Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

How the Catalan government uses IPFS to sidestep Spain's legal block

la3.org

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

231–240 of 565 posts

Re: How the Catalan government uses IPFS to sidestep Spain's legal block

#231

Post by toyg »

pvaldes wrote: post #204
ukoki wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So? If they want independence who are we to deny it? If your spouse wants a divorce, if your children wish to disown you — you can't deny them just because it's an inconvenience — it is their right.

This analogy is repeated again and again but is a bad example. A divorce is not "a right", is an agreement regulated by law between two previously married people to put a legal end to the relationship. The true fact is that I can't divorce from my wife without her permit and she could not divorce from me without me agreeing to sign the divorce papers. Does not match the case of one part splitting unilaterally. A bett…

> I can't divorce from my wife without her permit

What? You totally can, at least in most countries, as long as you can prove that your wife did something wrong. Can Catalunya prove that Spain did something wrong? Yeah: Franco.

Re: How the Catalan government uses IPFS to sidestep Spain's legal block

#232

Post by lottin »

icebraining wrote: post #157
pipio21 wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, it is normal since independentists have controlled Catalunya since 40 years ago. It used to be that 20% of the population was independentist through, now is over 50%. For example, they choosed school principals among independentist so now over 85% of them are Catalan language teachers that tend to be independentist. This way kids could be directed to be independentist too. The same happened with the local media…

How is being "forced" to speak the local language any different than what any other schooling system does? Do Madrilenian schools allows kids to choose their primary language, now? They brought nearly a million muslim people to Catalunya to work Only ~520k Muslims live in Catalunya. Meanwhile, Andalucia has more than 300k and Madrid over 280k, so it's not like there's such a big difference. http://observatorio.hispan…

There has never been such a policy of promoting Muslim immigration in Catalonia. It's one of the many myths propagated by certain groups in Spain.

Re: How the Catalan government uses IPFS to sidestep Spain's legal block

#234

Post by gotbeans »

amelius wrote: post #112

As an outsider, it's strange that nobody here seems to question whether the referendum really makes sense. Forgetting about Catalonia for a moment, isn't it fundamentally amoral that a part of the country where prosperity has (by mere chance) concentrated suddenly wants to split off? Isn't this taking wealth-inequality to the next level? Of course the people in a prosperous part of the country want to split off. Abso…

Catalan here. There are historic and cultural reasons to split also.

The economic rationale behind your post is absolutely correct. However we don't want to split because we don't want to share; we want to split because of the missuse and economic opression and the unending corruption that plagues Spain. We don't think ourselves of so-prosperous at all in that sense - and at the same time I'll admit corruption is always an issue in democracy, but Spain's case is taking it to ridiculous levels.

Let me post sources in few for what I'm saying, on the phone right now.

Re: How the Catalan government uses IPFS to sidestep Spain's legal block

#235

Post by elecbit »

euyyn wrote: post #190
elecbit wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Think out of the box. Is moral a law that forbids people speaking? Self-determination is in the human rights and Catalonia has more than 1000 years of history, culture and language. Democracy cannot be illegal, so this banning must be disobbeyed. Without disobbeying, woman and black people would not vote nowadays, so history proves it is a good way to take down immoral legal laws. EDIT: UN experts say that Spain must…

> Spain must respect fundamental rights in Catalonia. Freedom of expression, freedom of press and power separation Spain respects fundamental rights in Catalonia and anywhere else in the country; respecting them is the supreme law of the land. Anyone who violates those rights will have the courts after them the exact same way as the courts are acting against this referendum.

However, United Nations experts don't think the same as you.

http://www.ohchr.org/EN/NewsEvents/Pages/DisplayNews.aspx?Ne...

Censorship in internet. Opening private letters. Political detentions and raids to political parties offices, searching for posters and ballots. Bringing 10000 policeman by boat to avoid a vote.

Sound quite authoritarian to me.

Re: How the Catalan government uses IPFS to sidestep Spain's legal block

#236

Post by monort »

lederhosen wrote: post #226
elecbit wrote: post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tyranny is a group not allowing another group to decide what to do. Hear yourself: "the referendum is not legal". Such a nice view of what democracy is. So willing to vote and say goodbye to this bla-bla-bla-this is not legal, that is not legal. Good bye opressors. My deceased family in the war the dicator won will be really happy if we can finally separate. Too many open wounds you have never tried to heal.

So if they succeed to split would you call it tyranny not to let pockets of Castilian speaking minority areas in Catalonia claim independence? Maybe joining Spain? Where would this end (maybe there are pockets within the pockets within the pockets)? It is a practical shitty situation. Do not make it sound SIMPLE. Do not use the word tyranny when it does not apply. And the rich leaving the poor seems like a right wing…

What's wrong with independence of small groups? The more governments - the more competition. Why are we against big monopolies in every area, except the state services?

Re: How the Catalan government uses IPFS to sidestep Spain's legal block

#237

Post by joe_the_user »

justin66 wrote: post #122
tcard wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not a lawyer and I don't have an opinion on the Spanish government's or judicial system's concrete actions to stop a illegal law to take effect, but: the only websites, posters, etc. being seized are those paid for and organized by the Catalan government. Any association, political party, or individual is completely free to campaign for whatever they want, including independence. We have a Spain-wide constitution…

> The NORMAL reaction by the state is to apply it, and stop the Catalan government from breaking it. It's interesting that you think so. I'd say the normal thing to do would be to issue a press release pointing out that the results aren't legally binding under the constitution and whoever wastes government money running a referendum on the thing might be held criminally or civilly liable. Actually trying to STOP the…

This is incorrect.

If, for example, the State Of California, in the US, were to organize, without constitutional mandate, an "official" referendum calling for succession, Federal Marshall would be all over that in a blink of an eye.

And I'd agree that heavy-handed action gives the Calatan separatists quite a boost ... for the short term. But states don't really have choice about enforcing the law when a significant actor is visibly flouting that law. That's just how the law works, more or less everywhere it exists.

IE, the situation is as the GP states.

Re: How the Catalan government uses IPFS to sidestep Spain's legal block

#238

Post by pvaldes »

contravariant wrote: post #194
TheMagicHorsey wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"by mere chance" Is that your opinion, or do the Catalonians and people outside Spain agree?

Does being conveniently located to trade on the Mediterranean sea count as chance or not?

Valencia is also in the same line, but there is a dirty secret that nobody wants to hear and much less admit.

Franco, being the same horrible dictator that killed a lot of innocent people, favoured actively Catalonia's economy over other provinces, for decades.

Is true that he discouraged them to speak in Catalonian language, but also discouraged people to speak in Galician language (and Franco was born in Galicia). At the same time give them priority in the efforts to rebuild industry and infraestructures after the civil war. Catalonia is richest than other parts of Spain, in part because Franco wanted 1) having a cluster of industries next European frontiers and roads to trade and obtain foreign divises easily, 2) money from tourism 3) conjurate the revolts giving the area a special silk-hand treatment after the first iron years passed.

Specially in the late stages of franquism, a massive exodus of workers from other parts of Spain migrated and stablished in Catalonia atracted by the favourable conditions to work and live and the "smell of freedom".

I'm aware that this counts as black heressy for millions of young people in the area, but well... nobody will stop them to read history books about post-war if they want. Ask your grandpa. Everybody in Spain has an uncle or some cousins in Barcelona.

Oppression is not something allowing you to became one of the more modern and rich places in the country; oppresion, to me, is what happened to Extremadura in the same period for example.

Re: How the Catalan government uses IPFS to sidestep Spain's legal block

#239

Post by toyg »

kilburn wrote: post #20
codewithcheese wrote: post #18

It seems shocking that Spain a member of the EU is resorting to these tactics. Can you discuss some of their justifications for doing so?

The spanish constituion explicitly states that Spain is an indivisible country. Hence, the Constituional Court (that is elected by the parliament) has ruled out that any referendum about independence is illegal. At this point, the government says that both them and the judiciary powers are just defending the democratic rules, and Catalonia's government is the one at fault for all this hassle. The problem is that it i…

> The spanish constitution

... was drafted 40 years ago by a Franchist establishment concerned with maintaining a certain degree of continuity. It's not surprising that the people most oppressed by Franco are not particularly happy with the result.

Besides, the Wilson doctrine is usually more relevant for this sort of movements than whichever piece of paper is supposed to be law here or there. A population cannot be denied the right to self-determination, which includes splitting off if they really want to. It can be a stupid move (see Brexit), but people must be given the possibility to democratically discuss it and vote on it; because otherwise things will eventually go full Balkan, and you never want to go full Balkan.

Re: How the Catalan government uses IPFS to sidestep Spain's legal block

#240

Post by StavrosK »

Ah, that explains why I saw various catalán sites being pinned on the IPFS pinning service I run (https://www.eternum.io), which also runs a public writable gateway (so you can access IPFS files, including the banned catalán websites, through it).

Having just gotten back from Barcelona, I have to say that the way the Spanish government is handling this is far from ideal. I don't very much support the Catalonian plea for independence (I haven't heard any good reasons other than "but our freedom"), but blocking sites seems... suboptimal.

As for the crypto itself, why not use bcrypt? Your users don't care if it takes three seconds, but it makes attacks entirely infeasible.

Post reply on HN