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Airbnb is banning indoor security cameras

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Re: Airbnb is banning indoor security cameras

#221

Post by noslenwerdna »

swatcoder wrote: post #203
mholt wrote: post #22

I'm worried this ban will only affect honest hosts. Anyway, what Airbnb should really ban is hosts charging a mandatory cleaning fee when also requiring their guests to do the cleaning. We just stayed at one this weekend, and like almost all our previous bookings, the host asked us to: - Take off all bedding and towels and start a load of laundry - Do all the dishes and start the dishwasher (but required to hand-wash…

Your family was asked to do about 17 minutes of convenient, easy preparatory tidying that most considerate people would do even without being asked (as in a hotel or when visiting a friend). Yet you benefited from coming into a home that, presumably, had all of its floors vaccuumed, its kitchen and bathroom surfaces sanititized, its linens folded and/or readied, etc. Whether it was the host or a service, somebody fol…

I think the point is it should be part of the upfront cost when searching, rather than something that shows up at the end.

Re: Airbnb is banning indoor security cameras

#222

Post by achates »

callalex wrote: post #136
usaar333 wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cleaning fees exist to charge a fixed fee for a reservation, regardless of the number of days. There's more overhead for a reservation beyond just "cleaning". The most consumer friendly thing would be for AirBnB to just explicitly have a fixed "stay" fee and a per-day fee. That said, AirBnB's site shows the total cost for a stay when browsing, so I don't really see this as particularly deceptive. I don't care how the…

It only shows total price in markets where it is legally required to. Meaning they took the time to implement the feature and actively decided to be shitty to their customers when they are given the choice.

Are you sure? I'm in the US and it displays the entire price (including cleaning fees) for me.

Re: Airbnb is banning indoor security cameras

#223

Post by tensor »

booleandilemma wrote: post #158
mholt wrote: post #22

I'm worried this ban will only affect honest hosts. Anyway, what Airbnb should really ban is hosts charging a mandatory cleaning fee when also requiring their guests to do the cleaning. We just stayed at one this weekend, and like almost all our previous bookings, the host asked us to: - Take off all bedding and towels and start a load of laundry - Do all the dishes and start the dishwasher (but required to hand-wash…

A $200 cleaning fee is more expensive than a night at many Manhattan hotels. Actual hotels. With full service. Is airbnb even worth it?

Not for a night no. It's more of a replacement to renting a service apartment for longer periods of time (e.g. a week or more).

Re: Airbnb is banning indoor security cameras

#224

Post by Scoundreller »

_puk wrote: post #174
Scoundreller wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> People did the same thing on eBay by making the items almost free but the shipping expensive, until they fixed the eBay interface There’s a longer story to this: eBay used to exempt shipping fees from its commissions. So sellers would be screwing eBay and, being an efficient market, as it often is on eBay, the savings would be passed onto the buyer. I’d sell games for 1 cent with $10 shipping (cost to me: ~$2) and…

As a user I always avoided those low cost, high postage listings as it just seemed a good way for a seller to avoid refunding the full amount. Refund would always be minus postage costs, so you'd get 1 cent back for your $10.01 purchase when returning (i.e. no point)

I think it’s up to seller’s policy if it’s a buyer’s remorse return situation. I find it hard to believe eBay wouldn’t make the buyer whole in a damaged/not as described case.

Been a while since it came up for me (always sold stuff as “final sale” and if I avoid buying fragile stuff). Once had a hard time repaying a buyer that returned an item where I didn’t describe it correctly (screw you apple for having nearly identical LCDs but with slightly different camera cable lengths)

Re: Airbnb is banning indoor security cameras

#225

Post by cute_boi »

whompyjaw wrote: post #168
s1artibartfast wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Airbnb has a PE of 22 and is a money printing machine. Airbnb makes 10x the profit of Hyatt, which has a PE of 75. Use case of hotels might be bigger, but it is a highly contended market. Airbnb has a huge chunk of a smaller market. Also, the margins are much better on hosting a website than building hotels and paying thousands of service employees.

What is PE?

Price to earnings ratio, or P/E, is a way to value a company by comparing the price of a stock to its earnings. The P/E equals the price of a share of stock, divided by the company's earnings-per-share. It tells you how much you are paying for each dollar of earnings.

Re: Airbnb is banning indoor security cameras

#226

Post by trimethylpurine »

cratermoon wrote: post #82
hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cleaning fees aren't a "scam" - most property owners really do need to pay someone to clean the property at the end of a stay. But, as another commenter said, they can be used as a way to encourage longer stays, as with most places you only pay a single cleaning fee regardless of the length of your stay. But, again, it's just a fact that these rentals are usually just cleaned between guests (as opposed to a hotel whe…

> Cleaning fees aren't a "scam" - most property owners really do need to pay someone to clean the property at the end of a stay. I'm willing to pay a cleaning fee (though really it should be rolled into the cost of the stay) but not also be required to do the cleaning myself.

I think it's the time constraints on the dishwasher. Basically there's two levels of cleaning service. Everything else can be cleaned in two hours, but then there is waiting on the dishwasher. The cleaning crew bills to wait for the dishwasher to run and dry (2-4 extra hours). Just look for higher priced rentals, they will roll that cost in. For me, I'd usually rather pay a smaller cleaning fee because I don't usually use the dishes.

Re: Airbnb is banning indoor security cameras

#227

Post by nimih »

victorbjorklund wrote: post #201
idiotsecant wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, scam is the right word. It could pretty easily be rolled into the advertised nightly rate.

Lets say their cost for cleaning is 100 usd. Without cleaning they the price per night is 150 usd. How much should the price increase per night to cover the cost of cleaning? So either too low for people staying one night or too high for people staying multiple nights. Why is it better?

They should estimate the average stay length of their guests and amortize the cleaning fee appropriately, the same way that many other businesses (including real B&Bs, in my experience) handle fixed costs. In theory, AirBnb should be very good at automating the process (they have large amounts of very granular, market specific, historical rental data), but honestly, if that amount of planning and bookkeeping is too much for the rental operator, maybe running a B&B is not the best career fit for them.

Re: Airbnb is banning indoor security cameras

#228

Post by drdaeman »

standardUser wrote: post #53
mholt wrote: post #22

I'm worried this ban will only affect honest hosts. Anyway, what Airbnb should really ban is hosts charging a mandatory cleaning fee when also requiring their guests to do the cleaning. We just stayed at one this weekend, and like almost all our previous bookings, the host asked us to: - Take off all bedding and towels and start a load of laundry - Do all the dishes and start the dishwasher (but required to hand-wash…

I've stayed at dozens of AirBnBs and I've never had an onerous list of chores or a noticeably high cleaning fee, so these complaints always baffle me a little. Are people reading the listing thoroughly? Are they choosing a place with lots of ratings and reading all of the reviews? I've definitely had some bad AirBnbs over the years despite my careful selection process, but my complains are usually about noise or a la…

Same here. 16 stays so far (most long-term, 1+ months), so not much, but all with zero issues. Hosts usually ask to do the most basic stuff - check that everything is closed and turned off, sometimes take the trash out, and possibly collect the used towels and drop them in the bathroom. Stuff I'd do anyway without being asked.

I remember having a request to run a washing machine once - and sure thing I did. It's just a push of a button, not like I'm doing laundry by hand, and if a couple minutes of my time (that otherwise would be spent circling around the place and quadruple-checking if I packed everything I've brought with me) saves someone half an hour then I'm happy for a quick and meaningful distraction. As for the dishes and kitchen utensils - some hosts ask, some don't, but I wouldn't leave them dirty either way, that's just common sense and basic respect to the property.

Don't remember seeing any outrageous cleaning fees - although I haven't really bothered to check the fee structure, all I care about is the grand total and whenever it fits my budget - the rest is simply irrelevant to me. Airbnb used to suck about not showing the total amount right away (which led to this cleaning fee fiasco), but I believe it's long fixed.

Then, I typically spend about a week's worth of evenings carefully going over the listings, multiple times. Airbnb's search is mostly a joke, one can only find a decent place by setting only the most basic filters then methodically going through the listings checking if they're accurate, have a decent number of photos (listing descriptions are useless, have to actually see the kitchen, shower and "dedicated workspace"), favorable reviews, no obvious red flags, checking surroundings on the maps and so on.

Either way, for the long-term stays a good Airbnb house or apartment beats a hotel (YMMV). And ever for the shorter-term (1-2 week) stays I always checked the hotels and always ended up picking an Airbnb because it was a more attractive option.

Re: Airbnb is banning indoor security cameras

#229

Post by swatcoder »

noslenwerdna wrote: post #221
swatcoder wrote: post #203

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your family was asked to do about 17 minutes of convenient, easy preparatory tidying that most considerate people would do even without being asked (as in a hotel or when visiting a friend). Yet you benefited from coming into a home that, presumably, had all of its floors vaccuumed, its kitchen and bathroom surfaces sanititized, its linens folded and/or readied, etc. Whether it was the host or a service, somebody fol…

I think the point is it should be part of the upfront cost when searching, rather than something that shows up at the end.

Yes, that is one of the many valid complaints one might have with AirBnb and AirBnb browsing is much less frustrating in the markets that have forced them to do that.

But I don't read that as what the above commenter was complaining about.

Re: Airbnb is banning indoor security cameras

#230

Post by temporarara »

nick12r55t1 wrote: post #75
throwaway290 wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> if a guest uses every dish in the kitchen without doing a wash up, they cleaning crew could be there for hours If it is $200 then that should cover 10 man hours of cleaning in a developed country. I had similar issues as a guest on Airbnb, paid a cleaning fee $100+ and then had complaints that I left food in the fridge (like normal a pack of milk or something not growing new lifeforms) and couch pillow on the floor…

Ha, $20/hr for house cleaners is so 2020. They're much more than that in reality.

And meanwhile the actual cleaners are rarely paid even $15/hr in many places. I always hire one or two person companies if I just can find them since then it's at least honest business and not yet another hustle to get rich by using slave labour. Not just for cleaning which I only rarely outsource but for everything.
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