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“It's The Future”

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Re: “It's The Future”

#231

Post by themartorana »

IshKebab wrote: post #186
piva00 wrote: post #170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's all about simplifying deployment. That's it, that's what's so good about using containers. I don't know if you understand what Docker really is when you say something like this: "Run only one process in one brand new kernel", the kernel is shared between containers, that's the whole idea, you package the things your application need and be done with it. The current problem with containerization is that there are…

Doesn't statically compiling programs solve the deployment issue better? I mean, as far as I can tell Docker only exists because it's impossible to link to glibc statically, so it's virtually impossible to make Linux binaries that are even vaguely portable. Except now Go and Rust make it very easy to compile static Linux binaries that don't depend on glibc, and even cross-compile them easily. Hell I think it's actual…

Yes yes yes. We're nearly 100% Go on the backend and deployment is a breeze. We don't use Docker because it wouldn't give us anything beyond more things to configure. Our CI deploys binaries to S3 and the rest is just as easy.

Re: “It's The Future”

#232

Post by ryanmaynard »

rajeshp1986 wrote: post #109

The article perfectly summarizes my frustration and sentiment. These days I hear these buzzwords all time. I work as a consultant for an enterprise product and most people whom I meet they somehow catch these buzzwords and blurt it out in front of everyone during meetings and discussions to either showoff that they know technology and things that are in the market these days(also latest iphone, apple news, tesla, spa…

> I am frustrated by the industry as a whole. I feel industry is simply following marketing trends.

My work lands me in a number of different conferences in non-software industries. This is true for all industries. Its just that ours has a faster revolving door. That, in addition to a low barrier to entry (anyone can claim they're a web developer), leads to a higher degree of this madness. Its just part of human behavior to seek out, and parrot, social signals that let others know you, too, are an insider.

Personally, I have to avoid a great number of those gatherings, since the lot of them are just a circlejerk of low-density information. If I pay too much attention to those events, I catch myself looking down my nose, and since that isn't productive/healthy behavior, I avoid landing myself in a place where guys with buddy-holly glasses and argue which Wordpress plugin is the best.

Re: “It's The Future”

#233

Post by mseebach »

jules wrote: post #154
nicolas_t wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think that splitting into micro services is valuable if and only if you reach a scale where it makes sense to split into micro services. By scale, I mean the number of people on the team (if you have a lot of people, it can make sense to split into micro-services to limit communication bottlenecks between developers) or in term of traffic, in which case microservices can be very useful to better optimize the system…

In practice micro services mean that you turn a function or method call into a network request. This doesn't really limit communication bottlenecks. It is often more difficult to argee on a network interface than on a simple function or object interface. It's also more difficult to change. You introduce a whole new set of failure modes due to going over the network. Debugging is more difficult since you now can no lo…

I think that your comment is actually a pretty good test for when not to spin out a micro service.

If you expect to need to step into a function call when debugging, then it's too tightly coupled to spin out. You should be able to look at the arguments to the call and the response and determine if it's correct (and if not, now you have isolated a test case to take to the other service and continue debugging there).

If the interface will change so often that you expect it will be a problem that it's in a separate repository, if you expect that you will always need to deploy in tandem, then it's too tightly coupled to spin out.

The advantage of micro services is the separation in fact of things that are separate in logic. The complexity of systems grows super-linearly, so it's easier to reason about and test several smaller systems with clear (narrow) interfaces between them than one big. It's easier to isolate faults. It's harder to accidentally introduce bugs in a different part of the system when the system doesn't have a different part. If done right, scaling can be made easier. But these are hard architectural questions, there's no clear-cut rule for when you should spin off a new service and when you should keep things together.

Someone else mentioned separating the shopping app from the payment system for an ecommerce business, which even has security benefits. I think that's an excellent example.

Edit: Another clear benefit is that you can choose different languages, libraries, frameworks and paradigms for different parts of the code. You can write your boring CRUD backend admin app in Ruby on Rails, your high-performance calculation engine in Rust and your user-facing app in Node.js (so the front- and backend an share Javascript validation code).

Re: “It's The Future”

#234

Post by mbrock »

Spiritus wrote: post #223
mbrock wrote: post #183

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How do you write "foo | bar" in Python?

from subprocess import Popen, PIPE p1 = Popen(["foo"], stdout=PIPE) p2 = Popen(["bar"], stdin=p1.stdout, stdout=PIPE) p1.stdout.close() # Allow p1 to receive a SIGPIPE if p2 exits. output, _ = p2.communicate() https://docs.python.org/3.5/library/subprocess.html#replacin...

Thanks. Maybe I'll make a public Gist that's a kind of "foo | bar" cookbook for different languages...

Re: “It's The Future”

#235

Post by cerebellum42 »

This definitely reflects some of my experiences when trying out Docker and some of the other stuff associated with it.

Serious question though: I would absolutely love to have an introduction on how to use Docker to deploy one or two web applications that use a typical amount of backend services, say some sort of database and a redis server. All of this would probably run on a single VM (whether Amazon, DigitalOcean, Linode, ...) and you mainly use Docker to isolate the applications from each other in terms of the environment/dependencies that they need.

How do I do this with Docker in a way that gets me an easy deploy process? (Or maybe the question is actually, should I even do this with Docker?)

Re: “It's The Future”

#236

Post by pbiggar »

paradite wrote: post #172
hellofunk wrote: post #18

I assume this entire article is one piece of sarcasm. Because after reading it, how could any sane person not prefer Heroku?

Yes. You are right. At least you understand the author's intention. I would be worried if some non-technical people took the title literally...

Prepare to be worried: https://circleci.com/blog/it-really-is-the-future/

Re: “It's The Future”

#238

Post by jventura »

rajeshp1986 wrote: post #109

The article perfectly summarizes my frustration and sentiment. These days I hear these buzzwords all time. I work as a consultant for an enterprise product and most people whom I meet they somehow catch these buzzwords and blurt it out in front of everyone during meetings and discussions to either showoff that they know technology and things that are in the market these days(also latest iphone, apple news, tesla, spa…

Oh, I feel your pain! There's too much fashion going on in this industry, and the high salaries and the youth rediscovering the same concepts from 40 years ago doesn't help..

I mean, it's great to have this new tech and all, but when you're trying to build something to last some years, sometimes it's hard to filter the crap between all the buzzwords. It just reinforces the thought that smart people should just leave this field entirely or search for other fields of knowledge (or business) where our knowledge of programming can be made of use.

I'm 35 now, but I'm starting to realize that I will not have the patience to keep with all the crap just to be employable.. There are some areas where being old and experient is valuable. Philosophy, science, psychology, teaching, etc., are maybe some of them, but this industry is definitely not one of those areas. It makes me think that what I'm building now will some day be completely wiped out of existence..

Re: “It's The Future”

#240

Post by jalfresi »

IshKebab wrote: post #186
piva00 wrote: post #170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's all about simplifying deployment. That's it, that's what's so good about using containers. I don't know if you understand what Docker really is when you say something like this: "Run only one process in one brand new kernel", the kernel is shared between containers, that's the whole idea, you package the things your application need and be done with it. The current problem with containerization is that there are…

Doesn't statically compiling programs solve the deployment issue better? I mean, as far as I can tell Docker only exists because it's impossible to link to glibc statically, so it's virtually impossible to make Linux binaries that are even vaguely portable. Except now Go and Rust make it very easy to compile static Linux binaries that don't depend on glibc, and even cross-compile them easily. Hell I think it's actual…

Have to admit, as a fellow Go dev, with single binary static compiles, I don't really GET why I need docker... all it seems to offer is an increased workload and complicated build proc
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