re: Lyft Files for IPO

#235

Post by mathattack »

docker_up wrote: post #63

From a purely investment point of view, why would anyone invest in Lyft over Uber? Lyft has a smaller footprint and only operates in the US (except Toronto). They are more susceptible to economic conditions in a single country, the US, and every point of marketshare they get is a zero-sum game against Uber and presumably expensive because Uber won't give it up for free. Uber has a global operations, is in multiple st…

Every investment is about price. You may get a better price (relative to sales, or whatever) for Lyft. They may have less of other risks too.

Re: Lyft Files for IPO

#236

Post by glitch003 »

pmart123 wrote: post #195
docker_up wrote: post #63

From a purely investment point of view, why would anyone invest in Lyft over Uber? Lyft has a smaller footprint and only operates in the US (except Toronto). They are more susceptible to economic conditions in a single country, the US, and every point of marketshare they get is a zero-sum game against Uber and presumably expensive because Uber won't give it up for free. Uber has a global operations, is in multiple st…

Southwest Airlines for a long time just focused on point-to-point flights, avoiding money-losing flight patterns that routed passengers through a Chicago to New York type connection. Additionally, SWA only maintained 737's, and free checked baggage allowed for faster onboarding and deplaning, and therefore, faster turnaround times. Eventually, this little airline became the largest airline after the major airlines bo…

>Instead of buying 19-month-old scooter company for $2B

Actually, Lyft has a scooter program that is the result of an acquisition.

"It wasn’t until July, when Lyft acquired Motivate, the nation’s largest bike-share operator, that the company began to send signals that it was considering joining the frenzy."

https://www.theverge.com/2018/9/6/17824040/lyft-electric-sco...

Re: Lyft Files for IPO

#237

Post by davrosthedalek »

ghaff wrote: post #209
katzgrau wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Completely agreed. There's always a second-mover advantage for burgeoning industries in that second-movers can avoid the mistakes that the first movers have become entrenched in.

Lyft has gone through quite a few iterations of its own. Predecessors started before Uber but, even more recently, it moved beyond the pink mustache and fist bumping into being essentially an Uber clone. I (and apparently others) found the whole "be buddies with your driver" thing to actually be a real turn-off.

I agree, for me too. On the other side, the "we want to get rid of drivers" and "squeeze driver" type of stories I hear from Uber made me go to Lyft by default. Most drivers I ask which drive for both prefer driving for Lyft.

Re: Lyft Files for IPO

#238

Post by the_reformation »

dcposch wrote: post #215
the_reformation wrote: post #200

The most exciting implication here is that we can finally pour over the financials of a major ride-hailing company. Whether these companies have the unit economics to succeed is, remarkably, still an open question.

Sorry to be a grammar right wing populist, but it's "pore over". To pore is to think deeply about to something, to dwell on it. A pour-over is a type of coffee.

damn it

Re: Lyft Files for IPO

#239

Post by bytematic »

docker_up wrote: post #63

From a purely investment point of view, why would anyone invest in Lyft over Uber? Lyft has a smaller footprint and only operates in the US (except Toronto). They are more susceptible to economic conditions in a single country, the US, and every point of marketshare they get is a zero-sum game against Uber and presumably expensive because Uber won't give it up for free. Uber has a global operations, is in multiple st…

Doesn't have to be 1 company making all the money. Apart from that, most drivers use both apps

Re: Lyft Files for IPO

#240

Post by mherdeg »

chimeracoder wrote: post #234
Lammy wrote: post #228

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sidecar was the first mover :) https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sidecar_(company)

Sidecar launched in 2011. Lyft nominally launched in 2012, but was really a continuation of the same product and company that the founders had been running since 2007, just under a different name.

Yeah it was an interesting pivot. They started as the electronic version of the "ride board" [like http://resources.mit.edu/resource/apo-ride-board ] and took a while to change.

Here is a press release from Zimride sent circa Thanksgiving 2008 (after they had been underway for about a year):

===

STUDENTS TO FIND RIDES HOME FOR THANKSGIVING ON FACEBOOK Useful Facebook application, Carpool, helps match students for rides home

Finding a ride home for Thanksgiving with friends and classmates has never been easier. Students can conveniently use a Facebook application to share rides home for some home-made turkey. The application built by Zimride is called "Carpool", and having launched in 2007, it has become the most popular online ridesharing service in North America.

Carpool on Facebook is especially popular among students on college campuses, where it has replaced traditional ride boards at student centers with a more convenient online interface. Over 25,000 rides have been posted on Carpool in the last four months. "The growth is unprecedented," comments Logan Green, a co-founder of Carpool. "It shows that not all popular Facebook applications have to involve ninjas and vampires. An application like Carpool helps students find safe rides in addition to cutting their gas expenses and reducing CO2 and it's clear students value that."

The Carpool application uses Google Maps technology to match students traveling in the same direction. After the trip, users are encouraged to leave feedback, to help inform future Carpool users. The application makes ridesharing a more social experience. "It really feels like I'm part of a community," says Corey Earle a student of Cornell University. "I could never trust an anonymous service like Craigslist because I wouldn't know anything about the other users. Using Carpool on Facebook, I can choose to ride with people in my school who I know I can trust.' Carpool on Facebook was built by a team of recent graduates who saw an opportunity to make carpooling more popular at universities across the country. John Zimmer, a co-founder of Carpool, says, 'We're thrilled that university students and administrators are reaching out to us to help make ridesharing become a part of mainstream culture on college campuses." Zimride has worked with over 20 universities since creating the service to build custom systems for their campuses.

If you have a car, offer your carpool today. If you don't have a car, find a ride and get home to the home cooked turkey, stuffing, gravy and cranberry sauce…don't forget to share!

To try out the Carpool on Facebook: http://apps.facebook.com/carpool

For more information on Zimride visit: www.zimride.com

===

Here was a sample use of a version of the product in a 2011 email:

===

Subject: [Reuse-sell] Ride from MIT to NYC or [city] NJ, Depart Oct. 21 1pm, Return Oct. 22 10am

I have rented a car for a trip to [city] NJ.

I am leaving from MIT at 1pm on Fri. Oct. 21.

I am returning from [city] NJ at 10am on Sat. Oct. 22

If you want to share the ride on either of the two directions let me know. I expect the total rental plus gas to cost me $120. I am looking for someone to pitch in $20 for each one-way journey.

I have posted on zimride too: http://zimride.mit.edu/ride/share?ride=[id]

Thanks, [name]

===

I think the deal is that the company pivoted mid-2012 to an Uber clone and sold the Zimride subsidiary to Enterprise in 2013.

I wonder how much of the Zimride engineering team went to Lyft during the pivot.

I wonder who has the longest tenure at Enterprise's Zimride subsidiary and how they feel about working there vs. working at Lyft.

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