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Stripe Launches L1 Blockchain: Tempo

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Re: Stripe Launches L1 Blockchain: Tempo

#221

Post by alphazard »

It doesn't look like there's any information about the consensus mechanism, until that's described in detail, it's unclear what the advantages are, or if it really is suited to payments. There are existing algorithms (like Avalanche L1, or some of the Ethereum L2s), which have fast finality particularly suited to the point-of-sale use case.

They cut out a lot of work for themselves expecting stable coins to materialize on their own chain. It's Stripe, so maybe they are allowed to mint their own USD stable coin, but that's one coin. They might have been better off making an L2 on Ethereum. Otherwise they are going to have to run Uniswap in their EVM implementation and hope that liquidity shows up.

I can see Stripe's customers wanting to use a solution that just works and is backed by Stripe's own distributed ledger, but I can't see their customers' customers wanting to do the same. Their customers' customers are going to want liquidity to other tokens, and privacy. At this point I don't think that a payments protocol can succeed unless it provides privacy comparable to Monero, liquidity to a major L1 and its family of tokens, and of course, fast finality.

Re: Stripe Launches L1 Blockchain: Tempo

#222

Post by abxyz »

hvb2 wrote: post #209
baby wrote: post #182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'll attempt an answer: Today, if you want to transact between businesses or retail (folks like you and I), you need to find a route between the two entities' banks. This route might take several hops, passing through some central banks, and some of these hops might be instant or might take days to actually settle. On top of that, you need to pay the service that helped you find a route (SWIFT) and potentially the no…

So why can a traditional bank not solve this? In Europe you can wire money across borders for free, you just need to know the account number. Arrives in seconds at 0 cost. I feel like a lot of the fintech in the US is purely a result of a lack of regulation. For the example of Argentina, the real reason that business is using crypto is because their currency is unreliable. It might be a good fit there but trading in…

I’m as cynical about crypto as any sane person but I think you’re hand-waving away the challenges of international business. How can you transact in dollars if you’re a business in Argentina? As you say, if you’re operating in Europe, this is a solved problem, but lots of businesses are operating across borders that don’t have the same payment options. Banks could solve this problem but they haven’t and this is what non-banks have come up with. I’m sure if SEPA was global this wouldn’t be necessary, but it isn’t.

Re: Stripe Launches L1 Blockchain: Tempo

#223

Post by jrm4 »

petertodd wrote: post #164
jrm4 wrote: post #125

Ah the layers. Okay, so one: Obviously pointless from a tech POV. There is nothing that a Stripe controlled blockchain could offer that a database could not. But then, why? Sadly, as someone who does like the ideals of true cryptocurrency, yet another way to make sure "real" crypto doesn't happen, much like what is happening to BTC. Here's hoping (yeah, it's a long shot) people see through all of this and maybe, MAYB…

> There is nothing that a Stripe controlled blockchain could offer that a database could not. One way of thinking about a blockchain is to think of it as a shared datastructure to keep databases in sync. Any time you want to distribute your database over more than just a single central place, in a cryptographically secure way, you're probably going to re-invent a blockchain to do it.

I understand all of this and I stand by my claim of pointlessness.

Stripe, nor any other bank or bank-esque thing needs this because they have already well solved their problem of "trust."

"Blockchain" is pointless overhead here.

Re: Stripe Launches L1 Blockchain: Tempo

#224

Post by jrm4 »

serial_dev wrote: post #212
udev4096 wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a LOT more than that. You are still stuck in satoshi-era. Things have evolved quite a bit that it's no longer just a db sync

Care to elaborate?

I'll chime in here;e.g. Ethereum is more than a database. It's a computer. You can write and execute code on it.

(but also, as OP, Stripe will almost certainly not have any use for this)

Re: Stripe Launches L1 Blockchain: Tempo

#225

Post by CalChris »

pc wrote: post #46

There are lots of crypto skeptics on HN (and we ourselves were disappointed with crypto's payments utility for much of the past decade), so it might be interesting to share what changed our mind over the past couple of years: we started to notice a lot of real-world businesses finding utility in stablecoins. For example, Bridge (a stablecoin orchestration platform that Stripe acquired) is used by SpaceX for managing…

Compare and contrast L1 to FedNow.

  1.5%
vs

  $0.045 per credit transfer
  $0.01 per request for payment message
  $1.00 per liquidity management transfer
Nice work if you can get it.

BTW, it is crypto. So the promise that none of these businesses are using crypto because it's crypto or for any speculative benefit is a provisional promise at best. Hyrum's Law argues an opposite future.

Re: Stripe Launches L1 Blockchain: Tempo

#226

Post by notatoad »

apinstein wrote: post #151

Here's the play. It's very simple, and it's quite good. Stripe processes a LOT of money. The customers that get that money need to move it around. Often to banks. Stripe makes no money on that. Over the last few years, stablecoins have become a preferred means to hold and move money (for convenience, etc). Stablecoin providers make money on their float -- selling stablecoins means you get free deposits, and risk-free…

i'm still unclear what the crypto really adds to this play. stripe customers need to move their money around, and they need a trusted source to hold money. stripe could just do that. why add crypto into the mix?

Re: Stripe Launches L1 Blockchain: Tempo

#227

Post by cyberax »

pc wrote: post #46

There are lots of crypto skeptics on HN (and we ourselves were disappointed with crypto's payments utility for much of the past decade), so it might be interesting to share what changed our mind over the past couple of years: we started to notice a lot of real-world businesses finding utility in stablecoins. For example, Bridge (a stablecoin orchestration platform that Stripe acquired) is used by SpaceX for managing…

> For example, Bridge (a stablecoin orchestration platform that Stripe acquired) is used by SpaceX for managing money in long-tail markets

Do they use it to arbitrate NFTs? (need more jargon)

Because SpaceX is definitely something that screams "finance" to me.

Re: Stripe Launches L1 Blockchain: Tempo

#228

Post by bornfreddy »

baby wrote: post #202
jrm4 wrote: post #125

Ah the layers. Okay, so one: Obviously pointless from a tech POV. There is nothing that a Stripe controlled blockchain could offer that a database could not. But then, why? Sadly, as someone who does like the ideals of true cryptocurrency, yet another way to make sure "real" crypto doesn't happen, much like what is happening to BTC. Here's hoping (yeah, it's a long shot) people see through all of this and maybe, MAYB…

A cryptocurrency is basically a distributed database, except that you are getting different actors who don't necessarily trust one to run it cooperatively.

Well yeah, that's the point.

Re: Stripe Launches L1 Blockchain: Tempo

#229

Post by __MatrixMan__ »

jrm4 wrote: post #125

Ah the layers. Okay, so one: Obviously pointless from a tech POV. There is nothing that a Stripe controlled blockchain could offer that a database could not. But then, why? Sadly, as someone who does like the ideals of true cryptocurrency, yet another way to make sure "real" crypto doesn't happen, much like what is happening to BTC. Here's hoping (yeah, it's a long shot) people see through all of this and maybe, MAYB…

> Stripe controlled blockchain could offer that a database could not.

A database cannot resist tampering by somebody with admin access to the database. It may be the only thing that blockchains have going for them, but it's a big one.

Re: Stripe Launches L1 Blockchain: Tempo

#230

Post by cyberax »

udev4096 wrote: post #207
baby wrote: post #202

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A cryptocurrency is basically a distributed database, except that you are getting different actors who don't necessarily trust one to run it cooperatively.

It's a LOT more than that. You are still stuck in satoshi-era. Things have evolved quite a bit that it's no longer just a db sync

Yes. There's also a drug money laundering level (Monero, mixers, etc.) and a built-in scam enhancer (NFTs).
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