Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Donut Lab’s all-solid-state battery delivers 400 Wh/kg of energy density

donutlab.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

221–230 of 279 posts

Re: Donut Lab’s all-solid-state battery delivers 400 Wh/kg of energy density

#221

Post by calmbonsai »

CastIron888 wrote: post #184
calmbonsai wrote: post #148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Eh, the monocoque was circa early 1960s and the Otto cycle was circa 1860s, but the Model T was 1900s.

Not old enough? How about a steam engine with the front axle bolted to the boiler? A steam boiler is subject to considerable stresses already and adding dynamic forces to the shell can't be a good idea? https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/42/Kemna_ro...

Heh, that's not a monocoque, but it's definitely directly bolting the engine to one suspension component. WJW. We've come so far.

Re: Donut Lab’s all-solid-state battery delivers 400 Wh/kg of energy density

#222

Post by calmbonsai »

schmidp wrote: post #150
calmbonsai wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The real issue with "clay-like design freedom" is the collective knock-on effects of thermal and conductive inefficiencies. We've had "clay-like design freedom" since the early days of carbon-zinc batteries, but it turns out that it's far better (both for manufacturing, chemistry, and safety) to have a continuous volume of relative thermal and electrolytic quiescence that's, largely, isolated from physical strains. T…

ducatis use the engine block has the frame.

Many motorcycles do and have done so before monocoques were a thing. Hell, even many old British Nortons did that too.

Re: Donut Lab’s all-solid-state battery delivers 400 Wh/kg of energy density

#223

Post by rootusrootus »

JuniperMesos wrote: post #124
cosmic_cheese wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even as things currently stand, some folks just have a bone to pick with EVs. Even if future models have an 800mi range, can charge to 100% in 5 minutes, and have useful lifetimes as long or longer than ICE counterparts, some will figure out some reason to get angry about them.

A person I know is upset about EVs because they are built around the assumption that every system in the car will phone home to the car manufacturer (or perhaps the cops), and basically require you to have a proprietary smartphone app in order to interact with EV chargers and perhaps the car itself. Of course, this is also true of new ICE cars, but it's at least possible to continue driving an older ICE car with more…

I don't think my Lightning has any more telemetry than the equivalent ICE F150, nor do I think there are any repercussions from disabling that telemetry altogether (aside from no OTA updates, which aren't really much of a thing with Ford anyway).

Re: Donut Lab’s all-solid-state battery delivers 400 Wh/kg of energy density

#224

Post by rootusrootus »

ninkendo wrote: post #111
jfengel wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I suspect that the causation runs the other way. They think EV owners, Californians, and anyone who doesn't smell like petroleum is crazy. Therefore they won't buy electric cars and so nobody builds charging stations.

I can only speak for the people I know well (I know people from lots of different backgrounds here), but I can confidently say that every one of them would love EVs if charging stations were everywhere and charged in 10 minutes. There may be a real chicken-and-egg problem with building the charging stations, but if it were magically fixed and ultra fast charging stations were ubiquitous overnight, I think minds would…

> My point being that they’re not irrational, and it’s not EV hatred that is driving it.

That's just your particular bubble. I have met very few anti-EV folk who were not deeply political about it. They don't oppose EVs on rational grounds, they only have the talking points. Matters not at all to them that the talking points were proven false years ago.

Re: Donut Lab’s all-solid-state battery delivers 400 Wh/kg of energy density

#225

Post by rootusrootus »

ninkendo wrote: post #176
yencabulator wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I can confidently say that every one of them would love EVs if [...] And I can confidently say I see rural pickup owners rolling coal about weekly, so no, they will not be loving EVs, because it hampers them destroying their surroundings.

As I said, I am only talking about people I know personally. Not everyone is like that, please stop lumping everyone together. Not everyone who dislikes EV’s is doing so irrationally. Not every one of them is a moronic anti-environmentalist. Most people are just trying to get by and they’re looking at what they think is best for them. Thinking everyone who disagrees with you must be a backwards coal-rolling moron is……

> Thinking everyone who disagrees with you must be a backwards coal-rolling moron

Certainly uncharitable, but you should hear what those people say about everyone left of the far right.

Re: Donut Lab’s all-solid-state battery delivers 400 Wh/kg of energy density

#226

Post by rootusrootus »

azinman2 wrote: post #151
yencabulator wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I can confidently say that every one of them would love EVs if [...] And I can confidently say I see rural pickup owners rolling coal about weekly, so no, they will not be loving EVs, because it hampers them destroying their surroundings.

I cannot understand “rolling coal” at all. I’d love to know more about the psychology of this and what makes it so attractive that you actually spend money and time to do so.

It's uncomplicated. I have coal rolling enthusiasts in my extended family. They're flag waving 'patriots' who have legitimately drank all the Kool-aid and believe that everyone to their left hates the country and is trying to destroy it in any way possible. And since the left-leaning folks often support green energy and efforts to reduce damage from the impending climate disaster, that hatred manifests as doing whatever they think is the polar opposite of what their left-leaning friends and family would like. It is precisely the same motivation that underlies embracing the 'deplorables' moniker (I think none of them actually read the whole remark) by intentionally acting like an asshole.

It's not issues based at all, they really are playing hard core identity politics and they consider anyone who disagrees with them to be morally contemptible and inhuman.

Re: Donut Lab’s all-solid-state battery delivers 400 Wh/kg of energy density

#227

Post by rootusrootus »

gosub100 wrote: post #205
yencabulator wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I can confidently say that every one of them would love EVs if [...] And I can confidently say I see rural pickup owners rolling coal about weekly, so no, they will not be loving EVs, because it hampers them destroying their surroundings.

Rolling coal is rude an obnoxious but doesn't "destroy" anything. I think you are projecting something personal against the stereotype guy that does that. Just like someone who was bullied might irrationally hate tough looking bikers. Some men (and women!) like large and overpowered trucks. You don't have to like them, but you should praise the freedom that this country gives us to choose our own pursuits.

Intent matters. Some older diesel vehicles smoke a bit. That is normal. Intentionally detuning the engine to inject massive amounts of fuel in order to induce billowing clouds of black smoke is indefensible. It is especially bad because they are not out there using this capability in innocent fun, it is specifically aimed at passersby who happen to be driving a fuel efficient vehicle or riding a bicycle.

Some of us do enjoy large, overpowered trucks. Like me -- with my Lightning. Faster than a Hellcat (off the line, at least ;-)) and more efficient than a Prius. And waaaaaaay faster than nearly all of the coal-rolling morons. Best part is that I'm not intentionally polluting the air everyone around me is obligated to breathe. Go out, have fun, be civil about it.

Re: Donut Lab’s all-solid-state battery delivers 400 Wh/kg of energy density

#228

Post by rootusrootus »

tempsaasexample wrote: post #203
ninkendo wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s range anxiety and it’s real. And it’s not entirely unjustified. Where I live in the Midwest I have literally never seen a public charging station. I know they exist because I can search for them on maps app and I see dots, but it speaks to their general small numbers that I’ve never seen one in person that I can remember. Now, prior to this, I lived in California for many years from 2011 until 2019, and I saw to…

I'm in California, and cost per mile of electricity vs gasoline is pretty similar in a Gen 1 Chevy Volt. I get 35 miles per gallon. That's also how for I can go on 10kwh in the good conditions. If gasoline is below $4.50 a gallon, it's cheaper to just run the volt on gasoline than it is to charge it at home.

That's particular to PG&E, as I recall, not all the utilities in California are so horribly mismanaged or got sued for burning an entire city to the ground. IMO the state should burn PG&E to the ground and replace the entire management structure with people who don't suck.

Re: Donut Lab’s all-solid-state battery delivers 400 Wh/kg of energy density

#229

Post by rootusrootus »

worik wrote: post #117
ninkendo wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s range anxiety and it’s real. And it’s not entirely unjustified. Where I live in the Midwest I have literally never seen a public charging station. I know they exist because I can search for them on maps app and I see dots, but it speaks to their general small numbers that I’ve never seen one in person that I can remember. Now, prior to this, I lived in California for many years from 2011 until 2019, and I saw to…

Where I live (Ōtepoti Aotearoa) charging at a charging station works out to be about the same price as petrol I have a plug in hybrid, and close to zero expertise, but I only charge at home, now I am doubtful that an EV is remotely economical if you cannot charge it at home

That is basically correct in the US as well. Fast charging is about the same cost per mile as gasoline. If your only way to charge the car is with a fast charger, I recommend considering carefully whether it's the right choice for you. The improved driving dynamics may still be worth it, for sure, so it's a very personal choice -- rarely do big purchases like this come down entirely to the bottom line cost.

Re: Donut Lab’s all-solid-state battery delivers 400 Wh/kg of energy density

#230

Post by rootusrootus »

stonogo wrote: post #96
senordevnyc wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's fine, those folks can just get angrier and angrier as the market makes their ICE cars more and more difficult and expensive to own.

I'm still waiting for the EV that's a car instead of some kind of techbro reimagining of personal transportation with a 27" tv glued to the dash. So far the plug-in hybrid market is figuring that out first -- the Mazda CX90 is a real car. The VW ID3 gets close, but it still feels like someone tried to design a B-movie space ship. There's a great market out there willing to buy B-movie space ships, but if EVs are goin…

My Lightning is difficult to distinguish from an ICE F150 unless you know specifically what you're looking for. Especially the trims that do not have a larger-than-usual infotainment screen.

It didn't save the Lightning from being canceled, but at least they pumped out a hundred thousand of them or so before turning tail and giving the market to GM.

Post reply on HN