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Will AI be the basis of many future industrial fortunes, or a net loser?

joincolossus.com

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Re: Will AI be the basis of many future industrial fortunes, or a net loser?

#221

Post by oblio »

larrry wrote: post #174
oblio wrote: post #159

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most art isn't like that. I would argue most people dislike that kind of art.

I understand not liking Pollock, and he’s often the butt of “my kid could do that”. But do you really think most people dislike it? In person they are compelling, and there is more skill at play than at first glance. I like them at least

Well, stuff that's popular is plastered everywhere. Think about artworks we see in movies, TV shows, billboards, album covers, book covers, basically everywhere around us.

I would argue that most art around us is current pop art or classical/realist/romantic art, not modern/postmodern/abstract expressionist art.

Re: Will AI be the basis of many future industrial fortunes, or a net loser?

#222

Post by bgwalter »

hyperbovine wrote: post #123
zwnow wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Funny how everyone is just okay with the basis for all this art being stolen art by actual humans. Zero sense of ethics.

Not clear that being able to sample from a distribution == stealing.

Given that "AI" training needs millions of books, papers and web pages, it is a derivative work of all those books. Humans cannot even read a fraction of that and still surpass "AI" in any creative and generative domain.

"AI" is a smart, camouflaged photocopier.

Re: Will AI be the basis of many future industrial fortunes, or a net loser?

#223

Post by akho »

hexo wrote: post #217
chii wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> ironic if AI actually ended up destroying economic activity that's not destroying economic activity - it's removing a less efficient activity and replace it with a more efficient version. This produces economic surplus. Imagine saying this for someone digging a hole, that if they use a mechanical digger instead of a hand shovel, they'd destroy economic activity since it now cost less to dig that hole!

your example is complete nonsense as digging a hole is not creative in any way at all

It creates a hole. What does AI create?

Re: Will AI be the basis of many future industrial fortunes, or a net loser?

#224

Post by Eisenstein »

yardie wrote: post #211
Eisenstein wrote: post #193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you believe that music made from samples is not original?

Most of the courts don’t think they are. Early rap beats used lots of samples. Some of the most popular hip hop songs made $0 for the artists as they had to pay royalties on those samples.

Most synthesizers use sampled instruments.

Re: Will AI be the basis of many future industrial fortunes, or a net loser?

#225

Post by postholedigger »

hexo wrote: post #217
chii wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> ironic if AI actually ended up destroying economic activity that's not destroying economic activity - it's removing a less efficient activity and replace it with a more efficient version. This produces economic surplus. Imagine saying this for someone digging a hole, that if they use a mechanical digger instead of a hand shovel, they'd destroy economic activity since it now cost less to dig that hole!

your example is complete nonsense as digging a hole is not creative in any way at all

How many holes have you dug?

What was the soil like?

What was the weather like?

What equipment did you use?

Do you dig during daylight only?

Re: Will AI be the basis of many future industrial fortunes, or a net loser?

#226

Post by dghlsakjg »

nostrademons wrote: post #215
chii wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> ironic if AI actually ended up destroying economic activity that's not destroying economic activity - it's removing a less efficient activity and replace it with a more efficient version. This produces economic surplus. Imagine saying this for someone digging a hole, that if they use a mechanical digger instead of a hand shovel, they'd destroy economic activity since it now cost less to dig that hole!

It's not that it's replacing one form of activity with a cheaper one, it's that it removes the transaction . Which means that now there's nothing to tax, and nothing to measure. As far as GDP is concerned, economic activity will have gone down, even though the same work is being accomplished differently.

This sounds in awful lot like a cousin of the broken window fallacy.

The fallacy being that when a careless kid breaks a window of a store, that we should celebrate because the glazier now has been paid to come out and do a job. Economic activity has increased by one measure! Should we go around breaking windows? Of course not.

Re: Will AI be the basis of many future industrial fortunes, or a net loser?

#227

Post by morkalork »

iamacyborg wrote: post #129
Waterluvian wrote: post #17

I think the interesting idea with “AI” is that it seems to significantly reduce barriers to entry in many domains. I haven’t seen a company convincingly demonstrate that this affects them at all. Lots of fluff but nothing compelling. But I have seen many examples by individuals, including myself. For years I’ve loved poking at video game dev for fun. The main problem has always been art assets. I’m terrible at art an…

> It reminds me of what GarageBand or iMovie and YouTube and such did for making music and videos so accessible to people who didn’t go to school for any of that, let alone owned complex equipment or expensive licenses to Adobe Thisandthat. It’s worth reading William Deresiewicz‘ The Death of the Artist. I’m not entirely convinced that marketing that everyone can create art/games/whatever is actually a net positive r…

It shifted the signal to noise ratio but its not a net negative either. There's whole new genres of music that exist now because easy mixing tech is freely available. Do you or I like SoundCloud mumble rap? No, probably not. But there's enough people out there that do

Re: Will AI be the basis of many future industrial fortunes, or a net loser?

#228

Post by Ygg2 »

Eisenstein wrote: post #193
Ygg2 wrote: post #163

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Do you value self expression? Did you train the AI yourself? On your own music? Or was music scrapped from Net and blended in LLM?

Do you believe that music made from samples is not original?

I could see that remixes are partially original. But you're not even doing the remixing; the LLMs are.

Re: Will AI be the basis of many future industrial fortunes, or a net loser?

#229

Post by bluefirebrand »

safety1st wrote: post #176
guy_5676 wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No idea why this is downvoted, making AI music customized to your exact situation/preferences is very addictive. I have my own playlist I listen to pretty frequently

Foolishly, the Hacker News hive mind has a tendency to downvote any prediction that AI will be successful. It's clear a lot of people don't want it to eat the world, but it will.

Baffling comment

Yeah it's going to eat the world, but it's foolish to wish that it doesn't?

I guess you won't mind signing up to be one of the first things AI eats then?

Re: Will AI be the basis of many future industrial fortunes, or a net loser?

#230

Post by dghlsakjg »

hexo wrote: post #217
chii wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> ironic if AI actually ended up destroying economic activity that's not destroying economic activity - it's removing a less efficient activity and replace it with a more efficient version. This produces economic surplus. Imagine saying this for someone digging a hole, that if they use a mechanical digger instead of a hand shovel, they'd destroy economic activity since it now cost less to dig that hole!

your example is complete nonsense as digging a hole is not creative in any way at all

People get paid to create holes for useful purposes all day everyday. It is creative in a very literal sense. Precision hole digging is - no joke - a multibillion dollar industry.

Unless you are out in nature you are almost certainly sitting or standing on top of a dirt that was paid to be dug.

If you mean hole digging isn’t creative in the figurative sense. Also wrong. People will pay thousands of dollars to travel and see holes dug in the ground. The Nazca lines is but one example of holes dug in the ground creatively that people regard as art.

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