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To the Girls of HackerNews: I am a Female Founder who Codes

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Re: To the Girls of HackerNews: I am a Female Founder who Codes

#221

Post by pyrocat »

poorelise wrote: post #219
pyrocat wrote: post #217

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Take your pick: https://news.ycombinator.com/threads?id=animus9

I had read those, but I didn't see anything military right-wing in them.

I didn't say there was anything military right-wing in them? I said his posts had the rhetoric of a militant cult.

Some exmaples:

> "An all boys class sure would be a breath of fresh air: it might be possible to focus on the actual education for once. Voluntary segregation seems like it would solve a lot of problems and eliminate our favourite scapegoats."

> "This new age jargon will have a short shelf life once the truth gets out. Those who sow seeds of discord will soon have to reap their crops."

> "The only thing suspicious is the propaganda machine which is creating this never ending list of gender-tech articles and their associated divisionist jargon."

Re: To the Girls of HackerNews: I am a Female Founder who Codes

#222

Post by theorique »

_bfhp wrote: post #42
notastartup wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is extremely sexist and needlessly hostile. It's like being male and interested in coding is somehow associated with all the stereotypical male attributes which turns off women from coding. Ah, so we need to have boys acting less like boys because it's clearly why we don't have more women in tech. So we all need to teach teen boys to become meterosexual so it can be more inviting and suitable for females? I thin…

primitivesuave was literally recounting their own experience with young children; are they "sexist", or is describing reality just not to your liking? What does "acting like boys" even mean, may I ask? primitivesuave was taking about the toxic masculinity that involves macho superiority and violence, sorry if it upsets you that that's what masculinity involves. primitivesuave wasn't talking about genitals, they were…

primitivesuave wasn't talking about genitals, they were talking about gender

No difference. Genitals are gender - they define the sex or gender of a person.

(And transsexual / transgendered persons feel like they have they 'wrong' genitals compared to what their brain feels like - the brain of a woman and the body of a man, or vice versa)

It's all connected.

Re: To the Girls of HackerNews: I am a Female Founder who Codes

#223

Post by theorique »

_bfhp wrote: post #148
nthrow wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cherry picking incidents involving the actions of disturbed individuals to attempt to smear a multifaceted movement is intellectually dishonest. That's like claiming all Muslims are terrorists because some Muslims are.

"Disturbed individuals"? Did you read the articles? The people being describes are the leaders of the "movement", like Elam. The "movement" obviously encourages the behavior being described -- meanwhile, groups like CAIR work hard to address the popular image of the terrorist Muslim. Where is the CAIR of "men's rights" I wonder

FYI, CAIR is linked to the Muslim Brotherhood. It's a dangerous organization.

Re: To the Girls of HackerNews: I am a Female Founder who Codes

#225

Post by theorique »

primitivesuave wrote: post #125
obstacle1 wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

primitivesuave's post is fraught with unconscious sexism. That is the problem. First he generalizes that all adolescent males put on "pseudo-masculine efforts". No they don't. That's just as much a stereotype as "all girls suck at coding" or whatever stereotype-du-jour militant feminists are raging about this week. Maybe a few of the students put on "displays" that he considers to be "pseudo-masculine efforts". That…

I'm not saying all males put on pseudo-masculine efforts, I'm saying it only takes one kid who makes an inappropriate joke like changing "public void" to "pubic void" when we're doing a code review. In such a situation, the boy will suppress a smile while he innocently exclaims he made a typo, while his friends all giggle innocuously. If you don't work with kids, you will not fully understand how the adolescent mind…

I'm saying it only takes one kid who makes an inappropriate joke like changing "public void" to "pubic void" when we're doing a code review. In such a situation, the boy will suppress a smile while he innocently exclaims he made a typo, while his friends all giggle innocuously

This is an expression of "masculinity", pseudo- or otherwise?

Seems more like a silly juvenile joke that some kids (or adults) of both sexes might enjoy, and some might roll their eyes.

Re: To the Girls of HackerNews: I am a Female Founder who Codes

#226

Post by notastartup »

Zombieball wrote: post #41
kaybe wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I heard tons of people complain about that, though for other reasons - it would be really good for boys (and their social and academic performance) to have male rolemodels, the argument goes. Consider the reasons for non-attractiveness. In the case of nursing, it's bad pay as well, presumably. In the case of IT, the general unfriendliness is one reason, though there might be others. Shouldn't we just remove the remov…

Just curious why you think nursing is bad pay? Or what do you consider to be bad? Where I live (Vancouver, BC.) entry level (students) pay for nurses is $50K/year. Average earnings for nurses I believe is on the order of $70-90K/year though.

It's almost like Vancouver cares more about nurses than software developers making up a significant portion of tech industry.

Think about this, an entry level nurse makes more than an entry level software developer in Vancouver, an experienced nurse ends up making more than a intermediate/senior developer with several years of experience at a firm in Vancouver.

Nurses get paid overtime, software developers are not, as overtime is almost expected with any software project.

Nurses get unions, software devs do not, because someone decided that tech jobs are not as valued or skilled as being a nurse, and that the market is efficient or protected from exploitation by employers knowing that the supply of jobs is seldom, so they treat them like commodity.

Re: To the Girls of HackerNews: I am a Female Founder who Codes

#227

Post by melindajb »

DanBC wrote: post #87
romanovcode wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Never in my life I've seen an article named I'm teacher and I'm a male! ; Life as a male nurse ; etc .. I think these articles are mainly link-bait for pageviews, nothing more.

Do you hang out on teaching or nursing forums?

do you really not know how to use google?

Re: To the Girls of HackerNews: I am a Female Founder who Codes

#228

Post by jacobtracey »

pyrocat wrote: post #221
poorelise wrote: post #219

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I had read those, but I didn't see anything military right-wing in them.

I didn't say there was anything military right-wing in them? I said his posts had the rhetoric of a militant cult. Some exmaples: > "An all boys class sure would be a breath of fresh air: it might be possible to focus on the actual education for once. Voluntary segregation seems like it would solve a lot of problems and eliminate our favourite scapegoats." > "This new age jargon will have a short shelf life once the…

What's your point? It really seems like you're simply trying to damage his character by saying his rhetoric is like a 'militant cult'.

This is classic ad hominem, you don't actually address any of his points, just attack his character.

Re: To the Girls of HackerNews: I am a Female Founder who Codes

#229

Post by melindajb »

What girls of hackernews? that's my question. 224 comments as of writing this, and most of them ignorant straw man whiny responses by (surprise!) men. Hard to imagine why some women wouldn't enjoy coming here and discussing things with so many enlightened, educated folks.

If you're threatened by the thought of more women in coding, then you don't really believe that we're a meritocracy. If you're one of those folks, then somewhere, deep in your heart, you know that things aren't fair, and when kick ass women programmers come in, you as a mediocre participant, will be pushed down to the bottom.

Meritocracy wants the very best. Seeks out the very best. Welcomes the very best.

To use an analogy, I can't imagine Olympic athletes being happy for the best competitors from another country being sidelined due to their sexual preference. No, that's not happening. because world class athletes know their victories are hollow unless they're truly competing against the very best in the world. Unlike Silicon Valley. We don't want competition. Nope, we want our nice, cozy little in crowd, keep that money nice and close so we can control it.

As Chris Rock said, there's a difference between rich and wealthy. Michael Jordan is rich, the owner of the chicago bulls is wealthy.

Women want to be wealthy, not just rich. African Americans want to be wealthy, not just rich. And right now, according to PG himself, the path to that wealth is by learning to code.

So anyone trying to stop that from happening, can pretty much categorically be described as a bigot.

Re: To the Girls of HackerNews: I am a Female Founder who Codes

#230

Post by obstacle1 »

theorique wrote: post #225
primitivesuave wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not saying all males put on pseudo-masculine efforts, I'm saying it only takes one kid who makes an inappropriate joke like changing "public void" to "pubic void" when we're doing a code review. In such a situation, the boy will suppress a smile while he innocently exclaims he made a typo, while his friends all giggle innocuously. If you don't work with kids, you will not fully understand how the adolescent mind…

I'm saying it only takes one kid who makes an inappropriate joke like changing "public void" to "pubic void" when we're doing a code review. In such a situation, the boy will suppress a smile while he innocently exclaims he made a typo, while his friends all giggle innocuously This is an expression of "masculinity", pseudo- or otherwise? Seems more like a silly juvenile joke that some kids (or adults) of both sexes m…

I thought this too. There is nothing inherently masculine about pubic hair, or jokes about said hair.
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