Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

American students head to Germany for free college

marketplace.org

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

221–230 of 258 posts

Re: American students head to Germany for free college

#221

Post by madengr »

higherpurpose wrote: post #73
drvd wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Germans are not so obsessed about not paying taxes like e.g. Americans or Swiss. Nobody likes to pay taxes and everybody complains about the high taxes. But I think (actually hope!) that Germans understand (if only unconsciously) that happiness is much more depending on getting old without fear of poverty, knowing to be treated if ill, being able to go safely outside anytime anywhere, not dropping out of society if b…

If Germany is like other European countries, it also helps that your taxes are "automatically paid" to the government, usually by having the employer take them out of your salary and paying them. It's not like in US where Americans feel every dollar going to the government when they do their taxes. Since they are paid automatically, the income taxes aren't even on people's minds, usually. However, if Europeans had to…

Federal and state taxes are automatically withheld in the USA. Filing a return is usually an attempt to get some refunded, or in my case, getting screwed even more and writing a check. You can even be lucky enough to pay estimated taxes every quarter.

Re: American students head to Germany for free college

#222

Post by chronial »

ryandrake wrote: post #207
grkvlt wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The entry criteria aren't based on something like the SAT, although International Baccelaureate perhaps comes close in Europe? Not sure, maybe someone else can explain? So there are no prep classes or anything like that in the UK. Everyone sits the same set of exams (modulo being Scottish or English/Welsh/NI, which have different types of qualification) and those results dictate whether you can go to University or no…

Surely anywhere there are exams, there are rich parents paying for exam prep in order to gain an advantage.

In Germany, university admission is based on your final grades in school, which are an accumulation of your grades of the last two years.

Rich parents can of course help their kids be better in school, but there is no efficient exam prepping.

Re: American students head to Germany for free college

#223

Post by chronial »

grkvlt wrote: post #196
Nicholas_C wrote: post #187

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Absolutely not in my opinion. What about students that have to work while going to school? I had to do this and I can assure you that it really hurt my GPA. Other more well off students will of course have higher GPAs because they can afford not to work and can pay tutors. These students who have worked full time or have faced other difficulties will not be able to explain why their academics are lacking if it's enti…

But it's not just interest, it's ability to complete the course. Sure I might be interested in Mathematics, but terrible at it. What's the point of admitting me to an Honours Maths cousre? Also, there are usually strict legal limits on the hours you can work if you're under 16, which is when you'd be studying for the exams required for University admission, so I don't think it'd be much of an issue. Note that I'm thi…

Fun fact: Mathematics is not restricted in most German universities. If you are allowed to go to university in general, you are allowed to study maths – no matter your grades pre-university.

Re: American students head to Germany for free college

#224

Post by illvm »

higherpurpose wrote: post #73
drvd wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Germans are not so obsessed about not paying taxes like e.g. Americans or Swiss. Nobody likes to pay taxes and everybody complains about the high taxes. But I think (actually hope!) that Germans understand (if only unconsciously) that happiness is much more depending on getting old without fear of poverty, knowing to be treated if ill, being able to go safely outside anytime anywhere, not dropping out of society if b…

If Germany is like other European countries, it also helps that your taxes are "automatically paid" to the government, usually by having the employer take them out of your salary and paying them. It's not like in US where Americans feel every dollar going to the government when they do their taxes. Since they are paid automatically, the income taxes aren't even on people's minds, usually. However, if Europeans had to…

Anyone on a W-2 does have their taxes taken out automatically. That's what the whole purpose of filling out a W-4 prior to starting employment. Many people overpay in taxes and end up getting a substantial refund at the beginning of each year. How do Americans feel every dollar going to the government in this case?

Re: American students head to Germany for free college

#225

Post by lorenzhs »

eli_gottlieb wrote: post #135
lorenzhs wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Education in Europe is not free. You pay with your qualifications. If your university grades are not good enough, you go out fast. While Universities in the UK (and probably the US as well?) boast with their retention rates that seem to approach SLA levels of nine nines, it is the exact opposite in Germany. Some of our universities are proud of their drop-out rates >50%, partly because only good students will get a…

I went to undergrad in the US, and there's a similar, but disguised, phenomenon. The difficult majors (ie: faculties/degree paths) would have very high "drop-out rates", in terms of people changing tracks after the first year or two. So indeed, less than half the people who entered with a declared intention of completing a degree in Physics, Engineering, Computer Science, or Mathematics would actually do so. Quite a…

Or, you know, if professors were taught how to teach introductory courses. As far as I am aware there is no pedagogical training for professors in Germany. There certainly isn't any for TAs (who are simplay the professor's PhD students).

It's a lot easier for professor to teach a subject they are enthusiastic about to advanced students than it is to get students interested in an introductory course.

Re: American students head to Germany for free college

#226

Post by lorenzhs »

fnordfnordfnord wrote: post #193
legulere wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Until recently we paid 500€ in Bavaria per semester additionally to the around 50€ we still have to pay and abolishing it made quite the difference, especially to people whose parents don't earn that much.

May I ask how much a student should expect to pay for housing and food per semester?

Depends a lot on where and how you live, but 400-600€ should suffice easily if you're on a budget.

Re: American students head to Germany for free college

#227

Post by talideon »

dash2 wrote: post #64
randunel wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I work in London. The natives here consider the UK as a separate entity from Europe. They talk about the mainland as Europe, and compare themselves to "Europeans", not to "other Europeans". This is the British culture of "us vs them", or "we are too good to be associated with you" that I live in now :P

Reminds me of the perhaps apocryphal Times headline: Fog In Channel Continent Cut Off

That's a bit different though. It's typical in Ireland and the UK to refer to mainland Europe as 'the continent', whether they consider themselves European or not. The likes of the Faroe Islands, Iceland, Cyprus, Malta, the Channel Islands, &c. wouldn't be considered part of 'the continent', though some might consider the Mediterranean islands to be 'continental'. 'Continental Europe' is not the same thing as 'the continent of Europe', but a subset of it that excludes its island parts.

This is not unlike the way that the 48 contiguous states of the US are considered 'the continental US'.

Frankly, I find the attitude of some English people towards the continent and Europe as a whole to be somewhat silly.

Re: American students head to Germany for free college

#228

Post by eru »

iamjdg wrote: post #96
Amezarak wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's impossible for everyone to be a net exporter. At the same time, being a net importer is not in itself a bad thing. The reason the US doesn't have free college for everyone is not because it is a net importer. The US could afford Germany-style benefits; that's not the problem. Canada probably could too.

something to strive for no? i think of countries export to import ratios like personal finance income vs expenditures. if you spend more than you make, where we you get the money to reinvest in yourself. you'll borrow it until you can't make the minimum payments and then default. There are many reasons why the US does not have free college (taxes too low, universities are run like business now, etc.) but running huge…

Taxes in the US are not too low. In absolute numbers, the US takes in as many USD per resident per year as rich European countries. (They just have a lower GDP, so the ratio is higher.)

In comparison, Singapore does really well on a much lower tax base per capita. Excellent public infrastructure.

Re: American students head to Germany for free college

#229

Post by eru »

lorenzhs wrote: post #226
fnordfnordfnord wrote: post #193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

May I ask how much a student should expect to pay for housing and food per semester?

Depends a lot on where and how you live, but 400-600€ should suffice easily if you're on a budget.

To clarify: the 400-600 Euro is per month, not per semester. Bavaria is one of the more expensive ('cause rich) states. If you are willing to live in the East (hey, Berlin!), you can get by on less.

Re: American students head to Germany for free college

#230

Post by eru »

chronial wrote: post #223
grkvlt wrote: post #196

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But it's not just interest, it's ability to complete the course. Sure I might be interested in Mathematics, but terrible at it. What's the point of admitting me to an Honours Maths cousre? Also, there are usually strict legal limits on the hours you can work if you're under 16, which is when you'd be studying for the exams required for University admission, so I don't think it'd be much of an issue. Note that I'm thi…

Fun fact: Mathematics is not restricted in most German universities. If you are allowed to go to university in general, you are allowed to study maths – no matter your grades pre-university.

Demand is low enough that they can do that.
Post reply on HN