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AWS Bedrock to require sharing data with Anthropic for Mythos and future models

news.ycombinator.com

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Re: AWS Bedrock to require sharing data with Anthropic for Mythos and future models

#221

Post by Qhemlomo »

kgwgk wrote: post #66
Qhemlomo wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not sure if i follow you tbh. I only told a commentor why a business would pay more to Amazon than going directly to Anthropic. The announcement itself is def problematic and either leads to big companies accepting this and then going directly to anthropic or some talks in the background we don't know yet what it will entail.

If you were just repeating the commenter’s point about « choosing to pay 10X to 20X because you trust AWS more than Anthropic » what was not the point?

He states it in a way that its so unclear that companies would actually do this.

Re: AWS Bedrock to require sharing data with Anthropic for Mythos and future models

#222

Post by instagib »

rozumbrada wrote: post #11

They say it's opt-in but since they are capable of agreeing to this, I am just waiting until they hide this opt-in into the regular ToS when asking for a new model access...

I was waiting for a comment to expand on this. It appears to be opt in but the opt out is not using the latest models unless I misunderstood it.

Re: AWS Bedrock to require sharing data with Anthropic for Mythos and future models

#223

Post by nijave »

dsign wrote: post #85

The root of the problem is that AI-as-a-service is corked, because companies providing it have a hell of an incentive to use all that data to out-compete their competitors, and they can do so in secret. To say nothing of salivating law-enforcement who really, really wants to tap into it. I'm hoping there will be at some point open-source and affordable hardware that can run competent models.

>and they can do so in secret

Is that really true? Zero Data Retention (ZDR) is standard language in enterprise contracts and it seems quite egregious a vendor would want to take on that amount of liability and ignore the contract terms.

On top of that, Anthropic is SOC2 and ISO27001 so they've had _some_ independent auditing (although they could still try to hide such logging/recording anyway)

With that in mind, they also have a hell of an incentive to _not_ secretly collect that data.

Of course ZDR oftentimes comes with contract minimums so individuals and small corps are locked out and subject to the whims of the provider.

Re: AWS Bedrock to require sharing data with Anthropic for Mythos and future models

#224

Post by nijave »

OtherShrezzing wrote: post #27

This is odd behaviour, and provides some evidence that Anthropic isn't being managed by serious people. With this policy across AWS/GH/Zed/etc, they're taking their massive lead in enterprise/govt sales and handing it to any competitor who can serve a model anywhere near these capabilities with a modestly nice UI.

>they're taking their massive lead in enterprise/govt sales

We're an HR startup and likely can't use these models because _we_ have enterprise customers who want zero data retention (ZDR) and have added it to contract language

Shit rolls down hill, as it goes

Re: AWS Bedrock to require sharing data with Anthropic for Mythos and future models

#225

Post by LorenPechtel »

psadauskas wrote: post #194
ferguess_k wrote: post #182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The root of the problem is that ordinary people don't make enough noises for any problems they see in life, so they are essentially cattles. Do you care about cattle's opinions? I guess a few of us do, but most of us don't.

That's not the "root", you can go at least one step further: The wealthy CEOs and boardmembers found a way to make even more money, but know that it will make the people who are aware of it angry. So they, as a class, find other issues that they can enflame (or manufacture wholesale), through the manipulation of social media algorithms and legacy media, both of which they own and control. They would much rather have…

There's a limit to how much angry people can be. Dilute it on irrelevancies, the anger directed at the real problems goes down.

Re: AWS Bedrock to require sharing data with Anthropic for Mythos and future models

#226

Post by astrange »

sailfast wrote: post #176
Hizonner wrote: post #168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

... but you were silent when they did it to consumers...

The consumers were paying for tokens with their data. If you pay for the tokens yourself the expectation is that your data doesn’t get trained on or used.

Query streams aren't really useful data in any sense. Just like nobody else is actually profiting from "selling your data".

Re: AWS Bedrock to require sharing data with Anthropic for Mythos and future models

#227

Post by ipnoipipme »

nijave wrote: post #223
dsign wrote: post #85

The root of the problem is that AI-as-a-service is corked, because companies providing it have a hell of an incentive to use all that data to out-compete their competitors, and they can do so in secret. To say nothing of salivating law-enforcement who really, really wants to tap into it. I'm hoping there will be at some point open-source and affordable hardware that can run competent models.

>and they can do so in secret Is that really true? Zero Data Retention (ZDR) is standard language in enterprise contracts and it seems quite egregious a vendor would want to take on that amount of liability and ignore the contract terms. On top of that, Anthropic is SOC2 and ISO27001 so they've had _some_ independent auditing (although they could still try to hide such logging/recording anyway) With that in mind, the…

Yeah cause all these frontier labs totally followed all relevant copyright and ip protection laws, so of course they'll follow your little contract, and what will be the consequences when it turns out they lied (again)? Oh maybe a fine, something fair like 0.5% of profits, can't make it too high or too anti business.

Re: AWS Bedrock to require sharing data with Anthropic for Mythos and future models

#228

Post by wslh »

nijave wrote: post #223
dsign wrote: post #85

The root of the problem is that AI-as-a-service is corked, because companies providing it have a hell of an incentive to use all that data to out-compete their competitors, and they can do so in secret. To say nothing of salivating law-enforcement who really, really wants to tap into it. I'm hoping there will be at some point open-source and affordable hardware that can run competent models.

>and they can do so in secret Is that really true? Zero Data Retention (ZDR) is standard language in enterprise contracts and it seems quite egregious a vendor would want to take on that amount of liability and ignore the contract terms. On top of that, Anthropic is SOC2 and ISO27001 so they've had _some_ independent auditing (although they could still try to hide such logging/recording anyway) With that in mind, the…

[dead]

Re: AWS Bedrock to require sharing data with Anthropic for Mythos and future models

#229

Post by nijave »

aveao wrote: post #173
tyingq wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It will absolutely cause some non-trivial number of customers to shift their configs away from Anthropic.

It's worthwhile to remember that this is only true of Mythos/Fable and other future models of "similar or higher capability levels" (ant is treating this as a new tier of model above Opus). Anyone who's already been happy using Haiku/Sonnet/Opus on Bedrock will not be affected by this at all.

>Anyone who's already been happy using Haiku/Sonnet/Opus on Bedrock will not be affected by this at all

It is still adding operational overhead because we now need to vet all models and deny access to any retaining data

Previously it was "use and experiment with anything Bedrock offers--the data stays in AWS so we are not concerned"

Re: AWS Bedrock to require sharing data with Anthropic for Mythos and future models

#230

Post by nijave »

ipnoipipme wrote: post #227
nijave wrote: post #223

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>and they can do so in secret Is that really true? Zero Data Retention (ZDR) is standard language in enterprise contracts and it seems quite egregious a vendor would want to take on that amount of liability and ignore the contract terms. On top of that, Anthropic is SOC2 and ISO27001 so they've had _some_ independent auditing (although they could still try to hide such logging/recording anyway) With that in mind, the…

Yeah cause all these frontier labs totally followed all relevant copyright and ip protection laws, so of course they'll follow your little contract, and what will be the consequences when it turns out they lied (again)? Oh maybe a fine, something fair like 0.5% of profits, can't make it too high or too anti business.

>Oh maybe a fine, something fair like 0.5% of profits, can't make it too high or too anti business.

No, this would be a civil lawsuit not criminal. The plaintiff (the harmed party) could sue Anthropic for whatever they wanted. Put another way, they're at the mercy of big corp army of lawyers, not a paid off politician.

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