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What Killed the Linux Desktop (2012)

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Re: What Killed the Linux Desktop (2012)

#231

Post by raarts »

CaptSpify wrote: post #191
j3097736 wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But why switch to a tiling window manager when XFCE + dmenu + custom shortcuts is good enough?

I think people often forget: Do what works for you. If XFCE+ is good enough for you, then great! stick with it! But if you want to try a different experience, or if you think that setup is inefficient (as I do), then try moving to something else! What works for one person likely won't work for another.

And this is what killed the Linux desktop. 99% of the population does NOT want to try a gazillion desktops (of which the installation is error prone), just to find out what 'works best for you'.

Re: What Killed the Linux Desktop (2012)

#232

Post by appleiigs »

no_wizard wrote: post #166
appleiigs wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, Office. Office compatibility still a problem for Macs in 2017. Either from FUD or in actual functionality, Office prevents people from switching from Win10 to MacOS. Two people asked me about moving to Macs. They repeatedly asked me about Office compatibility (the FUD). For one of the users, I wasn't sure if it was OK for functionality. She is a lawyer (ie. power user of Word) and I know in Mac Excel for me is n…

https://9to5mac.com/2016/01/21/windows-mac-ipad-microsoft-of... With 2016, it ain't much. Do they use a lot of VB scripts? I have found 2016 Office for Mac has been nearly 1 for 1 feature wise.

The features might be 1 to 1, but the compatibility problems I found is when you use Office in Windows at work, then work on same file on a Mac at home, then go back to Windows at work. The formatting can change. As an example, in Excel charts the colors will be different, the alignment will be off.

Also, I find Excel to be unbearably slow on a Mac, when the same file works OK in Windows. And yes, the VBA Editor on Mac versions aren't at par as in Windows.

When I bring work home, it's usually because of a deadline and these things will slow me down (including different keyboard mappings).

Re: What Killed the Linux Desktop (2012)

#233

Post by vacri »

CaptSpify wrote: post #190
vacri wrote: post #186

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just as a counterpoint, I use Debian on a Thinkpad as well, and while I don't print, wifi and sleep work without problems, and so did a SIM card I put into it for 3G - it 'just worked', and the only config I needed to do was pick which one of my ISP's "AP" names to use. That was surprisingly easy.

As another counter-counterpoint: I use Debian on a T460, and sound and wifi don't work out of the box. While it may be OOTB for some people that doesn't mean it's everyone. I think I've only had one laptop in the past 10 years (~4 laptops) that has worked OOTB with Linux.

Oh, I just mean that some things work really smoothly - it's not just a basket case. I didn't have to install or modify anything with the 3G modem and the network manager just took care of it (and prefers a wifi connection if one is live), which was surprising. This is an option that the biggest prestige laptop maker doesn't even offer.

Debian in particular won't work OOTB on most computers because their philosophy excludes proprietary drivers in the base install... and wifi loves proprietary drivers. That's a 'Debian-philosophy-specific' issue, not a 'linux' issue.

Re: What Killed the Linux Desktop (2012)

#234

Post by gens »

herbst wrote: post #214
adakbar wrote: post #200

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can agree on this, the booster was super key to show all window, I've never been this fast to context switch between window.

Yeah exactly. And super to start apps. Find documents. Its all just a super away

Xfce, kde (possibly unity, maybe enlightenment) can do the former. Dmenu (probably unity, kde, other standalone programs) and enlightenment can do the latter (Enlightenments Everything launcher is amazing).

Re: What Killed the Linux Desktop (2012)

#235

Post by em3rgent0rdr »

AnonymousPlanet wrote: post #84
VonGuard wrote: post #6

I think it was the inability for GUI's to stay stable. Gnome went off the rails, Unity completely ruined Ubuntu[1], and KDE always felt very cheap and hard to navigate. My opinion, yes, but I always felt the GUI changes in Linux were extremely gratuitous after Gnome 2. Couple this with the fact that for a decade, the actual GUI was tied very, very heavily to the apps. So you had to use Gedit in Gnome, or whatever the…

Comments like these really make me believe that it is people like you who are killing the Linux desktop. Of all the window managers and desktop environments I have tried the last years on Linux, Unity, Gnome3, and Cinnamon are the only ones that don't look and behave as if they are from fucking 2003. Those others might be enough for those people who have stopped adapting and like to be left alone under their rock, bu…

> "don't look and behave as if they are from fucking 2003"

2003 desktop environment was fine. Actually, there weren't significant benefits after Windows 95. On the contrary, modifications simply confuse users. I'm a big LXDE & MATE fan for this reason. If it works, don't fix it.

Re: What Killed the Linux Desktop (2012)

#236

Post by Twisell »

dorfsmay wrote: post #208
AnonymousPlanet wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If people were happy with Windows XP in 2003, why change it and install Linux? We deviated from what was good enough 15 years ago! Let's put XP back on the clients and Solaris back on the servers! /s When I started using Linux, it was about thinking out of the box and about change. It had many exciting window managers that put everything in Windows to shame when it came to customizing and style. Nowadays I have the f…

I'd use OSX if it could do focus follow mouse and had a trackpoint.

I'm not sure about the feature you talk about, but maybe have a look at accessibility settings of MacOS. They putted a lot of advanced settings in there targeted at various kind of handicap. However these feature can also be used to improve productivity.

Some developers even uses accessibility interface to add custom overlays & controls (Steam for instance).

Re: What Killed the Linux Desktop (2012)

#237

Post by netule »

FireBeyond wrote: post #143
soyiuz wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think it's the gui. I'm a relatively savvy user running Debian on a Thinkpad for more than five years now. Printing is still touch and go. I spent countless hours to get sleep working correctly. It is broken now and I don't have the energy to fix it knowing that nothing I do is guaranteed to last through the next apt update. Wifi will mysteriously refuse to connect with some routers (a daily struggle at the u…

Printing still sucks. Out of the box Ubuntu with my WF-3540... Add Printer shows the printer. Great! I hit Add and it says "Here's the OpenPrinting driver for it". Great! I click "Use this driver". It spins. And then acts like nothing has happened. I click it again. Same. I hit Cancel. Oh. Now my printer is installed... with the Generic Text Driver. So I go to OpenPrinting.org directly and download the driver myself.…

I have the same thing happen when I download the .deb file for Chrome from the site, open it in the Software Installer (or whatever it's called), it opens an icon in my tray and sits there forever, doing nothing. It's not until I do a sudo dpkg -i that I know that dependencies are missing and that's the reason it won't install. Explain that to a newbie.

Re: What Killed the Linux Desktop (2012)

#238

Post by [deleted] »

FireBeyond wrote: post #143
soyiuz wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think it's the gui. I'm a relatively savvy user running Debian on a Thinkpad for more than five years now. Printing is still touch and go. I spent countless hours to get sleep working correctly. It is broken now and I don't have the energy to fix it knowing that nothing I do is guaranteed to last through the next apt update. Wifi will mysteriously refuse to connect with some routers (a daily struggle at the u…

Printing still sucks. Out of the box Ubuntu with my WF-3540... Add Printer shows the printer. Great! I hit Add and it says "Here's the OpenPrinting driver for it". Great! I click "Use this driver". It spins. And then acts like nothing has happened. I click it again. Same. I hit Cancel. Oh. Now my printer is installed... with the Generic Text Driver. So I go to OpenPrinting.org directly and download the driver myself.…

[deleted]

Re: What Killed the Linux Desktop (2012)

#240

Post by ajuc »

AnonymousPlanet wrote: post #101
jhoechtl wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You forgot KDE/Plasma5. I think the most novel concepts are being developed there

KDE has always tried to play catch-up with Windows regarding style, leaving users in some kind of uncanny valley. And I'm not very impressed with what I've seen lately in KDE. That said, I'm hopeful something useful will come out of it.

Plasma was before there was anything similar on Windows.

But to be honest my perfect linux enviroment was kde 3.5. And I don't think "regular" people had any problems with uncanny valley. When I left for university I installed kde 3.5 on my parents' and my sisters' computers. My sister switched to windows 8 years later because of some apps she needs for work, parents still use Linux (but recently I installed them kde 5).

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