The Internet Is Full of AI Dogshit • Hacker News Board

Re: The Internet Is Full of AI Dogshit

#221

Post by xwiz » Thu, Jan 11, 2024, 4:58 PM UTC

novemp wrote: post #172

causal wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Finally switched to Kagi when I realized Google could not find a particular ThreeJS class doc page for me no matter what keywords I used, I had to paste the very URL of the page for it to appear at the top of my search results. Kagi got it first try using the class name. Paid search is the way, ad incentives are at odds with search. Made Kagi my address bar default search and it's been great.

Too bad Kagi is also investing in LLMs.

I don't think the issue is LLMs inherently, it's the misapplication. Kagi has siloed the LLM content into the 'Quick Answer' and 'Assistant' sections, and it generates on the fly from search results. (Plus, the 'Expert' LLM cites the references it used.) I think the issue will come when there isn't a clear delineation between real and artificial text, or when artificial text is presented more prominently than real text, as in the article.

Re: The Internet Is Full of AI Dogshit

#222

Post by marstall » Thu, Jan 11, 2024, 4:58 PM UTC

smt88 wrote: post #201

jillesvangurp wrote: post #147

The way out is authenticity. Signed content is the only way to get that. You can't take anything at face value. It might be generated, forged, et. When anyone can publish anything and when anyone is outnumbered by AIs publishing even more things, the only way to filter that is by relying on reputation and authenticity so you can know who published what and what else they are saying. Web of trust has of course been tr…

> Signed content is the only way to get that. This does nothing to guarantee that the content was written or edited by a human. Because of the risk of key theft, it doesn't even guarantee that it was published by the human who signed it. It is physically, philosophically, and technically impossible to verify the authenticity of digital content. At the boundary between the analog world and the digital world, you can a…

> It is physically, philosophically, and technically impossible to verify the authenticity of digital content.

Though there are many brands built on trust, whose domain name is very difficult to spoof, that are an exception to this.

Hate on nytimes.com, but you have reasonable confidence the content on that site is written, fact-checked and edited by staff at the New York Times Company.

Re: The Internet Is Full of AI Dogshit

#223

Post by BizarreByte » Thu, Jan 11, 2024, 4:59 PM UTC

philodelta wrote: post #84

This has already become self-evident when trying to find images on google. I have seen whole pages of results which were AI-generated. At every level it becomes so hard to understand the motivations of my fellow man in regards to these problems, it quickly invites almost conspiratorial thinking. How could anyone be so stupid, how is anyone benefitting, from the obvious and apocalyptic poisoning of the well. Especiall…

Google Image search has been hopeless for a long time now, you'll get better results typically on Yandex or Bing to the point I won't use Google for images.

Re: The Internet Is Full of AI Dogshit

#224

Post by andrewdubinsky » Thu, Jan 11, 2024, 4:59 PM UTC

Wasn't the internet full of hand-crafted made for google dog shit before?

Re: The Internet Is Full of AI Dogshit

#225

Post by imposter » Thu, Jan 11, 2024, 5:00 PM UTC

I see the point about AI's impact on internet content, but I think it's important to view it in a broader context. AI is just a tool, and its effectiveness is shaped by how users use it. It's not just AI, but the entire internet that's always had a mix of good and bad content. AI actually has the potential to improve access to information and level the field. It's more about refining search algorithms and enhancing oversight rather than dismissing the technology altogether. The internet has always required users and creators to sift through and elevate quality content. AI is just a new aspect of this

Re: The Internet Is Full of AI Dogshit

#226

Post by galdosdi » Thu, Jan 11, 2024, 5:00 PM UTC

tivert wrote: post #49

queuebert wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, that's never happened before. You're crazy.

> No, that's never happened before. You're crazy. Start filling up Discords with insane AI-generated garbage, and maybe you can devalue the data to the point it won't get sold. It's probably totally practical too, just create channels filled with insane bots talking to each other, and cultivate the local knowledge that real people just don't go there. Maybe even allow the insane bots on the main channels, and cultiva…

This is an intellectually fascinating thought experiment.

Re: The Internet Is Full of AI Dogshit

#227

Post by [deleted] » Thu, Jan 11, 2024, 5:00 PM UTC

bluefirebrand wrote: post #206

cauliflower99 wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interesting idea. Could there be a market for pre-AI era content? Or maybe it would be a combination of pre-AI content plus some extra barriers to entry for newer content that would increase the likelihood the content was generated by real people?

I'm in the camp where I want AI and automation to free people from drudgery in the hope that it will encourage the biggest HUMAN artwork renaissance ever in history. I don't want AI to be at the forefront of all new media and artwork. That's a terrible outcome to me. And honestly there's already too much "content" in the world and being produced every day, and it seems like every time we step further up the "content…

[deleted]

Re: The Internet Is Full of AI Dogshit

#228

Post by nerdponx » Thu, Jan 11, 2024, 5:00 PM UTC

tonymet wrote: post #214

ravenstine wrote: post #118

Although I agree with the title, I also don't think the internet is that significantly different from before GPTs 4, 3, or 2. Articles written by interns or Indian virtual assistants about generic topics are pretty much as bad as most AI generated material and isn't that distinguishable from it. It doesn't help that search engines today sort by prestige over whether your query matches text in a webpage. People aren't…

Yes but the content from the web flows into social media, news, “books” (now e-books) in an intangible cyclone of fabricated information. If sewage gets into the water supply no one is safe. You don’t get to feel better for having a spigot away from the source.

The sewage has already been flowing for years. Now we're just going to have more of it.

Search results on both Bing and DDG have been rendered functionally useless for a year or so now. Almost every page is an SEO-oriented blob of questionable content hosted on faceless websites that exist solely for ads and affiliate links, whether it's AI-generated or underpaid-third-world-worker-generated.

Re: The Internet Is Full of AI Dogshit

#229

Post by nerdponx » Thu, Jan 11, 2024, 5:01 PM UTC

nicbou wrote: post #160

branon wrote: post #5

Never thought I'd say this, but in times like these, with clearnet in such dire straits, all the information siloed away inside Discord doesn't seem like such a bad thing. Remaining unindexable by search engines all but guarantees you'll never appear alongside AI slop or be used as training data. The future of the Internet truly is people - the machines can no longer be trusted to perform even the basic tasks they on…

I strongly disagree. I've been answering immigration questions online for a long time. People frequently comment on threads from years ago, or ask about them in private. In other words, public content helps a lot of other people over time. On the other hand, the stuff in private Facebook groups has a shelf life of a few days at best. If your goal is to share useful knowledge with the broadest possible audience, Disco…

Right, the issue is not that people don't appreciate good content. The issue is that it's harder for people to find it.

It's an entrenching of the existing phenomenon where the only way to know what to trust on the Web is word of mouth.

Re: The Internet Is Full of AI Dogshit

#230

Post by elzbardico » Thu, Jan 11, 2024, 5:02 PM UTC

TillE wrote: post #109

pawelmurias wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

AI spam bots will invade discord.

And they'll get banned by moderators. Ultimately that's the key ingredient in any good strategy here: human curation.

AI bots will get the confidence of admins and moderators. They will be so helpful and wise that they will become admin and moderators. Then, they will ban the accounts of the human moderators.