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Bluetooth 5 will quadruple the range, double the speed

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Re: Bluetooth 5 will quadruple the range, double the speed

#231

Post by zeta0134 »

DiabloD3 wrote: post #218
zeta0134 wrote: post #215

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I used the Bluetooth Audio in my new car for about two weeks. It was actually pretty reliable, and felt like the future. I'd get in, turn the car on, my phone would pair itself and pick up where it left off, and I never once had to take it or my keys out of my pocket. Then I started to actually listen to my music. The audio over bluetooth was frequently out of tune. I'm a musician, so I can definitely hear this and i…

Your phone may already be able to do it on its own: get an OTG adapter for your phone (usually MicroUSB male to USB A female) and plug a USB cable in and use your phone directly.

Alas, my phone is running a newer version of Android, and does the Media Protocol thing instead of doing Mass Storage. I usually don't expect to be able to access its files in a sane manner over USB; it's hit or miss.

Instead, I use Syncthing, so my files are synced properly between the phone and my computer using my wireless network, no cables needed. I just copy the same folder to my USB drive periodically and don't need to mess with it beyond that. (In a pinch, I suppose I could use the OTG cable to update the USB drive using my phone.) I like being able to have the drive plugged into the car at all times, as it's one less thing to fiddle with when getting in and out.

If I'm going to plug a wire into my phone for my car, I'd much rather just use the standard AUX (3.5mm headphone jack) port that's built in, as it's simpler and more reliable. I still do this from time to time if I feel like using Youtube, Google Play, or another streaming based service, or if I need to hear something on my phone (like Navigation).

Re: Bluetooth 5 will quadruple the range, double the speed

#232

Post by sib »

lotyrin wrote: post #223
CaptSpify wrote: post #168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In my experience, if the implementation is wrong often enough that most people think the procotol/spec are to blame, than the protocol/spec are usually too complicated.

In my experience, no standard is too simple for someone to mess up implementing.

True, but in the case of BlueTooth, the standard is so complex that everyone does mess up implementing it.

Re: Bluetooth 5 will quadruple the range, double the speed

#233

Post by Someone »

I guess that is with the same power usage, as it would be disingenuous if that were different, but it would be nice to have that confirmed.

Also, I guess that, for many IoT devices, keeping range and speed the same while decreasing power usage significantly (although, as a third guess, I expect 'double the speed' means that devices can go to low power mode quicker, potentially halving power usage of the entire device) might be more useful.

Re: Bluetooth 5 will quadruple the range, double the speed

#234

Post by rcthompson »

nitrogen wrote: post #211
rcthompson wrote: post #167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I couldn't agree more. I have never used a Bluetooth device that didn't have connection issues at least daily. And that's not even taking into account the madness of pairing a device with multiple other devices (e.g. phone & PC) or the fact that you can't use USB and Bluetooth at the same time, because USB3 jams the 2.4GHz frequency. If USB and Bluetooth are going to be mutually exclusive, I know which one I'm going…

Do you mean wireless USB3 (is that a thing?), or that the USB3 copper cables leak that much interference?

The latter. I'm not sure if it's the cables or the circuitry in the devices, but most of my USB3 devices emit enough 2.4GHz noise when plugged in to prevent Bluetooth or WiFi from working with at least a few feet from the device. (5GHz WiFi is unaffected, of course)

Re: Bluetooth 5 will quadruple the range, double the speed

#235

Post by CaptSpify »

lotyrin wrote: post #223
CaptSpify wrote: post #168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In my experience, if the implementation is wrong often enough that most people think the procotol/spec are to blame, than the protocol/spec are usually too complicated.

In my experience, no standard is too simple for someone to mess up implementing.

To be clear: I'm not advocating for no standard. I'm advocating that BT needs to simplify the existing standard

Re: Bluetooth 5 will quadruple the range, double the speed

#236

Post by voltagex_ »

gman99 wrote: post #157
gtirloni wrote: post #148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have the same issue with a Philips SHB7150 headset. Music will play okay using A2DP (with occasional stuttering and pitch changes) but all Skype calls automatically revert to HFP (extremely bad quality). So the device has what looks like a decent microphone that is completely destroyed by Bluetooth (where in the stack this happens, I don't know).

>all Skype calls automatically revert to HFP (extremely bad quality) While it's true that audio quality over HFP is a lot worse than A2DP, note that A2DP is designed for cases where latency is not an issue, you want stereo audio, and there is no microphone audio to carry the other way. (i.e., designed to listen to music) If you want low latency mono-audio to the headset + microphone audio back to the host, there is n…

The problem is finding both the host (dongle/chipset/card) and client (headphone/speakerphone/headset) that support the correct versions. Most of the time the information isn't listed anywhere, and Windows certainly doesn't expose it by default.

Re: Bluetooth 5 will quadruple the range, double the speed

#237

Post by dpc_pw »

zeta0134 wrote: post #215
creativeembassy wrote: post #140

I could not care less. - 1.0 to 1.2: Hard to pair, and very unreliable. First major version, I'm sure they'll fix it... - 2.0: More bandwidth. Still hard to pair, still unreliable. - 2.1: Adds "Simple Secure Pairing". Still hard to actually pair. Still unreliable. - 3.0: More bandwidth. More features. Still hard to pair, still unreliable. - 4.0: Bluetooth Low Energy released. Still hard to pair, still unreliable. - 4…

I used the Bluetooth Audio in my new car for about two weeks. It was actually pretty reliable, and felt like the future. I'd get in, turn the car on, my phone would pair itself and pick up where it left off, and I never once had to take it or my keys out of my pocket. Then I started to actually listen to my music. The audio over bluetooth was frequently out of tune. I'm a musician, so I can definitely hear this and i…

You need bluetooth with AptX audio codec support. Most phones have it, but most cars don't (because cars are lagging with technology). I'm using separate bluetooth dongle powered from the lighter socket and plugged into car RCA port and my music sounds good now.

Re: Bluetooth 5 will quadruple the range, double the speed

#238

Post by stormbeta »

creativeembassy wrote: post #140

I could not care less. - 1.0 to 1.2: Hard to pair, and very unreliable. First major version, I'm sure they'll fix it... - 2.0: More bandwidth. Still hard to pair, still unreliable. - 2.1: Adds "Simple Secure Pairing". Still hard to actually pair. Still unreliable. - 3.0: More bandwidth. More features. Still hard to pair, still unreliable. - 4.0: Bluetooth Low Energy released. Still hard to pair, still unreliable. - 4…

While I definitely still have issues with Bluetooth keyboards and mice, I have three pairs of bluetooth headphones (two of which are BT4, one is BT3) and they work great.

The only real problem is switching between devices is still much more annoying than it should be (I ought to be able to just select the device from the drop-down on the desired device).

Re: Bluetooth 5 will quadruple the range, double the speed

#239

Post by starky »

jamesrom wrote: post #27

Bluetooth is very easy to hate. It never ever just works: the pairing rituals, the flakiness. It's annoying. But in recent years it has become more and more invisible. You've probably used Bluetooth in the past 12 months without noticing. Invisibility is something that the Bluetooth SIG should strive for.

I can think of one device where Bluetooth has been invisible, the Surface Pro 3 pen.

Re: Bluetooth 5 will quadruple the range, double the speed

#240

Post by digi_owl »

freyir wrote: post #205
XaspR8d wrote: post #172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm so glad this is the top comment, and matches my experience 100%. If a product brags about its Bluetooth support, I immediately start losing trust in it. So many devices have such bad UX for pairing too, so I can't even get any communication about what I'm doing wrong. I think BT-enabled cars are the worst offender here. Some of them don't even provide obvious alternatives to the voice menu. The only positive blue…

> If a product brags about its Bluetooth support, I immediately start losing trust in it Unfortunately, there aren't viable wireless connectivity alternatives for commercial products other than Wi-Fi for long range and Bluetooth for short range. And both suffer from high (and rising) interference levels in the ISM bands.

Wifi direct had the potential to be a Bluetooth alternative, but they skipped out on defining "profiles" for common use cases.

With Bluetooth you have a list of profiles that define protocols for various use cases.

A car head unit is likely using A2DP and AVRCP to handle the streaming and playback controls respectively. It may also implement HFP to allow it to act as a handsfree.

Wifi direct do not even, last i checked, have a defined protocol for transferring files between devices. This while Bluetooth supports OBEX, that allows you to either push individual files, or browse the storage of a device remotely.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Bluetooth_profiles

Thats the list of Bluetooth profiles at present.

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