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Intel and the $1.5T chip industry meltdown

economist.com

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Re: Intel and the $1.5T chip industry meltdown

#221

Post by iancmceachern »

It's the people, the talent, the knowledge that drives any industry like this.

The US government, US, we, gave Intel and some other companies a huge sum of money to stay awesome.

Then they announce huge layoffs to get rid of a lot of thr talent, people, heart of their business.

So, wouldn't we have been better off as a society of we had just offered thT CHIPs money as a startup find and asked a bunch or people from Intel to leave and build new semi companies using this fund?

In the end the meteic for success of the CHIPs program in the short term should be number of people working in semi in the US. How did we dedicate money and resources to this thing of national importance and end up with fewer experts working on it?

Money is the root of all evil, power corrupts us all.

Re: Intel and the $1.5T chip industry meltdown

#222

Post by chatterhead »

1) We need chip manufacturing to be nationalized in the USA - if it's that important to national security we don't need to leave it in the hands of private industry.

2) Taiwan is not China. We are going to break the rest of China up because Xi decided to consolidate power instead of steward the distributed power he inherited.

3) The USA isn't in trouble at all; we will expand our industries, inflate our currency and strengthen it so demand globally grows as Russia, EU and China falter.

4) China took HK almost 3 decades early so why should anyone believe their word on territorial respect.

Re: Intel and the $1.5T chip industry meltdown

#223

Post by Huh1337 »

whimsicalism wrote: post #220
Huh1337 wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

These people would rather be dead than under Russian rule. Why would 97% of them support continuing defense if not? And don't forget that when Russians still thought they're going to win, they brought in mobile crematoriums and started filtrating people and sending them off to Siberia if not torturing and murdering them. It was never a question of "no war and survive" VS "die in war" - but "no war, die anyways" VS "w…

> These people would rather be dead than under Russian rule. Why would 97% of them support continuing defense if not? Certainly this is not true of Crimea, where people have been independently polled by Western NGOs and the weight of the evidence is they want to be part of Russia. > It was never a question of "no war and survive" VS "die in war" - but "no war, die anyways" VS "war, possibly survive" Your thesis is th…

> Certainly this is not true of Crimea, where people have been independently polled by Western NGOs and the weight of the evidence is they want to be part of Russia.

You mean "a very slightly bigger half of them", right? And that was before all this shit went down and Russians started to mobilize them. I wonder how they feel now, don't you?

> Your thesis is that if Russia won they would murder a substantial %-ge of the population in mobile crematoriums?

Nah, my thesis is that Russia started with it immediately.

Re: Intel and the $1.5T chip industry meltdown

#224

Post by whimsicalism »

spamizbad wrote: post #155
bryanlarsen wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Xi is one of the most rational actors on the world stage. Machiavellian rational, but rational. I recommend the Economist's podcast series on him.

Is he? I feel like everyone said this about Putin and now the narrative has changed and he's an unstable madman whose going to launch a nuke if he loses too badly in his war. Like many politicians, Xi is ruthlessly self-interested. His actions that allow him to consolidate power aren't necessarily in the best interests of China.

> now the narrative has changed and he's an unstable madman whose going to launch a nuke if he loses too badly in his war.

Yes, this sort of narrative plays a lot better when describing someone you're actively at war with. Along with the fact that you are always winning the war. Ukraine has been winning the war with Russia for about 9 months now, according to the media.

Re: Intel and the $1.5T chip industry meltdown

#225

Post by Maursault »

Isinlor wrote: post #22

China already declared that it will use force in Taiwan if "possibilities for a peaceful reunification should be completely exhausted". From Chinese Anti-Secession Law: Article 8: In the event that the "Taiwan independence" secessionist forces should act under any name or by any means to cause the fact of Taiwan's secession from China, or that major incidents entailing Taiwan's secession from China should occur, or t…

> by any means to cause the fact of Taiwan's secession from China, or that major incidents entailing Taiwan's secession from China should occur,

The irony here is that it is in fact China that seceded from Taiwan.

Re: Intel and the $1.5T chip industry meltdown

#226

Post by whimsicalism »

Huh1337 wrote: post #223
whimsicalism wrote: post #220

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> These people would rather be dead than under Russian rule. Why would 97% of them support continuing defense if not? Certainly this is not true of Crimea, where people have been independently polled by Western NGOs and the weight of the evidence is they want to be part of Russia. > It was never a question of "no war and survive" VS "die in war" - but "no war, die anyways" VS "war, possibly survive" Your thesis is th…

> Certainly this is not true of Crimea, where people have been independently polled by Western NGOs and the weight of the evidence is they want to be part of Russia. You mean "a very slightly bigger half of them", right? And that was before all this shit went down and Russians started to mobilize them. I wonder how they feel now, don't you? > Your thesis is that if Russia won they would murder a substantial %-ge of t…

> You mean "a very slightly bigger half of them", right?

Closer to 83% but I agree it has probably trended substantially downward in recent months.

> Nah, my thesis is that Russia started with it immediately.

Why didn't they do this mass murder in Crimea or Donetsk once they got effective control?

Re: Intel and the $1.5T chip industry meltdown

#227

Post by Huh1337 »

whimsicalism wrote: post #226
Huh1337 wrote: post #223

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Certainly this is not true of Crimea, where people have been independently polled by Western NGOs and the weight of the evidence is they want to be part of Russia. You mean "a very slightly bigger half of them", right? And that was before all this shit went down and Russians started to mobilize them. I wonder how they feel now, don't you? > Your thesis is that if Russia won they would murder a substantial %-ge of t…

> You mean "a very slightly bigger half of them", right? Closer to 83% but I agree it has probably trended substantially downward in recent months. > Nah, my thesis is that Russia started with it immediately. Why didn't they do this mass murder in Crimea or Donetsk once they got effective control?

Seems like we just don't know much about what they did there, yet. Let's see how many mass graves are there once Ukraine gets the land back. Are you going to put your money on it being 0? Or maybe they simply planned the genocide for later, you never know with these crazy dictators.

Re: Intel and the $1.5T chip industry meltdown

#228

Post by gdy »

computerfriend wrote: post #112
gdy wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"EU was caught off guard by Russia" You've got to be kidding me. Putin had been warning West since the Munich speech in 2007. [0] [0] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2007_Munich_speech_of_Vladim...

And yet, they were caught off guard.

No, they weren't.

Re: Intel and the $1.5T chip industry meltdown

#229

Post by spaceman_2020 »

ouid wrote: post #176
Isinlor wrote: post #22

China already declared that it will use force in Taiwan if "possibilities for a peaceful reunification should be completely exhausted". From Chinese Anti-Secession Law: Article 8: In the event that the "Taiwan independence" secessionist forces should act under any name or by any means to cause the fact of Taiwan's secession from China, or that major incidents entailing Taiwan's secession from China should occur, or t…

Nah, fuck it. We're allowed to commit to war too. Xi Jingping is a tyrannical insane dictator and his successor will be worse. He needs to be stood up to, and no one is in a better position to do that than the US.

> Xi Jingping is a tyrannical insane dictator

His people like him. Who are we to decide whether he is “tyrannical” or “insane”?

The west has this constant undercurrent of “we know what’s best for you” when talking about other countries and their leaders.

Its neither warranted nor welcome by the locals.

Re: Intel and the $1.5T chip industry meltdown

#230

Post by CoastalCoder »

iancmceachern wrote: post #221

It's the people, the talent, the knowledge that drives any industry like this. The US government, US, we, gave Intel and some other companies a huge sum of money to stay awesome. Then they announce huge layoffs to get rid of a lot of thr talent, people, heart of their business. So, wouldn't we have been better off as a society of we had just offered thT CHIPs money as a startup find and asked a bunch or people from I…

Targeted layoffs might be the best thing long-term.

From my limited perspective of having recently worked at Intel, they had a lot of dead weight. There was a lot of talent, but it was also diluted by a lot of management and bureaucracy.

I honestly don't know if layoffs are an effective solution to this, but IMHO they could definitely benefit from lower headcount and greater urgency.

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