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Remote work doesn't seem to affect productivity, Fed study finds

bloomberg.com

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Re: Remote work doesn't seem to affect productivity, Fed study finds

#221

Post by rvba »

robertlagrant wrote: post #145
soco wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A hard disagree on "companies that need them more than they need the company". A headless company can still run, a company-less CEO is nothing. But this is the culture we're in, paying the friends of the board millions regardless of their performance, because the board knows they get their backs rubbed as well.

> A headless company can still run, a company-less CEO is nothing Can you give an example of a headless company that's running fine?

Too big too fail companies still run. Also they dont run fine, they just run.

Re: Remote work doesn't seem to affect productivity, Fed study finds

#222

Post by mlrtime »

gumballindie wrote: post #180
safety1st wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure, but then we're discussing remote work as an employee benefit, which is a different discussion driven by a different part of the company etc. Not as a thing which improves the company's bottom line which is where C suite and shareholders spend the vast majority of their attention. If it doesn't improve job productivity then at the level where decisions get made I can think of two really significant points regard…

> B. There might be an opportunity to reduce cost because we could recruit contractors in other countries instead of full-time US employees. (Which in turn is going to undermine labor's bargaining power in the US...) The biggest drive for overseas recruitment will be ai. Extracting knowledge for western workers and transferring it to cheaper workers overseas will be the new manufacturing outsourcing. A workers withou…

I don't disagree..

However isn't this just internet on steroids? I remember when retail internet was in this stage and comments were very similar. 3rd world countries will have the world's information at their finger tips.

What happened as I recall [in a study I remember] is that people essentially played more candy crush.

Re: Remote work doesn't seem to affect productivity, Fed study finds

#223

Post by d3w4s9 »

SoftTalker wrote: post #2

Most employees can screw around websurfing or shopping just as well at work as at home. They mostly do it because they are bored. Give them interesting, meaningful work and they will be productive.

Nah

If I am waiting for code to compile and I'm tired, the most interesting thing happens on my phone not what I need to do next, regardless of what that is

Re: Remote work doesn't seem to affect productivity, Fed study finds

#224

Post by goodpoint »

Levitz wrote: post #123
californical wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why not? Companies will eventually sort into ones where likeminded people are together. Some will be more friendly to remote than others. If I want to work in person with people, I’ll join a company that agrees. If someone wants to be remote, they might have to join a different company.

Assuming that there are no differences in productivity, working on-site is borderline morally evil. It's unhealthier (loads of sleep deprivation out there), it's bad for the environment and its costs are higher. We can argue all day if the perks of in-person work are worth the cost, but if there aren't any perks besides "I just prefer it that way" I don't think there is even a valid discussion to have. We are talking…

Commuting by car on daily basis is the most dangerous activity most people do.

- risk of accidents

- sitting longer hours, leading to loss of muscle tone etc

- inhaling particulate from engines and tires

This stuff builds up over time. The decrease in life expectancy is real.

Re: Remote work doesn't seem to affect productivity, Fed study finds

#225

Post by vidarh »

intended wrote: post #185
epolanski wrote: post #173

The fundamental issue I see in this debate is a lack of sensibility and nuance in human nature. The whole matter is debated (understandably in a way) on big numbers and averages. I could write a long post but I'll cut it short to this paragraph stating that humans differ. For some commuting is stressful, the offices are noisy and full of distractions and those individuals may thrive in a remote setup. There's people…

I would add one major change that the work from home experiment has achieved - its made the opportunity cost of the work commute clear. This is a time cost paid for by the worker. As you stated, this is variable. If you have a short commute, or you like it, or you get some exercise - office is great. If you hate your commute, if its 3 hours in pollution and traffic - not so much. Earlier the position was that WFH was…

During my last job change I gave concrete numbers to recruiters on what getting me into an office would cost.

In the end I ended up working remote, which is what I preferred, which wasn't surprising given how much the commuting time was worth to me.

Re: Remote work doesn't seem to affect productivity, Fed study finds

#226

Post by [deleted] »

mlrtime wrote: post #215
intended wrote: post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would add one major change that the work from home experiment has achieved - its made the opportunity cost of the work commute clear. This is a time cost paid for by the worker. As you stated, this is variable. If you have a short commute, or you like it, or you get some exercise - office is great. If you hate your commute, if its 3 hours in pollution and traffic - not so much. Earlier the position was that WFH was…

I definitely agree here. For most of my career I was fortunate enough to not have a "real" commute. at most a 20 min walk to the office. The worse commute is when it was raining or snowing. The problem becomes now my home is tied to my work place. If the company moves or I change companies, I have move or stress at a new commute. I did move once during a job change, and it didn't last long. Another compounding issue…

[deleted]

Re: Remote work doesn't seem to affect productivity, Fed study finds

#227

Post by mlrtime »

wodenokoto wrote: post #35
SoftTalker wrote: post #2

Most employees can screw around websurfing or shopping just as well at work as at home. They mostly do it because they are bored. Give them interesting, meaningful work and they will be productive.

Isn't that why people are paid to work? Because it isn't interesting or meaningful?

“Find a job you enjoy doing, and you will never have to work a day in your life.” ― Mark Twain

This quote probably has less meaning now than it did, but I think it still holds. Part of this though is finding joy in doing things that you don't naturally enjoy. There are miserable or lazy people that will not enjoy anything other than self pleasure.

Re: Remote work doesn't seem to affect productivity, Fed study finds

#229

Post by goodpoint »

epolanski wrote: post #173

The fundamental issue I see in this debate is a lack of sensibility and nuance in human nature. The whole matter is debated (understandably in a way) on big numbers and averages. I could write a long post but I'll cut it short to this paragraph stating that humans differ. For some commuting is stressful, the offices are noisy and full of distractions and those individuals may thrive in a remote setup. There's people…

> lack of sensibility and nuance in human nature

Or in some specific countries and company cultures...

Re: Remote work doesn't seem to affect productivity, Fed study finds

#230

Post by intended »

weebull wrote: post #206
blagie wrote: post #176

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is my experience. My productivity on coding is a lot hire remote. On many leadership / management-style tasks, it's a lot lower. Come to think of it, I'm wondering if that's where the split comes in. Upper management sees their productivity go down -- on what's fundamentally an interpersonal endeavour -- while individual contributors see theirs go up -- on what's primarily solitary ones. As a result, there is fr…

It's the point where you're no longer an individual contributor. Running a team and keeping people on target is difficult remotely. Consensus is difficult remotely. Feedback is difficult remotely. Getting your head down and coding on your personal goal is easy remotely. I think some ICs like that it's harder for people to say to them that they are driving in the wrong direction, even if it's still true.

I argue against this point. I believe it indicates a skill gap, not a physical law.

If you've played MMOs, been parts of raids, or been active in a guild - you figure out how to solve these problems.

I've been in a community management and moderation role entirely online - those interactions and issues were, by far, the most subjective and complex project discussions I have had to conduct.

I believe that there is an entire generation of workers AND managers, who will be entering the workforce with highly effective remote working habits.

The caveat is, that this applies to work that can be done online, where your product can be examined and verified online.

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