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Coinbase CEO: we're preparing to go to court with the U.S. SEC

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Re: Coinbase CEO: we're preparing to go to court with the U.S. SEC

#221

Post by vkou »

latchkey wrote: post #185
ahahahahah wrote: post #182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I asked the DEA how to get a path to register to be able to sell fentanyl to anyone, they didn't have any answer so I just opened up shop.

Terrible analogy. fentanyl requires a prescription to get access to it. There are well defined processes for this. Until the SEC defines what sort of requirements there are to purchase crypto (like the FDA has [0]), coinbase isn't doing anything illegal by selling it. [0] https://www.accessdata.fda.gov/drugsatfda_docs/label/2019/01...

There are well-defined processes for selling unregistered securities.

Either get them registered, or don't sell them.

Re: Coinbase CEO: we're preparing to go to court with the U.S. SEC

#222

Post by wslh »

arcticbull wrote: post #220
wslh wrote: post #191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

PayPal is full of scammers, it is not crypto. Even you can say that PayPal is wrongdoing in many aspects that will not resist in court. Just an example. Another example: land in NY, buy a mobile SIM there, go to the Central Park and in less than 30 minutes someone calls me telling me that I won the lottery. I am very lucky.

Do you have some data on the percentage likelihood of being scammed in crypto vs in the traditional financial markets? Let's just cherry pick on DeFi. DeFi had something around 10% of its entire TVL lost last year to hacks and scams. I guarantee you that 10% of the entire 'TVL' of PayPal wasn't lost to hacks and scams. PayPal has almost 79B in assets. Pretty sure they didn't lose 8B to hacks last year. The fundamenta…

The focus of this thread was about cryptocurrencies as assets.

When you talk about hacks we are shifting the discussion to computer security. Computer security intersects with scamming but they are two different things, you are comparing apples to oranges, it is also a field that nowadays is weaponized and the money invested and gained in the field itself exceed the money in DeFi hacks. Do you know the price in the market of bugs and exploits for Google Chrome, WhatsApp, iOS, etc? The ones exploiting them could be scammers, state actors, etc. The specialthing about DeFi is that hackers are attracted because code is literally money.

There is one more thing that complement and give answer for posts above in this thread: big scams and hacks in the cryptocurrency space are difficult to cash out: significant exchanges use transaction tracing tools (KYT: know your transaction) to freeze assets connected to illegal activities.

Re: Coinbase CEO: we're preparing to go to court with the U.S. SEC

#223

Post by latchkey »

vkou wrote: post #201
latchkey wrote: post #167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If there is no way to register with the SEC to run a securities brokerage, exchange, and clearing house, then what's the point of the SEC again?

There's no way to register these securities with the SEC, because their creators aren't interested in being in compliance with securities laws. It would require more transparency and accountability than they would like. As a result, the SEC does not allow anyone to run an exchange that trades those illegal securities. Being a registered security isn't hard, all sorts of stupid and speculative instruments get register…

> Being a registered security isn't hard, all sorts of stupid and speculative instruments get registered. If your shitcoin isn't able to get registered, the fault is with it, not the SEC.

You're contradicting yourself there. If it isn't hard, it should be easy for a shitcoin to get registered then.

Re: Coinbase CEO: we're preparing to go to court with the U.S. SEC

#224

Post by detaro »

latchkey wrote: post #223
vkou wrote: post #201

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's no way to register these securities with the SEC, because their creators aren't interested in being in compliance with securities laws. It would require more transparency and accountability than they would like. As a result, the SEC does not allow anyone to run an exchange that trades those illegal securities. Being a registered security isn't hard, all sorts of stupid and speculative instruments get register…

> Being a registered security isn't hard, all sorts of stupid and speculative instruments get registered. If your shitcoin isn't able to get registered, the fault is with it, not the SEC. You're contradicting yourself there. If it isn't hard, it should be easy for a shitcoin to get registered then.

Not necessarily a contradiction, no. It can be very easy to do something, and lots people failing to do so because they refuse to follow the simple rules around it. (how much that is the case with shitcoins I don't know, but it's at least believable that many of them didnt make a serious attempt because it'd get in the way of making lots of money by exaggerated marketing)

Re: Coinbase CEO: we're preparing to go to court with the U.S. SEC

#225

Post by latchkey »

vkou wrote: post #221
latchkey wrote: post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Terrible analogy. fentanyl requires a prescription to get access to it. There are well defined processes for this. Until the SEC defines what sort of requirements there are to purchase crypto (like the FDA has [0]), coinbase isn't doing anything illegal by selling it. [0] https://www.accessdata.fda.gov/drugsatfda_docs/label/2019/01...

There are well-defined processes for selling unregistered securities. Either get them registered, or don't sell them.

No, there isn't.

https://www.coindesk.com/policy/2023/04/19/sec-chair-gensler...

Re: Coinbase CEO: we're preparing to go to court with the U.S. SEC

#226

Post by latchkey »

detaro wrote: post #224
latchkey wrote: post #223

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Being a registered security isn't hard, all sorts of stupid and speculative instruments get registered. If your shitcoin isn't able to get registered, the fault is with it, not the SEC. You're contradicting yourself there. If it isn't hard, it should be easy for a shitcoin to get registered then.

Not necessarily a contradiction, no. It can be very easy to do something, and lots people failing to do so because they refuse to follow the simple rules around it. (how much that is the case with shitcoins I don't know, but it's at least believable that many of them didnt make a serious attempt because it'd get in the way of making lots of money by exaggerated marketing)

Now you're just generalizing with platitudes and snarky comments about exaggerated marketing. This isn't just about shitcoins and you know it.

Gensler, just yesterday, couldn't even answer a simple question about ETH being a security and that's the second largest marketcap crypto out there.

Pretending that crypto is only made up of shitcoins doesn't mean that it is going to magically go away. It is here to stay. The cat is out of the bag.

The SEC can only bury its head for so long and that's clearly coming to light now. You've got Warren with her stupid 'war on crypto' and Gensler as her puppet talking head.

Things need to change and Coinbase is going to have to sue them to get that change. That speaks more to the lack of clarity in the SEC, than to anything Coinbase is or isn't doing well.

Re: Coinbase CEO: we're preparing to go to court with the U.S. SEC

#227

Post by tehlike »

humanizersequel wrote: post #216
tehlike wrote: post #215

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which part of howey do you think Coinbase earn(not staking, but the product offered by Coinbase themselves) doesn't satisfy and is therefore not a security? I made it explicit between staking (you staking your own money) and doing it through Coinbase.

> not staking, but the product offered by Coinbase themselves But the product Coinbase offers is staking.

You are missing the nuance.

You can go ahead and try staking your money yourself on the protocol. But do it through coinbase equation changes.

Also coinbase earn does defi yield (which is more clear cut securities), but i am in mexico now, and can't tell if this were the case in the US or i am seeing geofenced content.

Re: Coinbase CEO: we're preparing to go to court with the U.S. SEC

#228

Post by vkou »

latchkey wrote: post #223
vkou wrote: post #201

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's no way to register these securities with the SEC, because their creators aren't interested in being in compliance with securities laws. It would require more transparency and accountability than they would like. As a result, the SEC does not allow anyone to run an exchange that trades those illegal securities. Being a registered security isn't hard, all sorts of stupid and speculative instruments get register…

> Being a registered security isn't hard, all sorts of stupid and speculative instruments get registered. If your shitcoin isn't able to get registered, the fault is with it, not the SEC. You're contradicting yourself there. If it isn't hard, it should be easy for a shitcoin to get registered then.

If a shitcoin can't meet the low, low bar for registration, that's an indictment of the shitcoin, not of my argument. Don't walk, run away from it.

Re: Coinbase CEO: we're preparing to go to court with the U.S. SEC

#229

Post by vkou »

latchkey wrote: post #225
vkou wrote: post #221

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are well-defined processes for selling unregistered securities. Either get them registered, or don't sell them.

No, there isn't. https://www.coindesk.com/policy/2023/04/19/sec-chair-gensler...

That has nothing to do with what I said, or with why Coinbase is in hot water right now.

Eth might not be a security, and Coinbase would still be trading other unregistered securities.

It's telling that all their press releases don't actually address the problem.

(Also, it's not the exchange's responsibility to register securities, it's the issuer's.)

Re: Coinbase CEO: we're preparing to go to court with the U.S. SEC

#230

Post by latchkey »

vkou wrote: post #228
latchkey wrote: post #223

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Being a registered security isn't hard, all sorts of stupid and speculative instruments get registered. If your shitcoin isn't able to get registered, the fault is with it, not the SEC. You're contradicting yourself there. If it isn't hard, it should be easy for a shitcoin to get registered then.

If a shitcoin can't meet the low, low bar for registration, that's an indictment of the shitcoin, not of my argument. Don't walk, run away from it.

What about ETH then?

https://twitter.com/twobitidiot/status/1648732457448120321

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