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The silent struggles of workers with ADHD

bbc.com

221–230 of 318 posts

Re: The silent struggles of workers with ADHD

#221

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are non-amphetamine medications available now that might work for your brother, and cognitive-behavioural therapy can really help too.

Any recommendations? I took one that you take at night. It slightly improved my focus during day. But would leave me sleepy all day. Even with taking it before bed.

I’m not affiliated with these guys at all, and I can’t speak to the long-term effects, but I tried this “flow state” powder mix[1] on a whim and it actually kind of works. It might be placebo but a scoop in the morning after a small cup of coffee has me focusing better than previously.

It’s definitely a much more subtle effect vs actual medication.

[1]https://promixnutrition.com/products/flow-state

Re: The silent struggles of workers with ADHD

#222

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Typical use of 'narcotics' means opiates and similar drugs (narc = sleep), and not amphetamines.

It could be that the person is not from the west and/or not a native english speaker. And unnecessary specific example goes here. In russian language, every (99% of the time, illegal) drug that is associated with abuse is called a narcotic (including cannabis). There isn't a russian language equivalent word for "drugs", "drugs" is a synonym for "narcotics" there. There is "medicine" and there is "drug"/"narcotic". Wh…

Even here in the UK, we don't call medicine 'drugs' - when someone refers to drugs here they nearly only mean illegal drugs.

As school kids we had the same thought about 'drug stores' - and I even found it amusing when a Pharmacy/beauty shop opened called 'Superdrug' - seemed such an odd turn of phrase to someone who had only heard of drugs as the illegal and dangerous things...

Re: The silent struggles of workers with ADHD

#223

Glad to see this article focus on more than distractibility. In my mid twenties I struggled with managing impulsive behavior. I would regularly say inappropriate things in meetings, unable to understand why I said what I said. After a lot of work in therapy and many different types and dosages of medications, I'm in a better spot. I've turned what was a problem into something I'm proud of. Through putting my foot in…

Are you me? I had no idea multiple people used jokes to hide their outbursts. I definitely have made some jokes that made me think "that was way too edgy for this environment, why did I say that?", but thankfully none have gone over poorly... yet.

Re: The silent struggles of workers with ADHD

#224
post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Strattera (atomoxetine) is a commonly used SNRI developed for adhd. I personally had a very bad reaction to it, but it allegedly helps some people. Guanfacine is another, I haven't tried it, so I can't give any first hand experience. I think it's used more to help blood pressure & agitation that can come up with adhd Welbutrin is also commonly used.

I had a bad experience with Strattera too, and now I'm on Vyvanse, which is an amphetamine but not the worst. I'm still on a low dose but not bad. I'm feeling some improvements and thinking about some specialized therapy.

Vyvanse is just DextroAmphetamine once processed in your body - AKA Speed in terms of slang drug usage. AFAIK, it’s just that no matter what the dosage, the drug dispenses itself/processes in your body based on a few factors, & is always that amount being continuously released over time.

I guess if you’re arguing (I know you are not, I am just putting unsolicited info out) in terms of what amphetamines are the worst… methamphetamine, pharmaceutical grade & at the equivalent therapeutical dosage for ADHD symptoms - which is something like 5mg-15mg max, & potentially up to 45mg for the very worst cases of chronic fatigue syndrome - is actually less hard than others on your body from a neurotoxicity standpoint, as well as on your vascular system in general. You can also very easily take naps on it (at those dosages).

It just happens to be highly addictive because of the whole blood brain barrier crossing thing. & then once you get out of that therapeutic dosage into “recreational/abusive” dosages… that is when meth is very bad.

So if you don’t have an addictive personality & can control yourself, prescribed methamphetamine (Desoxyn, not sure if a generic exists) is otherwise the safest treatment for ADHD if expected to be consistently on it for decades/life.

I believe it then goes

DextroAmphetamine

50:50 Racemic Amphetamine (Evekeo may be brand for this in US?)

Adderall (which is 3:1)

From least harm on your body to most harm over time.

My doc & I for the time being found Vyvanse was nearly perfect for me, & essentially perfected it by adding a small (10mg) instant-release DextroAmphetamine (Zenzedi, specifically branded - seems to be the most perfected formulation in the US pharmacy system as of now.) along with it to kickstart things in the morning. There are also times when I’m scripted to just take multiple 10mg IRs a day instead of the entire Vyvanse dosages for other medical reasons & potential need to rest. Mentioning rest: a non-negligible portion of people on an otherwise perfectly working Vyvanse dosage seem to need a mild-moderate sleep aid towards the end of the day. & where you may think that just indicates a lowering of the dosage, that is mostly wrong & ruins the “otherwise perfectly working” aspect.

I only mention all of this unsolicited advice/information as I’ve for far too long now, & with medical practitioners in family, seen anecdote after anecdote of people prescribed Adderall (IR or ER) eventually trying pure DextroAmphetamine IR (previously known as Dexedrine, now Zenzedi, & of course generic) - or ER like Vyvanse - & finding that it works much, much better than Adderall. Typically from a standpoint of less irritability/jitteryness/emotional blunting & more focus & ability to change task to task if needed. For whatever reason though (obviously, industry money slushing around related), Adderall is prescribed at a ridiculously higher rate than pure DextroAmphetamine. There’s also a decent amount of people who’ve only heard the term Adderall & don’t know DextroAmphetamine exists. Finally, that in some rare cases, meth is genuinely the correct drug for treatment. I honestly think if you’re being prescribed an amphetamine, doctors should have to inform you of all amphetamine based medication able to be prescribed for your condition & the potentially pros/cons comparisons - but I am nobody in this world.

Re: The silent struggles of workers with ADHD

#225
post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I went in an ADHD rabbit hole a week ago. I never considered my self suffering from it, my quirks were individual parts of my character! But now I highly suspect I have it. I lose focus all the time. For example, Going from doing laundry, to gathering dishes, and bringing out trash without finishing one of them. Or I can't read long articles with topics that are important for me but don't tickle one of my interests.…

I suspect a lot of ADHD people become programmers because software can compliment the countless fleeting interests we have. That said, programming as a career is still more challenging to us because non-ADHD programmers are more likely to succeed with numerous responsibilities and more complex and boring tasks. The more an ADHD programmer advances, the fewer of his immediate peers will have ADHD. This is one of the r…

Mostly agree. I really floundered when I got promoted to senior. Then got diagnosed. Meds and exercise help. Or at least I think they do. Hard to gauge progress without a job.

Re: The silent struggles of workers with ADHD

#226

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Any recommendations? I took one that you take at night. It slightly improved my focus during day. But would leave me sleepy all day. Even with taking it before bed.

Wellbutrin worked wonders for me. Works immediately, similar to amphetamines and is easy to obtain legitimately.

> is easy to obtain legitimately.

Depends on the country. In Europe, it's not so easy. In the UK, the last I checked, it was contraindicated for long-term use, meaning it could be used for smoking cessation but not for long-term ADHD treatment.

> similar to amphetamines

Wellbutrin has a very different mechanism of action, and a different effectiveness profile. I wouldn't say it's "similar to amphetamines" in any clinical sense.

Re: The silent struggles of workers with ADHD

#227

This article feels like it was written for my brother. He's been fired, sequentially, 4 times in roles of progressively narrower scope/salary. From project manager (80k+) at a large NYC-BASED structured-cabling company to a billing coordinator position ( It makes me want to put my head into a pillow and scream because he's an intelligent, sociable and kind person but his mind just sits so juxtaposed from what these c…

I'm sorry to hear that your brother has been turned off by his childhood experience with the meds. I had a similar experience. I was on Ritalin from the time I was ~7 until I graduated from high school. When I graduated I thought "great! I don't have to take that shit anymore!"... and I proceeded to waste the next ~12 years of my life. Going back on meds at ~30 was completely transformative--like waking up from a bad dream.

Even if he won't take the meds, he could still benefit from one of the many ADHD workbooks that are out there. I was initially skeptical, but I finally bought one[0] and worked through it, and I found it to be really helpful. I had always thought of my ADHD as one problem (I just can't attention!), but the workbook breaks it down into distinct sub-problems, one of which (poor mental flexibility) I honestly hadn't even recognized as a problem until I read the book. For me, breaking down the problem has made it easier to deal with.

Another thing that might help him out is journaling. I am still occasionally able to go weeks without a conscious awareness that ADHD is wreaking havoc in my life--but not when I'm journaling. By setting aside a little time each night to A) reflect on my values and B) take stock of the day, the feedback loop goes from days/weeks down to 24 hours, which makes it much, much easier to prevent my disease from having a negative impact on me and my loved ones.

Sorry for all the unsolicited advice. You sound like a good brother, and I figured this might help. Godspeed.

[0]https://www.amazon.com/Thriving-Adult-ADHD-Strengthen-Functi...

Re: The silent struggles of workers with ADHD

#228
I had an interesting journey with my ADHD, unlike most of the other people I've met who had it.

I was diagnosed fairly young (some time Once I left for college though, my life fell apart. I had no one to make sure I was on a schedule and taking my meds. I basically quit taking my meds, struggled to attend class & do assignments, and nearly flunked out of school a couple times.

I loathed myself. I thought "what good am I, if I can't function without the pills?" This was a toxic mindset, but I stuck to it through college and for a few years after. I think the only thing that saved me from total ruin was the fact that I found tech work so engaging that it never felt like a chore to me, and I was able to succeed despite my false start.

Being off the meds forced me to develop a lot of coping mechanisms I never learned as a kid. I externalized a lot of my executive function into reminders, calendars, and habits. I cut away all unnecessary tedium in my life. I became addicted to coffee, because (surprise!) stimulants helped my symptoms & dealing with life in the workforce.

About a year ago though, I decided to start on meds again. They aren't a silver bullet for me of course (the real silver bullet all along was having my mom's structure and support in my life), but they help a lot and I can notice the difference. It's so much easier to deal with necessary tedium when I have the meds in my toolbox again. I don't feel the need to be on them 24/7 (probably a good thing), but it's nice to know I can take them and not feel shame about it anymore.

Re: The silent struggles of workers with ADHD

#229
post #94
post #49

Can people stop a second with ADHD-as-a-disease? It’s the society that’s sick!! Prevalence in the US is 10% of the general population. Many of whom have active social lives and high paying jobs. Those people play the game they have been told to play. Corporate bullshit, boring tasks, endless meetings, and then they complain to their doctors they don’t feel like it fits. Something’s afoot. and the doctors say: “right…

“Imagine a society that subjects people to conditions that make them terribly unhappy then gives them the drugs to take away their unhappiness. Science fiction It is already happening to some extent in our own society. Instead of removing the conditions that make people depressed modern society gives them antidepressant drugs. In effect antidepressants are a means of modifying an individual's internal state in such a…

Antidepressants don't "make you happy", alcohol does that. Antidepressants are intended to give you the ability to get out of bed in the morning.

If depression was just caused by inhumane work environments, why do Americans have it and not Bangladeshi T-shirt makers?

Re: The silent struggles of workers with ADHD

#230
post #75

As an adult who feels like they identify with these characteristics, it is hard to know when to try to get help, or whether you are just seeing what you want to see and looking for an excuse. I have always shied away from seeking an adult ADHD diagnosis, partly because of prideful denial (not wanting to acknowledge that there might be something wrong with me), and partly because I have no faith in the NHS giving a sh…

Getting an adult ADHD diagnosis on the NHS is very hard and time consuming. Most people in the UK get a private diagnosis - there are many online websites now that will diagnose you completely over zoom in 1 hour. In the US it's even easier. There is a profit motive in the US to get people onto lifetime medication, and many websites for online diagnosis and delivery. If you have private insurance, it's easy - just se…

> Over the long term, you will suffer some side effects - worse sleep, tolerance builds up, and your ADHD symptoms will likely get much worse if you stop medication.

Nothing like this should happen. They will improve your sleep and your symptoms will get better over time without medication.

If you get tolerance, take magnesium and NAC.

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