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Daily driving a Linux phone, but why?

thefoggiest.dev

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Re: Daily driving a Linux phone, but why?

#221

Post by seba_dos1 »

pengaru wrote: post #218
seba_dos1 wrote: post #154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Video recording implementation could be better though, but other stuff works well indeed :) In fact all things from that chart are there and have been there for years now, including 20h battery life and encrypted SIP calls.

20h battery life? Mine comes nowhere close to that with all hw switches off and only playing mp3's... Are you quoting a when suspended figure or something?

It can get up to 20h either when idle with all hw switches off or when suspended with the modem on (less with poor signal coverage, of course). Looking at a power meter right now I'd roughly expect at least 12h of music playback.

Re: Daily driving a Linux phone, but why?

#222

Post by pengaru »

seba_dos1 wrote: post #221
pengaru wrote: post #218

Earlier quoted context omitted.

20h battery life? Mine comes nowhere close to that with all hw switches off and only playing mp3's... Are you quoting a when suspended figure or something?

It can get up to 20h either when idle with all hw switches off or when suspended with the modem on (less with poor signal coverage, of course). Looking at a power meter right now I'd roughly expect at least 12h of music playback.

Using the latest greatest stock pureOS?

My L5 gets nowhere near that listening to MP3s on road trips.

Re: Daily driving a Linux phone, but why?

#223

Post by seba_dos1 »

pengaru wrote: post #222
seba_dos1 wrote: post #221

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It can get up to 20h either when idle with all hw switches off or when suspended with the modem on (less with poor signal coverage, of course). Looking at a power meter right now I'd roughly expect at least 12h of music playback.

Using the latest greatest stock pureOS? My L5 gets nowhere near that listening to MP3s on road trips.

Check whether you get a high load average whenever Wi-Fi kill switch is off. If so, keeping it on and turning Wi-Fi off in software may give you better results. There are patches to fix that, but they need more work not to cause troubles with older cards (Redpine).

There was also another issue that may have caused interrupt storms when kill switches were set to off, but that has been already fixed recently.

There are some small power consumption improvements coming in kernel updates soon too, though these shouldn't make a drastic difference, just an extra hour or so.

Re: Daily driving a Linux phone, but why?

#224

Post by guappa »

tholdem wrote: post #191
guappa wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While the never fixed 0days on android are completely secure. And let's not forget the several noclick attacks that can root your iphone with a message :)

How can you compare iOS or Android security with desktop Linux security? Have you checked what it takes to achieve those 0-click root exploits on iOS or Android compared to a desktop Linux distro? Not even in the same league.

Have you checked the time it takes apple or any android vendor to fix anything vs the time it takes a linux distribution?

Months vs hours.

Re: Daily driving a Linux phone, but why?

#225

Post by gehsty »

SahAssar wrote: post #220
gehsty wrote: post #217

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Does this mean that open source is more important than privacy to people of this mindset? Again from my layman’s perspective I would expect the hardened iPhone, using iMessage and key verification, to be more secure.

Well, first of all I think if something is open source it will tend to be more privacy-focused since it will disclose what it tracks. People will either find that acceptable or fork and change. > Does this mean that open source is more important than privacy to people of this mindset? Not exactly, but I think the questions should really be something like "who is the guarantor of your privacy?" If you are happy with i…

True, I’m very interested in understanding how secure the open source alternative is, I struggle to believe it is as secure as there are so many layers, and the surface seems much bigger. I guess if you are worried about being hacked then the open source method is likely less secure, but if you are worried about being monitored then Apple is more of a risk as you don’t know what goes on behind their servers etc.

Re: Daily driving a Linux phone, but why?

#226

Post by SahAssar »

gehsty wrote: post #225
SahAssar wrote: post #220

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, first of all I think if something is open source it will tend to be more privacy-focused since it will disclose what it tracks. People will either find that acceptable or fork and change. > Does this mean that open source is more important than privacy to people of this mindset? Not exactly, but I think the questions should really be something like "who is the guarantor of your privacy?" If you are happy with i…

True, I’m very interested in understanding how secure the open source alternative is, I struggle to believe it is as secure as there are so many layers, and the surface seems much bigger. I guess if you are worried about being hacked then the open source method is likely less secure, but if you are worried about being monitored then Apple is more of a risk as you don’t know what goes on behind their servers etc.

My general stance is that the fewer things I need to trust the more secure I am. That goes for services, companies, dependencies, programs, etc.

Besides that there is also all of the transitive points, like what does apple trust? What does google trust?

I'm not sure if I'm more secure, but I am sure that I have less people influencing my security and that I have a reasonable way to validate them.

Re: Daily driving a Linux phone, but why?

#227

Post by erxam »

margalabargala wrote: post #202
erxam wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is kind of extreme. I personally daily drove the OG Pinephone for about a year-and-a-half, back in 2020. I bought in during the postmarketOS edition. I'm still dealing with the fallout from the choices I made in order to conform with that phone. And at the end of the day... I got nothing out of it. Nothing but issues, problems and inconveniences. The modem eventually stopped working for some reason, and I moved to…

Would you be willing to talk about the fallout you refer to?

I might have been a little dramatic.

It mostly boils down to the fact that I can't really face the shame of admitting that pretty much everything I did was a waste of time and effort and returning to using proprietary, hated private solutions.

Read: messaging apps, banking, apps for work, basically everything.

Re: Daily driving a Linux phone, but why?

#228

Post by xorcist »

guappa wrote: post #67
xorcist wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Server software is usually compartmentalized in uid:s but desktop software seldom is, if ever. Package managers and maintainers could do a lot here to make it easier. Some things long time Linux users like to do, like running Firefox as a separate user, is still a much more involved process than it should be. A lot of it is probably standards and culture work, like where a user can expect to store files and have them…

You're going to deal with the users who can't attach a file to an email because the firefox process has no access to it?

That's exactly my point. Users expect desktop software to read their home directory, which is an artefact of running under the same uid. The same can not be said for server software, where the expectation is different.

Linux desktop environments had the chance to set a precedent here where software could for example have had a directory named after the application under the user's home, and use subuid to access files. That is simply an example, but would be a backwards compatible way to create a shared culture how Linux desktop software operate, and easen a transition where desktop software could be limited to "their" own directory.

Instead they squandered this chance by focusing all effort on moving dotfiles around (.config was such a waste of energy where we the heated debate could have been about something more useful, such as the above). Now we have Snap and Flatpak which both try to solve a culture problem (where we store our files) with technical solutions (bind mounts! modal gui:s! popup dialogs!). These will not improve the situation. In the best case it will train users to click "Yes" more, which we know not to help security.

Re: Daily driving a Linux phone, but why?

#229

Post by codethief »

yjftsjthsd-h wrote: post #97
mac-attack wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I had a similar experience with GrapheneOS. There is a balance in act between continuing down the privacy rabbit hole versus being able to communicate effectively with your social circle and it is easy to double down on privacy at the cost of relationships if you are not aware of how it is affecting others.

I have my own problems with GrapheneOS, but I thought they made a great effort to make sure that it didn't really have that kind of downside. What problems did you hit?

I suppose that if you use GOS without Google Play Services, you'll have a hard time using lots of services like WhatsApp etc.

Re: Daily driving a Linux phone, but why?

#230

Post by subscribed »

codethief wrote: post #40

> Many will point out that a Linux phone is less secure than Android or iOS, but that highly depends on your personal threat model. Linux phones and their apps are all open-source and do not depend on ads or surveillance to sustain some nefarious business model, which means there is much privacy to be won. Meanwhile here I am on my Linux machine, constantly anxious that sooner or later one of my bazillion npm and pip…

You can have Qubes OS on the certain PCs, in the same way you can have GrapheneOS on a certain family of the safe hardware.
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