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Hard-braking events as indicators of road segment crash risk

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Re: Hard-braking events as indicators of road segment crash risk

#221

Post by loeg »

HoldOnAMinute wrote: post #35
presidentender wrote: post #20

I got one of those dongles from my insurance company that plugged into the ODB2 port and reported my driving habits. I was a bad driver. It would frequently beep at me to let me know that I had braked too hard. I was mystified. "What should I have done differently," I'd think, as I raged at the objective machine that judged me so. The next time my brother came to visit, he called mom. "Oh, and presidentender is a goo…

Is there any vehicle that uses it's sensors to make a gentle suggestion about following distance? It's probably the best single thing anyone can do to improve safety. It also reduces wear-and-tear on your car, and increases your fuel economy as a side benefit. Why hasn't gamification of safe driving habits been built directly into the car itself before now?

Pretty sure my EV9 will actually initiate emergency braking. Though it is pretty conservative (no nudge to follow at a safe distance).

Re: Hard-braking events as indicators of road segment crash risk

#222

Post by chausen »

Sohcahtoa82 wrote: post #213
mountain_peak wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maintaining a safe following distance is incredibly challenging on busy freeways where hard braking is often 'required'. Most people have likely found themselves in this situation: vehicle changes lanes in front of you; you slow down to maintain a safe following distance, another car sees a gap and changes lanes in front of you. Repeat for your entire commute. Incredibly frustrating, and I've driven all over North Am…

> vehicle changes lanes in front of you; I will never understand why this is so rage-inducing for people. Changing lanes is a necessary part of navigating, even during busy traffic. People on an on-ramp will need to get in front of somebody . People needing to move back to the right because their exist is coming up will need to get in front of somebody . Your lane is not a birth right. Let people merge. > you slow do…

It brings me peace to see other people thinking this way. You should be an active participant on the highway, making decisions to maximize flow. Leaving space so people can merge, controlling speed to smooth slowdowns, anticipating traffic patterns, etc.

All of the people tailgating are contributing to the congestion.

https://youtu.be/iHzzSao6ypE

Re: Hard-braking events as indicators of road segment crash risk

#223

Post by Dylan16807 »

Sohcahtoa82 wrote: post #213
mountain_peak wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maintaining a safe following distance is incredibly challenging on busy freeways where hard braking is often 'required'. Most people have likely found themselves in this situation: vehicle changes lanes in front of you; you slow down to maintain a safe following distance, another car sees a gap and changes lanes in front of you. Repeat for your entire commute. Incredibly frustrating, and I've driven all over North Am…

> vehicle changes lanes in front of you; I will never understand why this is so rage-inducing for people. Changing lanes is a necessary part of navigating, even during busy traffic. People on an on-ramp will need to get in front of somebody . People needing to move back to the right because their exist is coming up will need to get in front of somebody . Your lane is not a birth right. Let people merge. > you slow do…

The problem isn't merging, it's people that are changing lanes to get ahead.

It's especially not people trying to get off the highway because then they leave and you can catch back up to where you originally were.

Re: Hard-braking events as indicators of road segment crash risk

#224

Post by tristor »

There are only two conditions under which I have had to hard brake in more than 30 years of driving:

1. I'm on a race track or back road enjoying curves 2. Some asshole did something stupid in front of me.

I agree that hard braking is an accurate metric for road segment crash risk, but what I find upsetting is that insurance companies that use vehicle data treat /all/ hard braking equally. In reality, the risk is caused not by every person who hard brakes, but by the first person in a line of cars that hard brakes.

More on #2 above is that my observation has been MOST of the time, the braking was COMPLETELY unnecessary. Often the person hard braking that starts the chain has absolutely nothing in front of them to the horizon and is probably on their phone watching TikTok, suddenly looked up and realized they were driving and braked as a spooking reaction. This happens, observably, so often that there are active conspiracies on the Internet that the government hires people to drive like assholes to cause traffic. Obviously that's complete bunk, but my observation here is certainly not unique.

Rather than spying on everyone using our vehicle data to charge us ever more money (I've had zero at-fault accidents in nearly 30 years of driving, but my rates only go up), maybe we should enforce attentiveness on the road and start punishing those who are left-lane hogs (causing many lane changes, which are also risky), on their phone, or drunk. It's really obscene these days driving on American roads, it seems like everyone drives markedly worse since the pandemic /and/ enforcement has gone to nothing. The only time I see people get pulled over now is in speedtrap small towns.

Re: Hard-braking events as indicators of road segment crash risk

#225

Post by tristor »

californical wrote: post #164
ip26 wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some degree of road safety depends on predictable behavior. I haven’t seen those videos, but suddenly executing a panic stop on the freeway for no good reason at all increases everyone’s risk, even if the car behind you is following at a safe distance. Obviously the following driver bears the most responsibility, but erratic drivers shouldn’t be held to be morally blameless.

> erratic drivers People don’t usually act erratically for no reason. Maybe they suddenly stop because they see a deer sprinting towards the road off in the distance, and the person behind them didn’t see it. There are tons of reasons that look like they “erratically stop”, which are actually genuine safe behavior that the other may not know about.

People act erratically all of the time on the road because they're on their phones while driving instead of paying attention.

Re: Hard-braking events as indicators of road segment crash risk

#226

Post by Dylan16807 »

mountain_peak wrote: post #46
presidentender wrote: post #20

I got one of those dongles from my insurance company that plugged into the ODB2 port and reported my driving habits. I was a bad driver. It would frequently beep at me to let me know that I had braked too hard. I was mystified. "What should I have done differently," I'd think, as I raged at the objective machine that judged me so. The next time my brother came to visit, he called mom. "Oh, and presidentender is a goo…

Maintaining a safe following distance is incredibly challenging on busy freeways where hard braking is often 'required'. Most people have likely found themselves in this situation: vehicle changes lanes in front of you; you slow down to maintain a safe following distance, another car sees a gap and changes lanes in front of you. Repeat for your entire commute. Incredibly frustrating, and I've driven all over North Am…

I admit that I probably don't leave as much space as recommended, but I leave a good amount of space to never need to hard brake, and people don't keep moving in front of me either.

Re: Hard-braking events as indicators of road segment crash risk

#227

Post by stevage »

its_magic wrote: post #208
stevage wrote: post #168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wow, I didn't know that was a thing. Been driving nearly 30 years, and never had a windshield chip.

Do you have a wood surface nearby? I would recommend giving it a good knock.

Apparently I just live in a place where it's not a common problem. Also I do tend to leave a big gap behind cars in front.

Re: Hard-braking events as indicators of road segment crash risk

#228

Post by Dylan16807 »

ryandrake wrote: post #201
mlyle wrote: post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yah. There's something that feels unjust about it -- the perception that the people cutting are getting something over on you -- that causes us to want to behave badly. But even if 2 dozen people go around you and creep into that following space, you've been cost like 45 seconds at worst. Better not to play the game.

Society would have a lot fewer car accidents if we, collectively, could get over that "Oh no someone dared to get in front of me! " feeling.

We'd also avoid a lot of accidents if we stopped the people that are doing lane changes for position-jockeying and no other purpose.

So it's bad to be mad while driving, but there's a lot of lane changes that deserve the ire. (It's a tiny fraction of drivers that get really bad, but a less tiny fraction of lane changes.)

Re: Hard-braking events as indicators of road segment crash risk

#229

Post by badc0ffee »

yial wrote: post #73
badc0ffee wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> (5 mph increase over a 10 hour drive can cut off 50 minutes) You can't really say that without knowing the starting speed, or alternatively the distance. All you can say is that a 5 mph increase over a 10 hour drive with get you 50 miles farther.

I would argue I can still say it /can/ cut off 50 minutes. If you do a comparison of a 600 mile trip at 60 vs 55 you’re pretty close. But yes, to be pedantic and more exact, you are spot on that it will get you 50 miles closer. But in real world examples, If you’re traveling 700 miles. 65 vs 70, 70 will reduce your time by 43 minutes. So in certain scenarios, 5 mph difference must be able to save you 50 minutes ! ;)…

> So in certain scenarios, 5 mph difference must be able to save you 50 minutes ! ;)

That is true. If you're going 55 mph for 10 hours, you'll go 550 miles. Increase your speed to 60 mph, and you'll get there at 9 hours 10 minutes.

Re: Hard-braking events as indicators of road segment crash risk

#230

Post by aeontech »

Sohcahtoa82 wrote: post #213
mountain_peak wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maintaining a safe following distance is incredibly challenging on busy freeways where hard braking is often 'required'. Most people have likely found themselves in this situation: vehicle changes lanes in front of you; you slow down to maintain a safe following distance, another car sees a gap and changes lanes in front of you. Repeat for your entire commute. Incredibly frustrating, and I've driven all over North Am…

> vehicle changes lanes in front of you; I will never understand why this is so rage-inducing for people. Changing lanes is a necessary part of navigating, even during busy traffic. People on an on-ramp will need to get in front of somebody . People needing to move back to the right because their exist is coming up will need to get in front of somebody . Your lane is not a birth right. Let people merge. > you slow do…

I'll tell you what I specifically and intentionally do when I need to change lanes. I brake slightly, signal, and wait for the person on my right or my left to pull ahead of me, then change lanes immediately _behind_ them. Then sit there for a moment until my following distance evens out a bit.

This ensures that

a) I do not cut anyone off accidentally, and minimize the amount of stress in my immediate part of the universe

b) I will (most likely) have plenty of room behind me after I change lanes, reducing chances of anyone else running up on me

c) If there's noticeable traffic, the time I spend signaling and waiting for the person to move slightly ahead of me gives plenty of warning to the people _behind_ them that I'm about to enter the lane.

Ultimately, yes, of course in principle you're right, when I change lanes, I enter the lane in front of someone.... but I _can_ control whether I enter as far as possible ahead of them.

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