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Google fires employee who protested Israel tech event, shuts forum

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Re: Google fires employee who protested Israel tech event, shuts forum

#221

Post by secondary_op »

surgical_fire wrote: post #95

> “I refuse to build technology that powers genocide!” he yelled, referring to Google’s Project Nimbus contract Well, then Google did him a favor by firing him. Saved him from hypocrisy, since he could have quit long before that.

The spice must flow.

> Under a $1.2 billion contract, technology companies Google (Google Cloud Platform) and Amazon (Amazon Web Services) were selected to provide Israeli government agencies with cloud computing services, including artificial intelligence and machine learning.

> A Republican plan, approved by the United States House of Representatives, allocates $14.5 billion in military aid for Israel.

> Julian Assange speaking in 2011: "The goal is to use Afghanistan to wash money out of the tax bases of the US and Europe through Afghanistan and back into the hands of a transnational security elite. The goal is an endless war, not a successful war" https://twitter.com/Snowden/status/1581698912447975424

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_Nimbus

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_support_for_Isra....

Re: Google fires employee who protested Israel tech event, shuts forum

#222

Post by smashah »

shrimp_emoji wrote: post #206
smashah wrote: post #201

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why not? Palestinian children are exploded into a million pieces and scattered throughout the road and rubble by US-funded munitions signed with pithy 3000 year old history lessons, the least we can do is accept the wanton disregard for human life by America's most important ally is akin to others in our modern history.

So everyone who kills civilians is like the Nazis? Wow, I guess everyone who has ever fought in war is like the Nazis. What a wild worldview.

Whatever you need to imagine that I said to help you sleep at night, feel free to tell yourself.

Re: Google fires employee who protested Israel tech event, shuts forum

#223

Post by smashah »

surgical_fire wrote: post #220
smashah wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Imagine being such a pseudo-contrarian that you say you'd be an employee of the makers of Zyklon B (Tesch and Stabenow/Degesch) with the words "I would, with no regrets". This is "Professionalism" to you, jfc.

There's nothing pseudo, nor contrarian, about my position. You mistake conformism with a moral position about something.

You mistake manufacturing Zyklon B like a good little wagie for professionalism. You also mistake a moral position as conformism, which enables you to make immoral (by your own standards) statements.

Re: Google fires employee who protested Israel tech event, shuts forum

#224

Post by wmidwestranger »

lordfrito wrote: post #125

Lately it seems that more and more rank-and-file employees believe that a company has some sort of moral obligation to take their political opinions into consideration. Corporations aren't democracies. Unless you're an executive or high ranking decision maker, you're along for the ride. I don't ask my kids for their opinion about my home budget, what house I should buy, etc. So it is at work. Expecting a company to k…

I can't tell if people are desperate or delusional.

> Expecting a company to kowtow to your belief system betrays a conceited/pretentious view of the world around you.

I agree and I would call that delusional.

On the desparate side, the trust in government and faith in the democratic system are in shambles. I'm not even sure a frustrated Google Engineer can see the bottom of the despair issue. People do not believe their local, state, or federal governments can do a anything, particularly for the common good.

Take my hometown, of ~20K, that once had a fully functioning clinic and hospital. About ten years ago, the hospital was rebuilt, much nicer building but only 2 ER rooms and no critical long-term care. I suggested to my brother the town ought to have made approval of the construction dependent on providing essential services. He is smart but that idea didn't even register as a legitimate political concern. He doesn't think the government can do anything, least of all for the public good.

That sentiment is building and it's a vicious, reinforcing cycle. I dearly hope something will change before there is only the faintest hope of change.

Re: Google fires employee who protested Israel tech event, shuts forum

#225

Post by surgical_fire »

hayst4ck wrote: post #21
siva7 wrote: post #2

> Google fired an employee who disrupted an Israel executive’s conference keynote this week, CNBC has learned. Rightfully so. Name me the big tech company who wouldn't fire such an employee instantly.

This is why we need tech unions. We should be able to take an ethical stance without getting fired.

I am pro unions.

Your argument gives me pause. Maybe it's not that good of an idea.

Re: Google fires employee who protested Israel tech event, shuts forum

#226

Post by PheonixPharts »

lordfrito wrote: post #191
PheonixPharts wrote: post #159

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This same logic can be used to justify any system of exploitive power. Companies control my ability to eat and be housed , these companies drive global politics. If the voice and ethics of the people are not allowed to influence these, then what voice to do the people have? Is my choice is to keep in line or starve how is that any different than any other despotic system? You're own profile says "I may disapprove of…

I never suggested the employee wasn't allowed to speak their mind. I'm just saying that the person should fully expect to be fired for that sort of behavior, and take that into consideration. There is a time and place, and work is not it. Don't crap where you eat, etc. If you did that in my house, I'd (politely) kick you out. You're welcome to disagree with me, but if you're inside my house then it's on my terms.

If you earnestly believe there's no important distinction between employees of a multinational corporation and a guest in your private home then I don't think there's any more possible room for discussion.

I am curious though, in what specific context would you "defend to the death" my right to free speech? It seems strange to be willing to offer your life for something with so many terms and conditions applied.

Re: Google fires employee who protested Israel tech event, shuts forum

#228

Post by PheonixPharts »

duxup wrote: post #165
PheonixPharts wrote: post #151

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The trouble is that "reasonable expectations" are set by those in power. Slave overs set "reasonable expectations" for slaves, feudal lords set "reasonable expectations" for peasants. In such a world "reasonable expectations" by their nature foster a continuation of the existing power structures. Behavior that challenges "reasonable expectations" does so precisely because of the belief that the continuation of the st…

I feel like the expectations here are reasonable. I wouldn't want another employee interrupting my meeting like that either. As for the rest of your "salve owner" commentary I think that's an absurd comparison.

Are you being deliberately obtuse? Surely you recognized there is a context to the "no interrupting meetings" guideline. The protester felt that meeting was playing part in the support and facilitation genocide, I think that's adequate grounds to interrupt a meeting.

And what do you find absurd about the "slave owner" comparison? I'm not arguing that modern day employment is slavery or anything of the sort, just pointing out that the terms of "reasonable expectations" are always defined by those in power, and not once in history has working within "reasonable expectations" caused a shift in those power dynamics.

Re: Google fires employee who protested Israel tech event, shuts forum

#229

Post by surgical_fire »

smashah wrote: post #223
surgical_fire wrote: post #220

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's nothing pseudo, nor contrarian, about my position. You mistake conformism with a moral position about something.

You mistake manufacturing Zyklon B like a good little wagie for professionalism. You also mistake a moral position as conformism, which enables you to make immoral (by your own standards) statements.

> You mistake manufacturing Zyklon B like a good little wagie for professionalism

You either don't know the meaning of professionalism, or are arguing in bad faith. I will presume cognitive limitations instead of malice.

> You also mistake a moral position as conformism, which enables you to make immoral (by your own standards) statements

There is nothing moral or immoral to conforming to society. I don't make the rules. I just follow.

Re: Google fires employee who protested Israel tech event, shuts forum

#230

Post by thinkingemote »

oluwie wrote: post #11
blueflow wrote: post #5

Why is employee dissent such a problem in google and not a problem in other companies?

"Do no evil" went out the backdoor a long time ago

For the record they changed it to (paraphrasing) "googlers shouldn't do evil" without much commentary at the time but significantly shifting the emphasis away from the corporation to individual employees. From a mission statement to HR guideline.
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