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Garry Tan, the CEO of YC, accused me of unethical reporting

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Re: Garry Tan, the CEO of YC, accused me of unethical reporting

#221

Post by UncleMeat »

rayiner wrote: post #220
UncleMeat wrote: post #190

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

What’s interesting is that you take a felon who held a woman at gunpoint while robbing her, and sympathize with him based on his skin color. I’ve never read a story about “brown” terrorists and felt any connection to the terrorists. Not even based on shared humanity, much less ethnicity. Indeed, I’m sad we got rid of the lady who was mowing them down in Bangladesh.

The world will surely be a better place when everyone you hate is executed without trial I guess.

Re: Garry Tan, the CEO of YC, accused me of unethical reporting

#222

Post by joshstrange »

derangedHorse wrote: post #194
Snow_Falls wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would agree with you, I see people like Jeff Bezos who's unfathomably wealthy but also treats his workers so terribly that they have to pee in bottles and I wonder why? What compels someone to so obssesively seek wealth that they must treat people like that. I can only see it as some sort of mental illness. When someone compulsively hoards trinkets to the detriment of all around them, we call that a disease and I d…

> When someone compulsively hoards trinkets to the detriment of all around them, we call that a disease and I don't see why we should treat it differently when it's dollars they're collecting He doesn’t hold dollars, he mostly holds equity. Also it doesn’t seem like he’s directly involved in the day to day tasks assigned to delivery drivers so it’s weird to assign blame to him for that as well. One could argue that i…

This is an insane comment/prediction.

> He doesn’t hold dollars, he mostly holds equity.

A distinction without a difference.

> Also it doesn’t seem like he’s directly involved in the day to day tasks assigned to delivery drivers so it’s weird to assign blame to him for that as well.

It’s weird to assign blame to the CEO for a long-standing practice of his company? You’ve got to be kidding? I don’t want to go full Godwin’s law here but Jesus…

> One could argue that if drivers were unhappy with the work, they could just quit. Another would argue that that’s a callous way to view the problem as a new job may not be easy to get.

Yes, “Another” would. Anyone who has existed in the world could tell you that. “Just get another job” is so incredibly tone deaf. It’s up there with “just sue your employer if they are stealing from you/harassing you/etc”.

> I’d link these 2 issues and say my view is that if Bezos were to sell his stock to give to charity, Amazon’s own stock would plummet

Literally a made up outcome with zero basis in reality. And a rather disgusting defense of his practices “no, no, you don’t understand, he has to be horrible or Amazon will falter and fail and then those people will lose their jobs!”.

Re: Garry Tan, the CEO of YC, accused me of unethical reporting

#223

Post by rayiner »

UncleMeat wrote: post #221
rayiner wrote: post #220

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What’s interesting is that you take a felon who held a woman at gunpoint while robbing her, and sympathize with him based on his skin color. I’ve never read a story about “brown” terrorists and felt any connection to the terrorists. Not even based on shared humanity, much less ethnicity. Indeed, I’m sad we got rid of the lady who was mowing them down in Bangladesh.

The world will surely be a better place when everyone you hate is executed without trial I guess.

It’s interesting I said “terrorists” and you translated that to “people I hate.” As if I have some different, unstated motivation. No, I just hate terrorists, obviously.

Re: Garry Tan, the CEO of YC, accused me of unethical reporting

#224

Post by derangedHorse »

joshstrange wrote: post #222
derangedHorse wrote: post #194

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> When someone compulsively hoards trinkets to the detriment of all around them, we call that a disease and I don't see why we should treat it differently when it's dollars they're collecting He doesn’t hold dollars, he mostly holds equity. Also it doesn’t seem like he’s directly involved in the day to day tasks assigned to delivery drivers so it’s weird to assign blame to him for that as well. One could argue that i…

This is an insane comment/prediction. > He doesn’t hold dollars, he mostly holds equity. A distinction without a difference. > Also it doesn’t seem like he’s directly involved in the day to day tasks assigned to delivery drivers so it’s weird to assign blame to him for that as well. It’s weird to assign blame to the CEO for a long-standing practice of his company? You’ve got to be kidding? I don’t want to go full God…

> It’s weird to assign blame to the CEO for a long-standing practice of his company? You’ve got to be kidding? I don’t want to go full Godwin’s law here but Jesus…

Yes, especially since it would be considered a business minutiae in the grand scheme of things.

> Literally a made up outcome with zero basis in reality. And a rather disgusting defense of his practices “no, no, you don’t understand, he has to be horrible or Amazon will falter and fail and then those people will lose their jobs!”.

I'm curious as to what you think would happen? If schedules were loosened and drivers were paid more, what do you think would be the long-term impact? Tell me how the way you would change things would improve the world.

Re: Garry Tan, the CEO of YC, accused me of unethical reporting

#225

Post by pocksuppet »

seanmcdirmid wrote: post #158
abirch wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some of the difficulties of criminal-justice reform include: you can't arrest your way out of mental illness. It's easier for society to lock up the mentally ill in with a 1-dollar bond that it is to provide the help that they need. It's probably cheaper to do give them the housing and help, but it's easier to get money for jails and jailers than it is to get money for mental health facilities.

> It's probably cheaper to do give them the housing and help, but it's easier to get money for jails and jailers than it is to get money for mental health facilities. It’s not really. We are approaching $100k/year in Seattle just to house someone in a tiny home or apartment building as charged to the city/county by local non profits, without any help beyond that (and no guarantee that they wont go out and, for exampl…

If prison is so much cheaper, why don't they build something like a prison, but without all the restrictions on freedom, and house people there? It should be even cheaper.

I can't imagine how it could possibly cost $100k/year to house someone. Rent for a small flat is under $1000/month or you're living in a failed state. Food is definitely well under $1000/month or you're living in a failed state, and everything else like electricity, internet, cellphone is under $500/month though I could be wrong on that one, so that's $30k/year absolute pessimistic max - what's the rest?

Re: Garry Tan, the CEO of YC, accused me of unethical reporting

#226

Post by collingreen »

boroboro4 wrote: post #216
collingreen wrote: post #172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's strange to find myself so clearly on the side of tctapek here but yes it is super unreasonable for a district attorneys office to accuse reporters of things without a solid set of facts supporting it. There should be absolutely no abuse of the power of the office and of every official, the lawyers should be most likely to get this right. A functioning justice system MATTERS and being trustworthy is one of the co…

I somewhat agree that the whole document is sloppy, but I also think this conversation overemphasizes what is wrong with it. It is not as if the document simply accuses the journalist and leaves it there; it actually elaborates on what it means by “violated HIPAA” in that context (and please don’t make me start comparing it with current administration behavior). There is also a broader question of how to properly han…

OP didn't say the office should ignore lies or libel. OP said the attorney general should be very sure before making severe accusations against the press.

I think both are right - shouldn't ignore crime and should be responsible in addressing it.

Re: Garry Tan, the CEO of YC, accused me of unethical reporting

#227

Post by jrflowers »

tptacek wrote: post #203
jrflowers wrote: post #170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Violating HIPAA rights and “ violating HIPAA ” aren’t the same thing. The rights granted by HIPAA are universal, everybody’s got them and anybody can violate them, it’s just that healthcare professionals are bound to not do that. You could violate my HIPAA “rights” all day and not get in trouble, because the law around protecting those rights does not apply to you. I could still write in a memo that the associated be…

There's a whole subthread that already covered this ground. The passage obviously implicates Lim --- the subject of the entire document --- a reporter, in lawbreaking, without alleging facts sufficient to establish that liability, and was written by the DA's office. When Trump's DOJ does this sort of thing, we all (rightly) freak the fuck out.

I like that I explained incontrovertibly that your statement was wrong here and your response is “somewhere else we established that he was a bad guy and that means the bad guy is trump”

lmao that nothing that you said is true at all in any way, and was trivial to disprove but you’re sticking to the vibes anyway 8-)

tptacek: “The DA for San Francisco and the DA for Chicago were the same guy and I know that because the SF guy is Trump because I did not read what he wrote and theres a thread about that“

Re: Garry Tan, the CEO of YC, accused me of unethical reporting

#228

Post by jrflowers »

boroboro4 wrote: post #217
tptacek wrote: post #203

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's a whole subthread that already covered this ground. The passage obviously implicates Lim --- the subject of the entire document --- a reporter, in lawbreaking, without alleging facts sufficient to establish that liability, and was written by the DA's office. When Trump's DOJ does this sort of thing, we all (rightly) freak the fuck out.

DOJ puts an accusation with clarifying text in semi private document? They don’t do this, they do much worse things (and get, rightly, much worse response). This document isn’t great, but comparing it to Trump administration actions isn’t great either. As well as focusing on it rather than on a substance of the article in question (which is, about Garry Tan accusations in a first place). Thank you for your comment th…

> Thank you for your comment though it made me go back and reread the linked text more critically.

Yeah he was just making stuff up.

Re: Garry Tan, the CEO of YC, accused me of unethical reporting

#229

Post by sleepybrett »

jaggederest wrote: post #103
sleepybrett wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To be fair, I don't think jeff has proclaimed that their drivers need to pee in bottles. That's all mid level managers trying to show gains to their up-line reports. Jeff (and the board) wonders if deliveries could be more efficient, and wants to find efficiencies to report to the board and the shareholders. However it's fucking dave, 6+ layers below jeff that is firing drivers for missing unreasonably tight delivery…

The purpose of a system is what it does. If you're in control of a company, and that company is an "orphan crushing machine", it's your responsibility because ultimately someone must be responsible. You could argue the board shares responsibility, and certainly every high level manager endorses it. You have to say "Deliveries should be as efficient as is consistent with basic decency, anyone delivering Amazon package…

I'm not arguing that this isn't true. I'm arguing that the closer to the bottle pissing employees you are on the org chart the more guilty you are.

Re: Garry Tan, the CEO of YC, accused me of unethical reporting

#230

Post by f33d5173 »

sleepybrett wrote: post #229
jaggederest wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The purpose of a system is what it does. If you're in control of a company, and that company is an "orphan crushing machine", it's your responsibility because ultimately someone must be responsible. You could argue the board shares responsibility, and certainly every high level manager endorses it. You have to say "Deliveries should be as efficient as is consistent with basic decency, anyone delivering Amazon package…

I'm not arguing that this isn't true. I'm arguing that the closer to the bottle pissing employees you are on the org chart the more guilty you are.

If it was only a small cluster of employees bottle pissing then this would make sense. When it's endemic across the company, that suggests it comes from incentives set at the top, and the low level managers can't individually do much about it.
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