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Americans Lose Faith That Hard Work Leads to Economic Gains, WSJ-NORC Poll Finds

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Re: Americans Lose Faith That Hard Work Leads to Economic Gains, WSJ-NORC Poll Finds

#221

Post by haleem123 »

jparishy wrote: post #66

Wealth inequality is high. High enough you can feel it like a vibe in the air. The richest people in the world are telling everyone to get onboard with technology that is determined to make a lot of those same people's jobs redundant. All with an explicit goal of increasing the price of stock most of those people do not own. IMO there's two economies, maybe divided by those who participate in the stock market and tho…

>> The richest people in the world are telling everyone to get onboard with technology that is determined to make a lot of those same people's jobs redundant.

The richest people I know are trying to convince everyone

1. There is a "worker shortage" in an attempt to bring in immigrant workers whom they can boss around and keep on a leash

2. That "AI is taking jobs" so you cannot point the people who are really taking jobs -- policy makers

3. There is "low unemployment" to perpetuate the myth that the economy is great

4. "Anyone can make it" while their nepo-babies get back-door access to jobs at top firms and claim "they worked hard up the ranks"

Re: Americans Lose Faith That Hard Work Leads to Economic Gains, WSJ-NORC Poll Finds

#222

Post by koakuma-chan »

WalterBright wrote: post #214
koakuma-chan wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You gotta realize that "experience" refers to "professional" or "commercial" experience, i.e. you gain experience by having the status of an employee at a company and having relevant job title.

No, I don't gotta realize that. I'd be impressed by a resume with such accomplishments.

Being impressed by accomplishments listed in a resume requires actually looking at a resume, which most recruiters don't do ;) And even if they do, and even if the recruiter is impressed, they look for X number of years, not for accomplishments.

Re: Americans Lose Faith That Hard Work Leads to Economic Gains, WSJ-NORC Poll Finds

#223

Post by WalterBright »

mathiaspoint wrote: post #215
WalterBright wrote: post #214

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, I don't gotta realize that. I'd be impressed by a resume with such accomplishments.

I think you're right that it did used to work that way but now all the juniors are competing with people like me who have done all of that and also have five years of professional experience at large companies.

I don't know you, so I will speculate that something else is going on. There are a lot of ways to not get hired.

For example, one guy I interviewed spent all his time asking about what benefits he was going to get. He had no interest whatsoever in what he'd be doing, and what the company was doing. No hire.

Unfortunately, such is commonplace. This gives the savvy interviewee an advantage - approach the interview from the employer's point of view. Save your questions about how much vacation you'll get until after the employer has decided to hire you.

Re: Americans Lose Faith That Hard Work Leads to Economic Gains, WSJ-NORC Poll Finds

#224

Post by haleem123 »

hakunin wrote: post #216

I was always curious, why would anyone believe that hard work leads to economic gains in the first place? That's like saying "flapping your hands very fast leads to building a house". Nothing about working hard has anything to do with economic gains. This has always felt to me like magical thinking: if I check certain boxes, I'm automatically entitled to "hard work funds" allocated to me. Like anything in capitalist…

>> I was always curious, why would anyone believe that hard work leads to economic gains in the first place?

Because I saw it work my my immigrant grandparents and parents. It doesnt work anymore

Re: Americans Lose Faith That Hard Work Leads to Economic Gains, WSJ-NORC Poll Finds

#225

Post by ac29 »

zackmorris wrote: post #152
jparishy wrote: post #66

Wealth inequality is high. High enough you can feel it like a vibe in the air. The richest people in the world are telling everyone to get onboard with technology that is determined to make a lot of those same people's jobs redundant. All with an explicit goal of increasing the price of stock most of those people do not own. IMO there's two economies, maybe divided by those who participate in the stock market and tho…

I've only known a "good" economy from about 1995-1999 when the internet went mainstream and for the briefest of moments, we got a taste of what public investment in tech feels like. The powers that be quickly saw the danger in that and IMHO orchestrated the Dot Bomb, 9/11, the Housing Bubble, etc to keep as much money as possible out of public hands so that the average person wouldn't have the means to participate in…

> Vanguard is now cannibalizing US real estate rather than making venture capital available to small businesses and startups in its insatiable hunger for profit.

I'm not sure you understand what Vanguard does. They are not an investment bank nor a VC firm. They run mutual funds and ETFs, so the assets that "Vanguard" owns are owned by the fund holders (in fact in the case of Vanguard, the fund holders also own Vanguard itself).

Re: Americans Lose Faith That Hard Work Leads to Economic Gains, WSJ-NORC Poll Finds

#226

Post by mathiaspoint »

WalterBright wrote: post #223
mathiaspoint wrote: post #215

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you're right that it did used to work that way but now all the juniors are competing with people like me who have done all of that and also have five years of professional experience at large companies.

I don't know you, so I will speculate that something else is going on. There are a lot of ways to not get hired. For example, one guy I interviewed spent all his time asking about what benefits he was going to get. He had no interest whatsoever in what he'd be doing, and what the company was doing. No hire. Unfortunately, such is commonplace. This gives the savvy interviewee an advantage - approach the interview from…

First of all I don't think you should be surprised that pay is the most interesting thing to potential employees? That is the entire reason they're tolerating you. If I just want to work on interesting things you would only get in the way.

Secondly, yeah, I'm not like that. I've got three or so side projects (I guess they're just projects now) I'm actively working on and have been building things with my teens. It doesn't matter anymore socially, like everything else in the US your counterpart just never shows up.

Re: Americans Lose Faith That Hard Work Leads to Economic Gains, WSJ-NORC Poll Finds

#227

Post by bloomingeek »

paulpauper wrote: post #97
jparishy wrote: post #66

Wealth inequality is high. High enough you can feel it like a vibe in the air. The richest people in the world are telling everyone to get onboard with technology that is determined to make a lot of those same people's jobs redundant. All with an explicit goal of increasing the price of stock most of those people do not own. IMO there's two economies, maybe divided by those who participate in the stock market and tho…

If you're smart or lucky enough to to land that 6-figure job, then times are pretty good. There are tons of stories on subreddits, e.g. r/FIRE, r/investing, r/fatfire, etc., of people with large nest eggs and home ownership at an early age. But those are outliers. There are many opportunities to get rich if you are lucky and or smart enough to land them, like in tech or finance. But this is not much consolation for t…

These are words that most won't like to read or reply to, but are none the less true. After working with many people for many years, it became apparent that some of us are "smarter" then others. Through the fluke(?) of genetics/whatever of life, some can only attain a certain job status. A compassionate society and government must take this into consideration. We tend to label some as "lazy" who can't rise in economic status, but in many instances,they are doing the best they can.

Re: Americans Lose Faith That Hard Work Leads to Economic Gains, WSJ-NORC Poll Finds

#228

Post by dfxm12 »

Izikiel43 wrote: post #200
potsandpans wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No

Care to elaborate? The fed during both trump and Biden governments printed a ton of money for covid relief and stimulus, which caused inflation in bidens government.

You made the initial unsubstantiated claim. Please explore all the causes of inflation during the global pandemic: supply chain issues, (yes) stimulus spending, housing shortages, greedflation, the Russia invasion of Ukraine, etc.

Why does the ARP stick out to you as being what led this inflation, or even a net negative? Please consider the positive impacts and don't forget that the US recovered from COVID faster than other advanced economies. For however inflation screwed the working American, the ARP directly enabled these folks to pay bills, and buy things they wouldn't otherwise have been able to, screening them even more. Economists say the stimulus directly prevented deflation, which hit some other economies hard, like Japan.

Giving working people the ability to raise families, buy homes and go to school to get a good job is what supports the American dream and is what will make America thrive. Increasingly, these things are out of reach, but the ARP reminded people that enabling the American dream is a policy choice. If you think government giving support to Americans is an issue, first look at cutting support targeted toward the capital owning class.

Re: Americans Lose Faith That Hard Work Leads to Economic Gains, WSJ-NORC Poll Finds

#229

Post by ac29 »

paulpauper wrote: post #112
TuringNYC wrote: post #7

I live in a community full of high-achieving GenZ who did 4-7 AP courses, studied their butts off for the SAT, got into good universities....only to not find any jobs when they graduate with STEM degrees. A dozen neighbors' kids have been asking me for zero-salary jobs just to get experience.

But they still will be faring better than others though. I am sure STEM grads are doing better than law school grads or humanities grads. But graduating in STEM in 2009-2010 would have been awesome. right at the takeoff of a decade-long economic expansion and tech boom. It was much easier to be hired

> But graduating in STEM in 2009-2010 would have been awesome. right at the takeoff of a decade-long economic expansion and tech boom. It was much easier to be hired

The S is STEM is pretty broad and includes many fields that have nothing to do with "tech". I graduated with a science degree in 2009-2010 and it was fucking awful. The only job I could find was at the University I went to and it paid like $5/hr above minimum wage. I left the field entirely pretty quickly.

Re: Americans Lose Faith That Hard Work Leads to Economic Gains, WSJ-NORC Poll Finds

#230

Post by spwa4 »

I can only say: welcome to the EU!

I mean, you're not there yet of course, but that's how we've all felt in the EU for at least 50 years now. If work, in any amount, cannot change your social position then the game becomes finding whatever excuse to work as little as possible.

I must say, I'm feeling depressed this month. Can't. I just can't.

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