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Will vibe coding end like the maker movement?

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Re: Will vibe coding end like the maker movement?

#221

Post by wavefunction »

cracki wrote: post #159
the_af wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's hard to tell any more. Wait, I think I have the answer! "You're in a desert, walking along in the sand when all of a sudden you look down and see a tortoise. It's crawling toward you. You reach down and flip the tortoise over on its back. The tortoise lays on its back, its belly baking in the hot sun, beating its legs trying to turn itself over. But it can't. Not without your help. But you're not helping. Why…

Hm... Why? Ah! Because you are also a tortoise

Tortoise have been observed righting other tortoise that have become stuck. https://www.youtube.com/shorts/DZ57D608fiM (two tortoises helping a third) this has a terrible voiceover but you get the idea

Re: Will vibe coding end like the maker movement?

#222

Post by davesque »

I don't understand this. I use agentic coding to do things more quickly. And it's not just toys. I end up with software that both works and is useful. Assuming AI models powerful enough to drive that process continue to be available, why would I stop doing it?

Re: Will vibe coding end like the maker movement?

#223

Post by leptons »

aforwardslash wrote: post #63
leptons wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's either very brave, or very foolish. Vibeslop is already well known for the security risks that come with it.

Yes, because human-made code is risk-free. I suggest you actually look at a codebase of a proprietary device before forming a proper opinion.

>Yes, because human-made code is risk-free.

If whataboutism is all you have, this conversation is over.

> I suggest you actually look at a codebase of a proprietary device before forming a proper opinion

You have no idea what codebases I've seen and worked in, so don't assume I have not. My opinions are well-formed.

Re: Will vibe coding end like the maker movement?

#224

Post by Bombthecat »

tsss wrote: post #148
OakNinja wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I recently wrote a blog post about exactly this, and I agree with your perspective. Vibe coding helps with showing other people your idea and get them to understand it, try it and, most importantly, help you fail fast. But as the product matures, the gains of using LLM's and agentic engineering will go from 10000% efficiency to something like maybe 30(?)% productivity gain? Which is still awesome, of course. "The rea…

It's not awesome, not for us. 30% productivity gain would be enormous. Just imagine 30% of developers losing their jobs, in addition to outsourcing and all the new graduates flooding out of colleges after CS has been hyped so much in the recent years.

And? Nothing you can do against it.

IT and coding was a good carrier for a long time, but times are changing.

Re: Will vibe coding end like the maker movement?

#225

Post by Bombthecat »

gtowey wrote: post #214
zahlman wrote: post #212

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Vibe coding, on the other hand, is competing against hand coding, and for many use cases is considerably more efficient. It’s clearly replacing a lot of hand coding. It seems like a lot of vibe coders are people who otherwise wouldn't be coding at all.

Yeah, it's like saying that the amateur rocketry guys on youtube are going to replace NASA.

Good example! 90 percent ( or even more) of code do not need NASA level code. Vibe coding is good enough.

Just like a five dollar t shirt is enough for many many people

Re: Will vibe coding end like the maker movement?

#226

Post by techblueberry »

davesque wrote: post #222

I don't understand this. I use agentic coding to do things more quickly. And it's not just toys. I end up with software that both works and is useful. Assuming AI models powerful enough to drive that process continue to be available, why would I stop doing it?

Th is isn't discussing individuals, it's discussing trends as a whole. There are still plenty of makers getting value out of 3d printers as well, but it's not everyone like we talk about everyone becoming a software developer with vibe coding.

Re: Will vibe coding end like the maker movement?

#227

Post by rapind »

MrDarcy wrote: post #166
nineteen999 wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We didn't even have to offshore for lots of bad code to be written. Looks at the scores of Ycombinator startups that wrote a shitload of awful code and failed. Good ideas, pretty websites, but not a lot of substance under the hood. The VC gathering aspect and online kudos was way more important to them than actually producing good code and a reliable product that would stand the test of time. Pretty much the most det…

> Looks at the scores of Ycombinator startups that wrote a shitload of awful code and failed. This can also be restated as, look at all the startups that wrote a shitload of awful code and succeeded. That’s an indicator code quality doesn’t matter at macro scales. We already knew this though even if we didn’t explicitly say it. It’s more about organization, coordination, and execution than code.

> That’s an indicator code quality doesn’t matter at macro scales.

I think it can though. It just depends. Having high quality code and making good technical choices can matter in many ways. From improving performance (massively) and correctness, to attracting great talent. Jane Street and WhatsApp come to mind, maybe Discord too. Just like great design will attract great designers.

I also think it might matter even more in the age of AI Agents. Most of my time now is spent reviewing code instead of writing code, and that makes me a huge bottleneck. So the best way to optimize is to make the code more readable and having good automated checks to reduce the amount of work I need to do, like static types, no nulls, compilation, automated tests, secondary agent reviews, etc.

Re: Will vibe coding end like the maker movement?

#228

Post by SecretDreams »

Thanemate wrote: post #215
tetha wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The higher paid engineers i've worked with are always worth their salary/hourly rate because of the way they approach problems and the solutions they come up with. I'm honestly just happy at the moment, because our two junior admins/platform engineers have made some really good points to me in preparation for their annual reviews. One now completed his own bigger terraform project, with the great praise of "That lo…

It makes sense for junior admins and junior platform engineers to leverage LLM's but I'd be highly skeptical for the future skillset of any junior software engineer who leverages LLM's right off the bat, unless we have already moved that goalpost.

Ya, this is the issue. LLMs are not great for developing minds. A lot like the internet presently, to be frank.

For fully developed and experienced minds, both can be useful.

Re: Will vibe coding end like the maker movement?

#229

Post by leptons »

jmull wrote: post #64

> The central promise—that distributed digital fabrication would bring manufacturing back to America, that every city would have micro-factories, that 3D printing would decentralize production—simply didn’t materialize. I never heard that. It didn’t seem like 3D-printing ever showed sings of displacing existing ways of manufacturing at scale, did it? Units per hour and dollars per unit was never its strength. It was…

3D printing is giving my company many benefits over injection molding. We have 6 variations of the case for our device and we're always coming up with improvements and new functionality, and new products. I only see us expanding our in-house resin print farm instead of building out injection molds. No, we aren't selling millions of units, but injection molding is just too expensive for anything but a 1-size-fits-all solution.

Re: Will vibe coding end like the maker movement?

#230

Post by ceejayoz »

jajuuka wrote: post #124
jvanderbot wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It didn’t seem like 3D-printing ever showed sings of displacing existing ways of manufacturing at scale No, it never seemed that way to the realists, but it was said to seem that way to the makerspheres.

Definitely a fantasy land ideal. Much like pitches from the Free Software Foundation of a world without copyright and IP. It's just never going to exist because reality just isn't that way.

> Much like pitches from the Free Software Foundation of a world without copyright and IP.

Didn't the big AI vendors kinda bring that to fruition?

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