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Hezbollah hand-held radios detonate across Lebanon, sources say

reuters.com

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Re: Hezbollah hand-held radios detonate across Lebanon, sources say

#221

Post by MPSimmons »

janmo wrote: post #107

If the mossad was able to plant explosives without being caught, I wouldn't be surprised if they also planted bugs (indiscriminately) in many electronic devices delivered to Lebanon such as TVs, computers, phones etc... Similar to the spy chips implants within the Supermicro server motherboards.

Yes, the supply chain is very clearly compromised.

How much of it is an excellent question. It's remarkable that apparently (?) none of the devices went off prematurely and tipped off the targets. That implies a higher degree of QA than you'd expect from a more ramshackle organization.

Re: Hezbollah hand-held radios detonate across Lebanon, sources say

#222

Post by gryzzly »

Arch485 wrote: post #192

I'm genuinely curious: how is this not considered terrorism on Israel's part? (or is it considered terrorism?) From a tactical standpoint, this is very similar, and the only big difference I see is that this is technologically more advanced/more complex than just planting a bomb or something. If it's not terrorism, what is the differentiating factor(s)? *side note: I'm quite sure other western countries have used tac…

[flagged]

Re: Hezbollah hand-held radios detonate across Lebanon, sources say

#223

Post by tptacek »

Arch485 wrote: post #192

I'm genuinely curious: how is this not considered terrorism on Israel's part? (or is it considered terrorism?) From a tactical standpoint, this is very similar, and the only big difference I see is that this is technologically more advanced/more complex than just planting a bomb or something. If it's not terrorism, what is the differentiating factor(s)? *side note: I'm quite sure other western countries have used tac…

Hezbollah is a military peer of Israel and the two are openly at war.

Re: Hezbollah hand-held radios detonate across Lebanon, sources say

#224

Post by this_user »

clueless wrote: post #66

so how does one verify that the battery in their iphone doesn't contain explosives?

Well, are you a member of a terrorist group? If no, then odds are that nobody is going to go through the trouble of adding explosives to your phone's battery.

In this case the people responsible must have discovered where these terrorists were buying their devices. Since basically no one except for them was buying large quantities of these, they were easy to target.

Re: Hezbollah hand-held radios detonate across Lebanon, sources say

#225

Post by gruez »

exe34 wrote: post #170
gruez wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The claim isn't that they're "civilian devices", it's that they're "devices all over civilian society". That's relevant because bobby trapping them is liable to cause casualties.

this was a special shipment created for the terrorists. this isn't just putting a bomb into every pager.

>this isn't just putting a bomb into every pager.

I never claimed otherwise. Again, the claim isn't that innocent people are carrying the pagers, is that the pagers are around innocent civilians. It's not any different than drone striking terrorists at weddings[1], which also drew criticism from human rights groups. Even if we assume the targets are definitely terrorists, that doesn't solve the issue of civilians who happen to be nearby.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wech_Baghtu_wedding_party_airs...

Re: Hezbollah hand-held radios detonate across Lebanon, sources say

#226

Post by stetrain »

Arch485 wrote: post #192

I'm genuinely curious: how is this not considered terrorism on Israel's part? (or is it considered terrorism?) From a tactical standpoint, this is very similar, and the only big difference I see is that this is technologically more advanced/more complex than just planting a bomb or something. If it's not terrorism, what is the differentiating factor(s)? *side note: I'm quite sure other western countries have used tac…

The definition of terrorism is controversial and political, so there isn't a hard answer.

But I think a general distinction is the targeting of combatants vs civilians.

There is a difference between infiltrating military or para-military organizations or operations and intentionally targeting mass casualties of civilians for attention.

Re: Hezbollah hand-held radios detonate across Lebanon, sources say

#227

Post by bpodgursky »

Arch485 wrote: post #192

I'm genuinely curious: how is this not considered terrorism on Israel's part? (or is it considered terrorism?) From a tactical standpoint, this is very similar, and the only big difference I see is that this is technologically more advanced/more complex than just planting a bomb or something. If it's not terrorism, what is the differentiating factor(s)? *side note: I'm quite sure other western countries have used tac…

Modern war obviously doesn't follow all the rules the Geneva convention assumed (Hezbollah militants don't wear their insignia and IDs) but in practice it seems fairly effectively targeted given the casualty breakdown so it'd be a hard case to make.

Re: Hezbollah hand-held radios detonate across Lebanon, sources say

#228

Post by orionsbelt »

OutOfHere wrote: post #182
orionsbelt wrote: post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

> This was a deliberate targeting of terrorists, Negative. Anyone can use a pager or a walkie talkie. If this were to have happened in say the US, it would 100% be considered not only terrorism, but an act of war.

Who is using a pager or walkie talking in 2024? I will admit there was maybe a few bystanders standing too close to a Hezbollah member, but how many non-Hezbollah members do you think really had one of these pagers? Keep in mind Israel also does surveillance and probably tracked where they went. If it turns out a material % of these were owned by civilians, I might agree with you, but I suspect that’s not the case.

Re: Hezbollah hand-held radios detonate across Lebanon, sources say

#229

Post by freehorse »

exe34 wrote: post #170
gruez wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The claim isn't that they're "civilian devices", it's that they're "devices all over civilian society". That's relevant because bobby trapping them is liable to cause casualties.

this was a special shipment created for the terrorists. this isn't just putting a bomb into every pager.

Were the kids killed also terrorists?

Re: Hezbollah hand-held radios detonate across Lebanon, sources say

#230

Post by janmo »

MPSimmons wrote: post #221
janmo wrote: post #107

If the mossad was able to plant explosives without being caught, I wouldn't be surprised if they also planted bugs (indiscriminately) in many electronic devices delivered to Lebanon such as TVs, computers, phones etc... Similar to the spy chips implants within the Supermicro server motherboards.

Yes, the supply chain is very clearly compromised. How much of it is an excellent question. It's remarkable that apparently (?) none of the devices went off prematurely and tipped off the targets. That implies a higher degree of QA than you'd expect from a more ramshackle organization.

I guess from now on they will fly it in directly from China.
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