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Working on databases from prison

turso.tech

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Re: Working on databases from prison

#221

Post by freedomben »

tired-turtle wrote: post #191
ty6853 wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One of the most baffling elements of the justice system is how little the victim is involved in the justice. 'Society' should not lord the lion's share of the justice decisions over the victims. Quite often the victim would prefer compensation and release over getting fuck all while the perpetrator languages in prison at the tax dollar of the victim. Much of 'justice' has been usurped from the victim into a jobs camp…

Distancing the victim from the outcome of sentencing is by design and, arguably, for the better in a democracy. Crimes violate the social order, not just the victim. It behooves us all to have a system wherein (in theory) the system, not the victim, applies a set of rules to determine punishment, as contrary as that might seem to one’s sense of self, morals, etc. It’s a part of why “justice is blind.”

Also victims are nearly always emotionally involved, and emotional-based decisions aren't generally good. Punishments would be much more severe if it were up to the victims.

If victims determined the sentences, I expect people would spend a lot more time in prison, way more than a non-emotionally involved and wronged person would think fair.

IMHO letting victims set the sentence would be the worst way to do it.

Re: Working on databases from prison

#222

Post by oersted »

djrj477dhsnv wrote: post #189
pookha wrote: post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd like to see him get life in prison with no chance at parole. He's responsible for at least three deaths (probably more) but because he's proficient at social engineering and feeding people lines he's weaseled his way into the tech industry (from prison!). Over 78k people died in 2023 of fentanyl alone and this twerp was trafficking a substance far more lethal, he literally left a trail of bodies in his wake. http…

While tragic, those people (or at least the vast majority) weren't forced to use drugs. They made that decision and faced the consequences. Shifting the blame for their poor decisions onto the drug dealer is unwarranted imo.

I agree it’s not black and white, but let’s be reasonable. When you sell to an addict the drug they crave, knowing full well that they will take it, and you switch it with deadly poison, just because it’s cheaper? I mean, it is hard to argue that it is not an act of both fraud and premeditated murder, at the very least gross negligence. Is the addict responsible for the risk they were obviously taking? Well sure, not that they have much of a choice at that point, but there’s always a choice, and mostly they got themselves into that situation, and they are committing a crime too. Still that doesn’t take much blame away from the dealer.

It’s like saying: it’s your fault that you got shot for being in the wrong neighborhood at night. Were they knowingly taking a risk? Sure, but the murderer is still a murderer.

And we long got rid of the concept of “outlaw” where if you commit a crime any subsequent crime on you is fair game. That’s rather barbaric.

EDIT: I was assuming that it is obvious that no one takes such synthetic opioids on purpose. They are known not to be much fun and very dangerous. They are mostly used as a cheap filler in other more mainstream drugs, most notably in fake branded prescription drugs.

Re: Working on databases from prison

#223

Post by unit149 »

glommer wrote: post #30
chatmasta wrote: post #6

How does the compensation work? The US prison system has a bit of a nasty reputation when it comes to exploiting prison labor, so I hope those practices aren’t carrying over into these more forward-looking types of initiative… but at the same time, surely Turso isn’t paying full SWE salary?

I am the Turso CEO. We pay him a full salary, just not health care benefits.

[dead]

Re: Working on databases from prison

#224

Post by qingcharles »

h1fra wrote: post #175

Prison is about rehabilitation, anything else is either slavery or poor politics. Very glad to see this blog post!

I've got a lot of experience working with prisoners. I've almost never seen any rehabilitative programs of any value at all. Mostly the programs I see are "learn to mop floors."

I just helped someone to complete a year-long paralegal course and qualification while inside. The Illinois prison system has now banned this since (a) it came with the option of facilities awarding a 6 month reduction in the length of a non-violent sentence, (b) required the facility to allow someone to proctor the final exam.

Re: Working on databases from prison

#225

Post by freedomben »

tristan957 wrote: post #208
pyuser583 wrote: post #188

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's unclear whether the carve out for prisoners applies to just "involuntary servitude" or "slavery and involuntary servitude." In practice, only "involuntary servitude" has been used. "Community service" - unpaid - is a very common low level sentence. The eighth and fourteenth amendments almost certainly forbid enslavement - permanently becoming human property - as a criminal sentence. Even before the 13th amendmen…

If we pay people 40 cents an hour just to say they aren't slaves, they they are slaves for all intents and purposes. They are put in poor working conditions working for for-profit companies, making much less than minimum wage. How is it legal for the State to not provide sunscreen or shade for inmates doing outdoor manual labor? https://theappeal.org/louisiana-prisoners-demand-an-end-to-m...

I don't disagree that 40 cents an hour is ludicrous and is only one notch above slavery, but I do think it worth pointing out that the work for 40 cents per hour is voluntary (i.e. they can quit or choose not to accept the work), whereas "slavery" is very much not.

Re: Working on databases from prison

#226

Post by hollerith »

djrj477dhsnv wrote: post #189
pookha wrote: post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd like to see him get life in prison with no chance at parole. He's responsible for at least three deaths (probably more) but because he's proficient at social engineering and feeding people lines he's weaseled his way into the tech industry (from prison!). Over 78k people died in 2023 of fentanyl alone and this twerp was trafficking a substance far more lethal, he literally left a trail of bodies in his wake. http…

While tragic, those people (or at least the vast majority) weren't forced to use drugs. They made that decision and faced the consequences. Shifting the blame for their poor decisions onto the drug dealer is unwarranted imo.

If someone breaks the law by jaywalking, and a driver of a car runs him over when he could have avoiding hitting him (by braking) is it likewise unwarranted to shift the blame for the poor decisions of the jaywalker onto the driver?

If not, what is the reason you decide the two situations differently?

Re: Working on databases from prison

#227

Post by gbalduzzi »

Balinares wrote: post #206
jjmarr wrote: post #201

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They need money to pay for oversight. Any time prisoners talk to someone on the outside, it's a potential conduit for contraband or organized crime.

The exact same is true of people working outside of prison.

I think it's reasonable to assume an additional risk for people in prison.

Even though the enrolled people are completely trustworthy, doing this prevents untrustworthy people to simulate interest in the program just to be able to contact the external world for illegal activities.

Re: Working on databases from prison

#228

Post by tartoran »

dgacmu wrote: post #173
glommer wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Preston was free to negotiate his pay with us, and we pay him a full salary. Just no health care benefits.

Does he actually get the salary, or does the prison take huge overhead?

Even in the case he doesn't, it's still an amazing opportunity to learn that would lead to a better future for sure.

Re: Working on databases from prison

#229

Post by aerostable_slug »

wil421 wrote: post #181
ChrisMarshallNY wrote: post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Excluding a very small handful of SVU level crimes everything should be wiped clean after 5 years or so. My understanding, is that's what the UK does, with an exemption for certain jobs, like teachers and creche hosts. In the US, I think some states have the ability to expunge convictions. Not sure about federal crimes, though. The "scarlet letter" of a past conviction is a very real issue, and keeps some folks dow…

My state will automatically expunge non violent misdemeanors after 2010, so if it happened before you have to jump through hoops. I know people who dropped out of college because they had a very small drug charge, no use in finishing if you will have a scarlet letter over your head forever.

That's really unfortunate. I work with people who were formally justice-involved every day and their educations have been an aid to them personally and professionally. A felony or a "bad" misdemeanor (e.g. domestic violence) isn't the end of the world, even in the modern US. People can and do overcome the consequences of their mistakes and thrive.

Re: Working on databases from prison

#230

Post by qingcharles »

tiffanyh wrote: post #157

Very interesting. I have some basic questions if anyone knows: a. do all inmates get computer & internet access? (or only some, dependent upon the crime you committed) b. do the inmates have to pay to use the computer & internet? I ask because I hear commissary is prohibitively expensive in prison. c. how much time per week do inmate get to use the computer with internet access? (and is that time guaranteed they will…

This place is an absolute rarity. Almost zero jails or prisons have any access to the Internet at all. Many of the places I know won't even allow a print-out of any information from the Internet (e.g. Wikipedia, Facebook etc) and won't allow any books about computers for security reasons.

Commissary is generally "gas station" prices in jails and prisons.

Some of the inmates I work with right now have tablets that allow music streaming from a small catalog, but I think it is $3/hour to listen to it.

Obviously the families and friends of the loved are the ones burdened with paying for all of these, unless you can get an in-prison job that pays, e.g. dealing drugs is probably the highest paid, sadly.

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