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Spidermonkey has passed V8 on Octane performance

robert.ocallahan.org

221–230 of 338 posts

Re: Spidermonkey has passed V8 on Octane performance

#221
post #198

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's so evil about Google?

It doesn't matter. (disclaimer: googler) I see it as a hubris against the idea that Google claimed to not be evil, and the fact that evil is such a poorly defined concept, and whether or not Google meets the bar depends entirely on the values of the perceiver. Many perceivers, for instance, miss the distinction between "Don't be evil." and "Don't do evil.". The former is a mindset, strategy, and intention, while the…

What's the mindset that ends up with Chrome going out of its way to swap OK/Cancel when you enable DNT? (I don't think DNT is a real solution, but I'd guess Google wants to be able to point to data showing users don't enable it.)

What's the mindset behind the broken permissions on Android? Where any app that wants to change behavior when you get a call must request permission to your IMEI and calling/called number? Or why the broken, upfront, all or nothing model is still even used?

What's the mindset behind G+'s incessant nagging, and forcing it as a requirement to even rate apps on Play? Or the same for YouTube, etc.? Not to mention the "real names" debacle.

At what point are we allowed to say Google's mindset is not "don't be evil" as far as external observers are concerned? Or will everyone that brings this up always be labeled as unable to understand?

Re: Spidermonkey has passed V8 on Octane performance

#222
I keep going back and forth between Firefox and Chrome. Chrome is ahead right now for two reasons:

1. Support for Netflix on linux

2. Webapps as native applications (like the old project prism). We use slack at work and a Chrome webapp is how they choose to support Linux.

Admittedly though, I will switch to Firefox for the rest of the week to see if I can live with these caveats.

Re: Spidermonkey has passed V8 on Octane performance

#223
post #112
post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't forget that a large chunk of Mozilla's revenue comes from Google: http://thenextweb.com/insider/2013/11/21/mozillas-reliance-g...

Isn't it actually whoever will pay the most to be the default search? I mean, I <3 google search, but i'd bet microsoft could pony up quite a bit of cash as well.

There was talk last time it was renegotiated that the large increase was down to MS pushing it up.

Re: Spidermonkey has passed V8 on Octane performance

#224

I keep going back and forth between Firefox and Chrome. Chrome is ahead right now for two reasons: 1. Support for Netflix on linux 2. Webapps as native applications (like the old project prism). We use slack at work and a Chrome webapp is how they choose to support Linux. Admittedly though, I will switch to Firefox for the rest of the week to see if I can live with these caveats.

I use Netflix on Linux (firefox) with pipelight.

Re: Spidermonkey has passed V8 on Octane performance

#225

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Many perceivers, for instance, miss the distinction between "Don't be evil." and "Don't do evil.". The former is a mindset, strategy, and intention, while the latter is impossible for a corporation with 50k employees. No, we perceive the disctinction just fine. Some of us just believe Google does "evil" with mindset, strategy, and intention...

I would suggest that those of you that believe that are deluded. What possible motivation could they have for being "evil", comic book style?

Comic-book style? Who said anything about that?

Just greedy capitalist style, and "patriotic" pro-US-interests style.

Re: Spidermonkey has passed V8 on Octane performance

#226
post #198

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It doesn't matter. (disclaimer: googler) I see it as a hubris against the idea that Google claimed to not be evil, and the fact that evil is such a poorly defined concept, and whether or not Google meets the bar depends entirely on the values of the perceiver. Many perceivers, for instance, miss the distinction between "Don't be evil." and "Don't do evil.". The former is a mindset, strategy, and intention, while the…

What's the mindset that ends up with Chrome going out of its way to swap OK/Cancel when you enable DNT? (I don't think DNT is a real solution, but I'd guess Google wants to be able to point to data showing users don't enable it.) What's the mindset behind the broken permissions on Android? Where any app that wants to change behavior when you get a call must request permission to your IMEI and calling/called number? O…

"What's the mindset behind the broken permissions on Android?

Where any app that wants to change behavior when you get a call must request permission to your IMEI and calling/called number? Or why the broken, upfront, all or nothing model is still even used?"

At the time android created its permissions model, most of these issues were not obvious, or it would have been done differently.

Remember, of course, that prior to things like android (the first version of the iphone only had webapps), permission models of any sort were pretty much unheard of. Flip phones running java apps, or blackberries, had apps that got to do whatever they wanted.

Permissions changes are being slowly made in android. The same way you'd slowly change most serious things about something with billions of users.

It's not like C++ or Java just release new features every day (even if we may want them to :P).

This is of course, the same as any large system in engineering.

I don't know enough to comment on the rest.

" At what point are we allowed to say Google's mindset is not "don't be evil" as far as external observers are concerned? Or will everyone that brings this up always be labeled as unable to understand?"

Truthfully? It doesn't matter. At some point, every company large enough will lose its sheen, and people will worry about it, and eventually question its motives. Nobody can be perfect at doing the right thing all the time, even if they wanted to. Eventually, even with the best of intentions, mistakes add up, and people stop believing.

I guarantee the same will happen to Mozilla (or whoever we want to peg as the current defender of the world) over time.

Re: Spidermonkey has passed V8 on Octane performance

#227

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean the services Google provides to users in the form of web applications, yes. The terminology is sucky. As for concrete examples, Hangouts only works in non-Chrome browsers (including ones with WebRTC support) if you install a Google-provided binary blob. Which you may not be able to do. Gmail only supports offline access in Chrome (see https://support.google.com/mail/answer/6557?hl=en the "two exceptions" bit).…

> Hangouts only works in non-Chrome browsers (including ones with WebRTC support) if you install a Google-provided binary blob. The Google Hangouts website uses some carefully-constructed language to imply that people must download Chrome to use Hangouts, even though a Hangouts NPAPI plugin supposedly exists: https://www.google.com/hangouts/ The Hangouts Chrome extension won't work in your current browser. You'll nee…

The NPAPI plugin is the binary blob bz was referring to.

Re: Spidermonkey has passed V8 on Octane performance

#228
post #198

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It doesn't matter. (disclaimer: googler) I see it as a hubris against the idea that Google claimed to not be evil, and the fact that evil is such a poorly defined concept, and whether or not Google meets the bar depends entirely on the values of the perceiver. Many perceivers, for instance, miss the distinction between "Don't be evil." and "Don't do evil.". The former is a mindset, strategy, and intention, while the…

What's the mindset that ends up with Chrome going out of its way to swap OK/Cancel when you enable DNT? (I don't think DNT is a real solution, but I'd guess Google wants to be able to point to data showing users don't enable it.) What's the mindset behind the broken permissions on Android? Where any app that wants to change behavior when you get a call must request permission to your IMEI and calling/called number? O…

DNT is a bad idea that does nothing useful. Discouraging people from using it is good, just like IE always sending DNT is absurd.

Android permissions aren't great. When Android was being designed (before Google bought it), the permissions were a huge step forward from desktop apps, which can still do anything at all. Arguably the very concept of upfront permissions is inferior to asking when needed, but attributing malice to the choice is silly. It'd also be really hard (or even impossible) to change without breaking all the apps out there.

G+ is annoying, indeed. They were aping Facebook with the real names thing and they should've known better.

Re: Spidermonkey has passed V8 on Octane performance

#229

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would suggest that those of you that believe that are deluded. What possible motivation could they have for being "evil", comic book style?

Comic-book style? Who said anything about that? Just greedy capitalist style, and "patriotic" pro-US-interests style.

Given that everyone at the top has more money than they know what to do with, what would "greed" have to do with it?

Re: Spidermonkey has passed V8 on Octane performance

#230
post #198

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It doesn't matter. (disclaimer: googler) I see it as a hubris against the idea that Google claimed to not be evil, and the fact that evil is such a poorly defined concept, and whether or not Google meets the bar depends entirely on the values of the perceiver. Many perceivers, for instance, miss the distinction between "Don't be evil." and "Don't do evil.". The former is a mindset, strategy, and intention, while the…

What's the mindset that ends up with Chrome going out of its way to swap OK/Cancel when you enable DNT? (I don't think DNT is a real solution, but I'd guess Google wants to be able to point to data showing users don't enable it.) What's the mindset behind the broken permissions on Android? Where any app that wants to change behavior when you get a call must request permission to your IMEI and calling/called number? O…

"What's the mindset behind the broken permissions on Android?

Where any app that wants to change behavior when you get a call must request permission to your IMEI and calling/called number? Or why the broken, upfront, all or nothing model is still even used?"

At the time android created its permissions model, most of these issues were not obvious, or it would have been done differently.

Remember, of course, that prior to things like android (the first version of the iphone only had webapps), permission models of any sort were pretty much unheard of. Flip phones running java apps, or blackberries, had apps that got to do whatever they wanted.

Permissions changes are being slowly made in android. The same way you'd slowly change most serious things about something with billions of users.

It's not like C++ or Java just release new features every day (even if we may want them to :P).

This is of course, the same as any large system in engineering.

I don't know enough to comment on the rest.

" At what point are we allowed to say Google's mindset is not "don't be evil" as far as external observers are concerned? Or will everyone that brings this up always be labeled as unable to understand?"

Truthfully? It doesn't matter. At some point, every company large enough will lose its sheen, and people will worry about it, and eventually question its motives. Nobody can be perfect at doing the right thing all the time, even if they wanted to. Eventually, even with the best of intentions, mistakes add up, and people stop believing. In fact, i'd wager it happens slower if you don't even try to have good intentions, and and just stay under the limelight, rather than try and occasionally mess up.

In any case, I guarantee the same will happen to Mozilla (or whoever we want to peg as the current defender of the world) over time, the same as it has happened in the past to every other company. Non-profitness won't save them.

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