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We Work Remotely – New Job Board from 37 Signals

weworkremotely.com

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Re: We Work Remotely – New Job Board from 37 Signals

#221

Post by redguava »

laureny wrote: post #202
redguava wrote: post #199

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a hirer, I'll always ask what they make now. But I'll also ask are they happy with that salary. There's no point using it as a basis if they are not, but if they are, it's a good starting point.

> As a hirer, I'll always ask what they make now. How would you react if the candidate gave you the answer I typically give in this situation? ("my current salary is irrelevant, here is how much I want")

I'd be fine with that. It's used as a discussion point to arrive at a salary the person is happy with. If your original salary isn't one you want to base it off, that's ok.

Re: We Work Remotely – New Job Board from 37 Signals

#222

Post by redguava »

skrebbel wrote: post #208
redguava wrote: post #198

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's very hard to do for remote jobs. An appropriate salary is relative to the country you live in.

I never understood this. Shouldn't the salary be relative to the amount of value I add? Two people doing the same work, but one decides to rent a $3000,- apartment in SF and the other lives in North-east Veszprem. Why would a company pay the first guy more? Or the second guy less? Would feel very unfair if you're the second guy.

It's a really complicated thing. I agree the salary should be relative to the amount of value you add. But what a "good salary" is, depends on where you live.

If you do an amazing job, and I pay you an amazing amount. That amazing amount could vary depending on your cost of living.

I agree in a perfect world that you should get paid the same no matter where you are, and globalisation will probably head in that direction. But so will cost of living balancing out too (if people in lower cost of living countries are earning lots more money, the price of things will go up.... supply/demand).

I guess ultimately, when comparing what you pay people, why use the dollar amount as opposed to the benefit to their lives. Shouldn't you be paying everyone an amount that equally benefits them? Why should one person be far greater benefited from their salary? Ultimately it's what you do with the money that matters, not the number on the note.

Re: We Work Remotely – New Job Board from 37 Signals

#223

Post by mgl »

jmadsen wrote: post #90
bbx wrote: post #47

I've been searching for a remote job for the last few months. This site comes in really handy. Listing remote jobs isn't new (for example, Authentic Jobs has a clear call-to-action to filter them), but focusing on them is interesting. What I've learned so far is that a remote job is not exactly what I thought it was. Considering the mostly globalized state of the web (and even the internet), I thought "remote" meant…

This, and why this new site might be a little frustrating to use. I search for 100% remote work, no office visits, no timezone restrictions. Not having that info right on the main listing means I need to click each one to read what the restrictions are

Yes, this was my impression too. I was looking for new potential gigs for us - http://codedose.com (shameless plug: if you want to build a nice web app at near half of the Bay area rates drop me a line at mglomba@codedose.com) to discover that the actual pool of really remote offers is limited. Hopefully this is only a temporary state as they have just started!

Re: We Work Remotely – New Job Board from 37 Signals

#225

Post by k__ »

hadem wrote: post #203
crabasa wrote: post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We're trying to build a work space and community for people who do true remote work in Seattle. We hope this model spreads: http://devlocal.io

Didn't you just contradict yourself? "True remote work in..." When I think of "true remote work" I think of a job where location does not matter.

He's probably a scotsman :)

But I like the idea of open office-spaces. I like to work from home, but sometimes I need a different place to get new ideas.

Re: We Work Remotely – New Job Board from 37 Signals

#226

Post by workoglobe »

bbx wrote: post #47

I've been searching for a remote job for the last few months. This site comes in really handy. Listing remote jobs isn't new (for example, Authentic Jobs has a clear call-to-action to filter them), but focusing on them is interesting. What I've learned so far is that a remote job is not exactly what I thought it was. Considering the mostly globalized state of the web (and even the internet), I thought "remote" meant…

www.workoglobe.com is a nice place with a lot of remote jobs

Re: We Work Remotely – New Job Board from 37 Signals

#227

Post by lignuist »

enjo wrote: post #194
lignuist wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am currently working in a team with people from three continent. It works if people are willing to adapt.

How does that work day to day out of curiosity? What does collaboration look like for you guys?

Daily scrum meetings in voice calls with about ten team members. Weekly team meeting (voice calls) for organizational stuff. We have to plan for time zone differences for that (up to five different time zones). Voice calls on different topics during the day if needed (like discussions regarding requirements). Email and messenger for things like bug reports (bug tracker also) and clarification requests or other short queries. We have face to face meetings occasionally like every few months, but very rarely with the whole team.

Re: We Work Remotely – New Job Board from 37 Signals

#228

Post by [deleted] »

pmjordan wrote: post #142
grey-area wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's not at all what I was suggesting. I'm not suggesting setting up subsidiaries or anything of the kind. It's easy to subcontract work out to other countries if you're not tied to the idea of having employees, but instead hire companies (companies which already exist, like say small design shops, packaging firms for apps, or tech firms) to perform services for you, rather than individuals. Take 37 signals for exa…

That's a bit of a different beast to what the original commenters were suggesting. Engagements of that caliber usually involve outsourcing whole projects or subprojects (web presence for product X, whatever). Of course, there's overlap between what you can get a remote employee/contractor do vs. what you can "outsource". Note that levies might still be due on services performed across certain countries' borders. (muc…

[deleted]

Re: We Work Remotely – New Job Board from 37 Signals

#229

Post by petercooper »

redguava wrote: post #222
skrebbel wrote: post #208

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I never understood this. Shouldn't the salary be relative to the amount of value I add? Two people doing the same work, but one decides to rent a $3000,- apartment in SF and the other lives in North-east Veszprem. Why would a company pay the first guy more? Or the second guy less? Would feel very unfair if you're the second guy.

It's a really complicated thing. I agree the salary should be relative to the amount of value you add. But what a "good salary" is, depends on where you live. If you do an amazing job, and I pay you an amazing amount. That amazing amount could vary depending on your cost of living. I agree in a perfect world that you should get paid the same no matter where you are, and globalisation will probably head in that direct…

Shouldn't you be paying everyone an amount that equally benefits them?

Because that's entirely subjective and can't be calculated objectively.

Person A in SF might be paying $3000/mo in rent but also has top bands, a lot of popular culture, great shops, and so forth at their front door. These things counteract the lack of much disposable income for them.

Person B in Vietnam might pay $200/mo for a house but may also have frequent power cuts, poor access to healthcare, etc.. but the extra money counteracts these negative points for them.

This is one of many reasons Westerners get paid colossal salaries to work in places like Iraq or pockets of the Middle East. Cultural and security issues (in varying measures) are compensated for by a higher income.

Re: We Work Remotely – New Job Board from 37 Signals

#230

Post by netcan »

redguava wrote: post #222
skrebbel wrote: post #208

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I never understood this. Shouldn't the salary be relative to the amount of value I add? Two people doing the same work, but one decides to rent a $3000,- apartment in SF and the other lives in North-east Veszprem. Why would a company pay the first guy more? Or the second guy less? Would feel very unfair if you're the second guy.

It's a really complicated thing. I agree the salary should be relative to the amount of value you add. But what a "good salary" is, depends on where you live. If you do an amazing job, and I pay you an amazing amount. That amazing amount could vary depending on your cost of living. I agree in a perfect world that you should get paid the same no matter where you are, and globalisation will probably head in that direct…

Say you have 2 good candidates for a remote job. The slightly better one lives in Warsaw, you prefer him. You offer them $60k. The slightly worse one lives in NY, you offer $100k?

Is that really how it would work? What if the Warsaw guy demanded $100k, would you pick the NY guy.

This stuff about cost of living or finding the salary they would be happy with is all baloney. Employers want to pay as little as the candidate will accept. Candidate want the maximum salary an employer is willing to pay them. Anywhere between those two an agreement is possible. Negotiation is (a) figuring out if that range exists and (b) trying to get as close as possible to your ideal place in that range. Same as any other market. Employers (and recruiters are even worse) are trying get have more information than the candidate earlier to help them win at this game.

Employers do the initial advertising, control the process, do it more times, have less at stake. There are some markets where candidates have the stronger hand, but they're unusual. To me, not advertising a salary range is like having separate tourist prices, charging a couple walking into a hotel reception late at night double price, etc. It feels like a dirty trick played by the pro on the amateur.

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