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Usability Improvements in GCC 15

developers.redhat.com

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Re: Usability Improvements in GCC 15

#221

Post by Keyframe »

kstrauser wrote: post #151
Keyframe wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I found out the older I get the more sense rms makes.

On the subject of software freedom, I hate how accurately prophetic he is. RMS: Here’s how they'll get ya! Me: Nice, but that'd never happen. Vendor: Here’s how we got ya! Me: Dammit. Seriously, he must have a working crystal ball. Now, my agreement with him starts and ends on that subject. He says plenty of other things I wholly disagree with. But his warnings about proprietary software lock-in? Every. Single. Time.

for the record, I meant software freedoms and sometimes technical stuff only!

Re: Usability Improvements in GCC 15

#222

Post by orlylol »

PaulDavisThe1st wrote: post #206
nightfly wrote: post #183

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://ublockorigin.com/#:~:text=Understanding%20Manifest%2...

So UBO isn't doomed, just UBO on Chrome. While that's significant given Chrome's market share, I and everyone else on the planet have the option to use something else, and will continue to do so.

[flagged]

Re: Usability Improvements in GCC 15

#224

Post by orlylol »

LeFantome wrote: post #161
vbezhenar wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

gccrs is a rust implementation for gcc. Just because Rust developers don't want their users to be fully free doesn't mean there are any problems with gcc. And clang is developed by Apple which is a huge warning sign by itself.

LLVM/Clang is evolving more quickly than and is a much richer base for innovation than GCC is. LLVM spawned Rust, Swift, and Zig. The most recent GCC languages are Spark and COBOL. One of the reasons that LLVM has been able to evolve so quickly is because of all the corporate contribution it gets. GCC users want Clang/LLVM users to know how dumb they are for taking advantage of all the voluntary corporate investment…

[flagged]

Re: Usability Improvements in GCC 15

#225

Post by orlylol »

alienthrowaway wrote: post #187
JoshTriplett wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't forget that the LLVM folks actually went to GNU and offered it to them, and they failed to pay attention and respond . (It's not even that they responded negatively; they just dropped it on the floor completely.) There's an alternate history where LLVM was a GNU project. With the benefit of hindsight, I'm glad that that didn't happen, even though I have mixed feelings about LLVM being permissively licensed.

Gcc is the flagship of the GNU Project - allowing an endrun of the the spirit of the GPL in gcc was never going to happen. The project paid more attention than you give them credit for because allowing closed source plugins and improvements that use gcc as a frontend is anathema to Free software. There's an impedance mismatch between people who think gcc should have maximized user utility vs. the actual GNU philosoph…

[flagged]

Re: Usability Improvements in GCC 15

#226

Post by orlylol »

azinman2 wrote: post #137
IshKebab wrote: post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I doubt that. People often say "without we wouldn't have !" but it's nonsense. Someone else would have done it just slightly later.

The question is if that person would have dedicated their life in the same way.

[flagged]

Re: Usability Improvements in GCC 15

#227

Post by pjmlp »

codedokode wrote: post #162
johnisgood wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean, I think he is right. If everyone stopped supporting Windows, it would have long died out in favor of easy-to-install Linux distributions... probably.

In reality though Microsoft just added a WSL; not bad: Linux code can run on Windows now. Also, if you want Windows to die you need to work with OEMs: I assume that most users simply use whatever OS is pre-installed.

As gray dog around the prairie, had Microsoft actually been serious with POSIX subsystem on Windows NT/2000, instead of some marketing material and low level effort, GNU/Linux adoption would never taken off, at least not at a level that would have mattered.

With OS X on one side, and POSIX subsystem on Windows NT/2000 side, everyone would be doing their UNIX like workflows without thinking once to try out GNU/Linux.

At my university we only cared about Linux on its early days, Slackware 2.0 days, because naturally we couldn't have DG/UX at home, and that POSIX support was really unusable beyond toy examples.

Re: Usability Improvements in GCC 15

#228

Post by pjmlp »

alienthrowaway wrote: post #187
JoshTriplett wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't forget that the LLVM folks actually went to GNU and offered it to them, and they failed to pay attention and respond . (It's not even that they responded negatively; they just dropped it on the floor completely.) There's an alternate history where LLVM was a GNU project. With the benefit of hindsight, I'm glad that that didn't happen, even though I have mixed feelings about LLVM being permissively licensed.

Gcc is the flagship of the GNU Project - allowing an endrun of the the spirit of the GPL in gcc was never going to happen. The project paid more attention than you give them credit for because allowing closed source plugins and improvements that use gcc as a frontend is anathema to Free software. There's an impedance mismatch between people who think gcc should have maximized user utility vs. the actual GNU philosoph…

Also note that GCC adoption only took off when Sun introduced the concept of UNIX developer SDK, where developer tooling was an additional license.

Re: Usability Improvements in GCC 15

#229

Post by pjmlp »

bluGill wrote: post #99
cherryteastain wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Without GNU, GPL and Richard Stallman, FOSS would not exist in the first place. The GPL forced companies to make FOSS a thing, whether they liked it or not.

Bsd was long a thing proving you wrong. Yes gpl got more press but the other options existed for long.

Yes, and UNIX vendors and MS were happilly taking pieces of it without upstreaming.

I think without GNU/Linux, most likely all UNIX vendors would have a better market share today.

Re: Usability Improvements in GCC 15

#230

Post by nomel »

nomel wrote: post #87
javier_e06 wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I started putting emoji's in my bash scripts. gitk broke! Can't parse emojis I want emojis in my code. They are a superior form of communication (non-linear)

> I want emojis in my code. Then you will enjoy swift [1]! [1] Emoji driven development: https://www.swiftbysundell.com/special/emoji-driven-developm...

(Note, recommendation to use emojis is an April fools joke, but all the listed code compiles. You can use emojis as shown.)
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