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Senate Bill to Ban TikTok

congress.gov

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Re: Senate Bill to Ban TikTok

#221

Post by stickfigure »

withinboredom wrote: post #187
threeseed wrote: post #183

Earlier quoted context omitted.

a) The government can do more than one thing at a time. b) There is zero appetite from the GOP for gun control. Until that changes the status quo persists. c) Information about US citizens (which can be used to manipulate them) being handed over to the Chinese government is something that the government should be concerned about.

I mean, you can buy that information for 'practically free' (amortized per person), you don't need an app for that.

Please tell me where I can purchase information about the sexual preferences of Republican politicians and leading religious figures. I... have... reasons.

Re: Senate Bill to Ban TikTok

#222

Post by petilon »

hitpointdrew wrote: post #165
Entinel wrote: post #163

This bill is so awful it cannot be allowed to pass. It reminds me of the Patriot Act.

It's MUCH WORSE than the Patriot act. This bill is absolutely horrific. And calling it at bill to "ban TikTok" is extremely disingenuous as it egregiously goes well beyond that.

> This bill is absolutely horrific.

In what way? Explain that, and let readers decide if it is horrific.

Re: Senate Bill to Ban TikTok

#223

Post by saurik »

NLPaep wrote: post #57
spiderice wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'm fine if TikTok gets banned How are so many people (especially on HN) fine with this? Haven't we criticized "The Great Firewall of China" for literally decades? How is this not the start of that? Genuine question. This ban seems to set horrible precedent to me. Bet everyones "coolness" with it makes me think I'm not understanding something.

The media is the fourth branch of government. It is wildly considered to be essential for a healthy democracy. You don’t want to have it controlled (for many people) by an untrustworthy and adversarial party, especially when they have a long track record of censorship and are trying to extend their own influence and rules globally. We can still say and post what we want - it’s not content that’s being censored.

Isn't this exactly what China says about us? (And no: I don't believe them... but that frankly isn't the point. We normally get to dislike their position on indirect philosophical grounds--that people should get to see and do whatever they want and if freedom is dangerous to you then you are the aggressor--irregardless of whether they are "correct", and so we lose the moral high ground and will have to sit around in a direct mud-slinging argument if we try to use the same kind of "for the good of the people we must all lose our freedom" argument.)

Re: Senate Bill to Ban TikTok

#224

Post by jpgvm »

gman83 wrote: post #138
dirtyid wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because US/western social media has same market access to PRC... all they have to do is follow PRC regulations. Literally why FB and Google had internal projects to engineer compliant products to re-enter PRC market, but killed due to internal dissent. The narrative that PRC bans US platforms was always cope. Google pulled out because they didn't like dissidents being hacked, when operationally and eventually they sh…

But China actively blocks all US social media companies, right? The social media companies aren't the ones blocking Chinese users from joining. They just don't operate any offices in China.

They aren't prevented from entering the market but their existing products are banned because they don't abide by PRC censorship and data sharing requirements.

The post you are replying to explains this in detail.

Google, Facebook, etc all either had products in China or planned products in China but all voluntarily withdrew for various reasons. I imagine low market share vs domestic services was probably the largest reason.

Remember that as soon as you release a service in the West a Chinese clone will spring forth almost instantly. That clone will be much more Chinese then your eventual adaption and as such will you likely struggle to compete with it. Worse yet said clone is probably built by either Alibaba or Tencent both of which have armies of extremely smart engineers, near unlimited cash to sink into new ventures and a near duopoly on the ecosystems necessary to thrive in China.

At the end of the day the Chinese market is just incredibly tough and Western companies (perhaps rightly) don't think it's worth the effort.

Re: Senate Bill to Ban TikTok

#227

Post by realce »

atlasunshrugged wrote: post #196
hitpointdrew wrote: post #165

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's MUCH WORSE than the Patriot act. This bill is absolutely horrific. And calling it at bill to "ban TikTok" is extremely disingenuous as it egregiously goes well beyond that.

Why? It seems focused on only applications/products from a few countries of concern

You can't read books from Eurasia, it's against the law.

Re: Senate Bill to Ban TikTok

#228

Post by korroziya »

withinboredom wrote: post #164

Maybe someone will scroll all the way down to this comment. Probably not. For half a decade, I have lived outside of the US, and I've watched as it has fallen to shit in slow motion. I make a decent chunk of income in USD and this terrifies me... but this. This move saddens me. There are only so many hours that congress has to make real decisions ... and this, this is what they spent their time on? Talking about how…

[flagged]

Re: Senate Bill to Ban TikTok

#229

Post by etrautmann »

withinboredom wrote: post #187
threeseed wrote: post #183

Earlier quoted context omitted.

a) The government can do more than one thing at a time. b) There is zero appetite from the GOP for gun control. Until that changes the status quo persists. c) Information about US citizens (which can be used to manipulate them) being handed over to the Chinese government is something that the government should be concerned about.

I mean, you can buy that information for 'practically free' (amortized per person), you don't need an app for that.

It's not just the data, it's bidirectional. The concern is that by adjusting the algorithm they can influence the population (e.g. to make math and science perceived as uncool). Not sure how seriously to take that but in principle it seems like a large vulnerability that is challenging to close off without actions like what we're seeing.

Re: Senate Bill to Ban TikTok

#230

Post by philsnow »

natdempk wrote: post #170
poulsbohemian wrote: post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>It is mind boggling, and at the same time not surprising at all, that China is enforcing a humane policy to protect its children when we are not willing to do the same. By whose standards? The United States has never been an ideologically cohesive nation outside some basic principles of representative democracy - and even those have been challenged at moments in our history. The moment you get beyond the basics of a…

We need to move past the "TikTok = people dancing" stage of discussion. TikTok has expanded to be the dominant short form video platform for every interest, niche, and micro niche you can imagine that exists, and even ones you can't imagine. Please anyone reading this comment replace "TikTok = people dancing" with "TikTok = feed + discovery for short form video tailored to your specific interests no matter how niche"…

> feed + discovery for short form video tailored to your specific interests no matter how niche

It is this and also that young people are especially malleable, so content that they see can cause long-term psychological and emotional damage, or--more pertinently to governments' interests--can introduce ideological change that they don't control.

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