Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Guy Finds StarCraft Source Code and Returns It to Blizzard

kotaku.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

231–240 of 307 posts

Re: Guy Finds StarCraft Source Code and Returns It to Blizzard

#231

Post by wtetzner »

braveo wrote: post #226
Dylan16807 wrote: post #221

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You don't see any difference between physical property and source code? I can't wait until you find out that sufficiently old intellectual property goes public, while sufficiently old houses don't go public! Have fun blaming that on me splitting hairs when it wasn't my idea. More seriously, intellectual property is a number of different things lumped together, and they serve different purposes. Copyright exists to en…

So the splitting of the hairs you're attempting is to point out that IP typically expires at some point, and therefore we should all consider anything "old" as effectively having expired IP, regardless of whether that's true or not. Blizzard's IP hasn't expired, your argument here holds no water.

IP is different that physical property. If someone takes something physical from anther person, the original owner loses that object. But if someone "takes" (copies) source code from someone, the original owner still has it. Now two people have it instead of one.

By the way, I'm not making any arguments about morality. I'm just pointing out that IP is different from physical property in important ways.

Re: Guy Finds StarCraft Source Code and Returns It to Blizzard

#232

Post by wtetzner »

Tactic wrote: post #230
Svekax wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You buy a box of old documents on Ebay. It contains an original manuscript of The Fellowship of the Ring with J. R. R. Tolkien's edits and notes in the margins. Tolkien's estate demands the copy back so they can burn it. You should mail it to them because they own it, right? It's just a book, right? No, you shouldn't. They owners shouldn't be able to destroy it for the same reason we have laws protecting monuments an…

Do they own it? If so, yes. Give it back. What they do with it is on them. Crucify them, not the person doing the right thing. If you don't like Blizzard's stance, deal with them, not criticize someone for not achieving the end you prefer.

> Do they own it? If so, yes. Give it back.

The boundaries of legal ownership and those of what some consider morally acceptable might be different, so I don't think it's so black and white.

On the other hand, I agree that people shouldn't be criticizing someone for not doing something illegal, especially because they are the one who would have to face the consequences of taking illegal action.

Re: Guy Finds StarCraft Source Code and Returns It to Blizzard

#233

Post by wtetzner »

crimsoneer wrote: post #213
seanp2k2 wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

you're not distributing it and I'd trust the people at the Internet Archive to keep it anonymous and Do the Right Thing.

Yes, and when Blizzard notice that exact same source code you have conveniently appeared on the internet a few months later from an anonymous source, I'm confident they won't inform the police and sue me to fuck.

So send it to Blizzard anonymously as well.

Re: Guy Finds StarCraft Source Code and Returns It to Blizzard

#234

Post by braveo »

wtetzner wrote: post #231
braveo wrote: post #226

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So the splitting of the hairs you're attempting is to point out that IP typically expires at some point, and therefore we should all consider anything "old" as effectively having expired IP, regardless of whether that's true or not. Blizzard's IP hasn't expired, your argument here holds no water.

IP is different that physical property. If someone takes something physical from anther person, the original owner loses that object. But if someone "takes" (copies) source code from someone, the original owner still has it . Now two people have it instead of one. By the way, I'm not making any arguments about morality. I'm just pointing out that IP is different from physical property in important ways.

It's an unimportant distinction for the purposes of this discussion.

Under the law, damages have occurred, especially if someone then takes that source code and makes it public.

So whether you have 2 copies or 1 copy or umpteen copies, if you've economically affected someone, you will lose that fight in court.

But this is not relevant to this discussion and I think we should keep on topic.

The point is this:

Dylan16807 is just trying to rationalize something that he wants, which is for the source code to be public.

It doesn't matter how IP differs from owning a house. It doesn't matter if it can be copied (and thank you for having the arrogance to explain that on board full of developers, btw...).

None of this matters. What matters is that Blizzard paid for the creation of the code, and they're afforded protections under the law.

Re: Guy Finds StarCraft Source Code and Returns It to Blizzard

#235

Post by jhasse »

jhasse wrote: post #218
braveo wrote: post #211

Earlier quoted context omitted.

and the property rights to my house are unimportant because the house is 20+ years old. oh wait.... something is wrong with that thought process, but I'll let you split another hair in your attempt at a meaningful dichotomy.

If I steal your house, that means that you lost it. The same isn't true for the code, as Blizzard would still also have it (along with the right to distribute binary copies of it, which is a million times more valuable).

What would be the damages for Blizzard if he had released the code?

Re: Guy Finds StarCraft Source Code and Returns It to Blizzard

#236

Post by jhasse »

braveo wrote: post #225
jhasse wrote: post #218

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If I steal your house, that means that you lost it. The same isn't true for the code, as Blizzard would still also have it (along with the right to distribute binary copies of it, which is a million times more valuable).

this distinction does not matter, if you steal my code and release it I can sue for damages exactly the way I would if you were to somehow steal my house.

What would be the damages for Blizzard if he had released the code?

Re: Guy Finds StarCraft Source Code and Returns It to Blizzard

#237

Post by ant6n »

jakebasile wrote: post #56
scrollaway wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Did you? :) Starcraft influenced the culture and politics of an entire nation and became a national sport. It pioneered "e-sports". It's a piece of history, and this disc is standalone a piece of history as well. I think I know right from wrong, but I would still have absolutely no idea what to do if that disc landed on my doorstep. Edit: I cannot believe this is such a controversial thing to say. Shame on the people…

But it's still owned by Blizzard. It doesn't matter how important it was, they still own it. I am 100% sure the guy did the right thing in returning it, not only legally but morally as well. If Blizzard were to MIT license it that'd be amazing but they're the only ones with the power to do so, no matter who finds a copy in a box.

If somebody leaked it, it wouldn't change the ownership or the copyright itself. It would still be Blizzards code. It simply wouldn't be a secret anymore.

Re: Guy Finds StarCraft Source Code and Returns It to Blizzard

#238

Post by hsod »

sneak wrote: post #184
gottam wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Like I said, from a black and white legal standpoint it was the right move. But so much was lost from not simply uploading it somewhere from an internet cafe. It enters the same ethical flexibility as things like wikileaks in my opinion

there is no ethical issue with keeping the secrets of others you have no obligation or commitment to keep.

Does this mean that if you find a random person's diary, there is no ethical issue with publishing it?

Re: Guy Finds StarCraft Source Code and Returns It to Blizzard

#239

Post by moftz »

wtetzner wrote: post #228
scrollaway wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I apply the golden rule: if someone found the code I wrote for a groundbreaking piece of software, and I didn't want to open source it, I'd really like for them to respect my wishes and return it. Is that really the golden rule? What about "the good of the many"? Returning it to Blizzard directly is good for Blizzard . Returning your code is good for you . Realistically, it has little monetary value (all the "value…

> Returning it to Blizzard directly is good for Blizzard. I'm not even sure if that's true. It's not like Blizzard didn't already have the source code. If some distributed the source code, what would happen? It's not like people could start releasing new StarCraft games to compete with Blizzard. And it seems unlikely that the source code is going to give someone some kind of an advantage it creating other competing g…

Someone could just reskin assets, change dialog, etc and revamp Starcraft into any RTS game. The AI and game code is what is really important for Blizzard to retain. It isn't the idea that people will compile Starcraft (Blizzard has released the game for free), it's the possibility that someone may profit off of all of Blizzard's efforts in writing the backend code for the game. I think it seems very likely that there would be a sudden influx of Starcraft clones and other RTS games made from the engine flooding every app store. Blizzard doesn't want people making money off their IP, plain and simple.

Re: Guy Finds StarCraft Source Code and Returns It to Blizzard

#240

Post by [deleted] »

braveo wrote: post #226
Dylan16807 wrote: post #221

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You don't see any difference between physical property and source code? I can't wait until you find out that sufficiently old intellectual property goes public, while sufficiently old houses don't go public! Have fun blaming that on me splitting hairs when it wasn't my idea. More seriously, intellectual property is a number of different things lumped together, and they serve different purposes. Copyright exists to en…

So the splitting of the hairs you're attempting is to point out that IP typically expires at some point, and therefore we should all consider anything "old" as effectively having expired IP, regardless of whether that's true or not. Blizzard's IP hasn't expired, your argument here holds no water.

[deleted]
Post reply on HN