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Kubernetes for personal projects? No thanks

carlosrdrz.es

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Re: Kubernetes for personal projects? No thanks

#231

Post by pm90 »

oblio wrote: post #230
tomc1985 wrote: post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is weird to hear developers say this. The tooling around your app is essential to understanding how it runs, why would someone not know this stuff?

Because they don't care, what they're doing is good enough and at the end of the day they want to go home and enjoy what they like together with the loved ones. Shocking, truly :p I know this is a dirty thought, here on Hacker News.

I don't think its a dirty thought; its a different perspective. But I do suspect that one of the qualities of a good hacker is to be relentlessly curious about how things work, to set up something and then be curious about how it works "under the hood", and to dedicate some serious time to learning it. Inevitably, that has an effect on relationships and general life.

Re: Kubernetes for personal projects? No thanks

#232

Post by oblio »

pm90 wrote: post #231
oblio wrote: post #230

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because they don't care, what they're doing is good enough and at the end of the day they want to go home and enjoy what they like together with the loved ones. Shocking, truly :p I know this is a dirty thought, here on Hacker News.

I don't think its a dirty thought; its a different perspective. But I do suspect that one of the qualities of a good hacker is to be relentlessly curious about how things work, to set up something and then be curious about how it works "under the hood", and to dedicate some serious time to learning it. Inevitably, that has an effect on relationships and general life.

I'm not in the camp I described in the previous comment, I was just making an observation.

> Inevitably, that has an effect on relationships and general life.

I'll make another observation: I don't think so. There's plenty of people who lack curiosity that led happy lives. I don't think anyone can prove a correlation between curiosity and success in life.

Heck, one could joke that there's a reason most proverbs say the opposite, in almost every language out there ("curiosity killed the cat" in English, "curious people die young", in my native Romanian).

Re: Kubernetes for personal projects? No thanks

#233

Post by Aeolun »

wpietri wrote: post #228
weberc2 wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the original article made a good point, and one that seems to be overlooked by pretty much every critical response: if you don't already know standard sysadmin tooling and procedures, then the value proposition for k8s for small projects alone is probably comparable to standard sysadmin tooling. At least with k8s, you can take that knowledge with you when you want to scale. I don't know if I'm totally convinc…

Do you really thing you can set up and run a Kubernetes cluster, even a small one, without significant understanding of standard sysadmin tooling? I know a fair bit, and I didn't find it easy.

You certainly can, but you need to find that one easy way to do it, that only appears obvious in hindsight.

Re: Kubernetes for personal projects? No thanks

#234

Post by Aeolun »

justinsaccount wrote: post #160
wgjordan wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Still A single service on a single machine, how do I safely upgrade it? Depending on your OS-package's provided init script (here Ubuntu), it's as simple as `service nginx reload`, (`service nginx upgrade` if upgrading nginx itself). Or skip the init script entirely with `/usr/sbin/nginx -s reload`.

I am asking how one would safely upgrade the service that nginx is proxying to, not how to restart nginx.

sudo apt-get upgrade?

Lets not make it more difficult than it has to be.

Re: Kubernetes for personal projects? No thanks

#235

Post by Annatar »

dang wrote: post #225
Annatar wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Don't waste your time, he's a troll that pops up on every thread that has anything to do with things like docker or k8s." Thank you for an off-topic opinion. Yes, I do "pop up" on every Kubernetes and Docker topic because both are nothing but hype and bullshit (this topic with "no thanks" is a rare exception, and I wholeheartedly agree with the author of it, even though I vehemently disagree with some of his methods…

The personal attack wasn't ok, but please don't "pop up" on every thread to say predictable things. Pre-existing agendas are tedious, and tedium is what we all come here to avoid.

If we're here to avoid pre-existing agendas, then Docker and Kubernetes promotional articles tick every box on the "tedious" agenda.

The best part is, the article is about "no thanks" to Kubernetes, which I wholeheartedly agree with and have stuck to commenting relevantly to the topic, backed up by plenty of citations.

Re: Kubernetes for personal projects? No thanks

#236

Post by justinsaccount »

Aeolun wrote: post #234
justinsaccount wrote: post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am asking how one would safely upgrade the service that nginx is proxying to, not how to restart nginx.

sudo apt-get upgrade? Lets not make it more difficult than it has to be.

The new version fails to restart properly. Your site is now down. You upgraded the package so now you no longer have the old version on disk and can't easily start the previous version.

Let's not pretend that blindly upgrading a package is the same thing as safely rolling out the new version of a service.

Re: Kubernetes for personal projects? No thanks

#237

Post by Aeolun »

Draiken wrote: post #51
wheresvic1 wrote: post #6

Totally agree with the author, for my side projects in Node.js, I use the following: - pm2 for uptime (pm2 itself is setup as a systemd serivce, it's really simple to do and pm2 can install itself as a systemd service) - I create and tag a release using git - on the production server, I have a little script that fetches the latest tag, wipes and does a fresh npm install and pm2 restart. - nginx virtual host with ssl…

Honestly, you could do that in almost the same time on Kubernetes. I understand why people might not want to invest the time onto learning a new technology, but that's not a reason to say it's a bad fit. If you know how to use Kubernetes, doing these bash scripts and doing a few YAML files will take basically the same time and the end result will be vastly superior on Kubernetes.

Good luck setting up an email server on kube. Or a git repository for that matter

Re: Kubernetes for personal projects? No thanks

#238

Post by yebyen »

Annatar wrote: post #235
dang wrote: post #225

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The personal attack wasn't ok, but please don't "pop up" on every thread to say predictable things. Pre-existing agendas are tedious, and tedium is what we all come here to avoid.

If we're here to avoid pre-existing agendas, then Docker and Kubernetes promotional articles tick every box on the "tedious" agenda. The best part is, the article is about "no thanks" to Kubernetes, which I wholeheartedly agree with and have stuck to commenting relevantly to the topic, backed up by plenty of citations.

I mentioned our talk to my coworker, his immediate response was "does he work for Oracle?"

I'm only half seriously asking but, do you? (Given the certifications you mentioned, I think that even if you don't, there is a vague subjective case that you do...)

Re: Kubernetes for personal projects? No thanks

#239

Post by talkingquickly »

hardwaresofton wrote: post #44
talkingquickly wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd be really interested in how you're approaching persistence? I've also found self managing clusters provisioned with kuibeadm fairly hassle free until persistence is involved. Not so much setting it up (e.g. rook is fairly easy to get going with now), but the ongoing maintenance, dealing with transitioining workloads between nodes etc etc.

tl;dr - Rook is the way to go, with automatic backups set up -- using rook means your cluster resources are ceph-managed, you basically have a mini EBS -- Ceph does replication across machines for you in the background, and all you have to do is write out snapshots of the volume contents from time to time just in case you get spectacularly unlucky and X nodes fail all at once, in just the right order to make you lose…

This is an amazing response, thank you!

Re: Kubernetes for personal projects? No thanks

#240

Post by denvrede »

Aeolun wrote: post #237
Draiken wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Honestly, you could do that in almost the same time on Kubernetes. I understand why people might not want to invest the time onto learning a new technology, but that's not a reason to say it's a bad fit. If you know how to use Kubernetes, doing these bash scripts and doing a few YAML files will take basically the same time and the end result will be vastly superior on Kubernetes.

Good luck setting up an email server on kube. Or a git repository for that matter

Why exactly do you think someone needs luck with that? I'm honestly curious.
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